Visiting San Francisco; SQL - Rental Flight?

Timmer

Timmer

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Timmer
I am a relatively new pilot and have yet to fly out of anywhere but my home airport. Next weekend I'm traveling up to San Francisco to visit my sister who lives a few minutes away from SQL. I'd love to take her on a flight around SF area, so my question is if anyone has any locations or tips on renting a plane on a one off....

It looks like most of the outfits there require checkouts, initiation fees, monthly dues, along with rental fees. That makes one very expensive single rental flight.

Any helpful advice is welcome.
 
Not sure about SQL, but pretty much only way to avoid the rental checkouts is to use OpenAirplane.
 
There is an OpenAirplane site at SQL. There is another at Reid (San Jose).

Neither are cheap. Reid in general is pretty reasonable, but that OpenAirplane site isn't. The San Carlos site has some nice planes, but I've never rented for them due to their prices.

Get on the phone, as most of the local places get asked about vacation rentals all the time, and the fees may be substantially different. You may be able to take along an instructor for a "discovery flight," as an alternative, and get around most of the fees.
 
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mtuomi said:
Not sure about SQL, but pretty much only way to avoid the rental checkouts is to use OpenAirplane.
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True. I don't mind a checkout flight anyway as it's a good time to have someone local show you around the airspace, but it's just joining a club with all the fees just for a single rental triples the cost of that rental.

There may not be any way around it but I thought I'd check along with see if anyone has recommendations for rental places at SQL to rent from or avoid :)
 
If you are going to fly at SQL, you definitely want a checkout of sorts, if only for the local procedures.

It's all too easy to blast into the very nearby Class B surface area, especially when on an extended left downwind for 12 (and that's the calm wind runway).

Noise abatement is, to say the least, nucking futs. And the instrument departure procedure can be found in the terminal procedures under "you gotta be ****ing me."

And you really, really, really want to know where the Cement Plant is. "Report at the cement plant" is the unofficial San Carlos motto (and one of the FBOs even sells T-shirts with that written on it). You'll hear it on almost every pattern entry.
 
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For one off, just take the CFI with you for a tour. You left seat, CFI right seat, her in the rear. You could let her fly left seat, but she wont be able to enjoy the flight as much.

SCFC does this all the time. You can even do it in one of their several R22s and R44s.
https://www.facebook.com/SanCarlosFlight

If you really want to give them a treat, do it in a PC-12 from Jato. ;)
http://jatoaviation.com/
 
MAKG1 said:
And the instrument departure procedure can be found in the terminal procedures under "you gotta be ****ing me."
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Take a look at the UNpublished one!

"Cherokee xxxxx, San Carlos Ground, cleared to the Half Moon Bay Airport. On departure, fly runway heading until past the diamond-shaped waterway. Then turn right heading 120. Keep your turn within two miles of the airport, for radar vectors to Woodside, direct Tails, direct. Maintain VFR conditions at or below 1,100 until crossing the Oakland 165 radial. Then climb and maintain 2,100. Expect 5,000 five minutes after departure. Norcal Departure Control frequency 135.65. Squawk xxxx."​

I screwed that up royally the one time I flew it, because I couldn't write fast enough, and once I had taken off, I found my notes too cryptic to decipher correctly. Fortunately, I knew enough to stay clear of the SFO final approach courses, but San Carlos Tower wasn't too happy with me! (I went to LiveATC.net after the flight and transcribed the clearance for future reference.)
 
Palmpilot said:
Take a look at the UNpublished one!
"Cherokee xxxxx, San Carlos Ground, cleared to the Half Moon Bay Airport. On departure, fly runway heading until past the diamond-shaped waterway. Then turn right heading 120. Keep your turn within two miles of the airport, for radar vectors to Woodside, direct Tails, direct. Maintain VFR conditions at or below 1,100 until crossing the Oakland 165 radial. Then climb and maintain 2,100. Expect 5,000 five minutes after departure. Norcal Departure Control frequency 135.65. Squawk xxxx."​
Click to expand...

​
That sounds an awful lot like the Woodside departure for 30 on the noise abatement procedure handout.

http://www.co.sanmateo.ca.us/vgn/images/portal/cit_609/119698171SQL.pdf
 
MAKG1 said:
And the instrument departure procedure can be found in the terminal procedures under "you gotta be ****ing me."
Click to expand...

Palmpilot said:
Take a look at the UNpublished one!

"Cherokee xxxxx, San Carlos Ground, cleared to the Half Moon Bay Airport. On departure, fly runway heading until past the diamond-shaped waterway. Then turn right heading 120. Keep your turn within two miles of the airport, for radar vectors to Woodside, direct Tails, direct. Maintain VFR conditions at or below 1,100 until crossing the Oakland 165 radial. Then climb and maintain 2,100. Expect 5,000 five minutes after departure. Norcal Departure Control frequency 135.65. Squawk xxxx."​
Click to expand...

I imagine MAKG is talking about this same departure procedure, because the only one published is for runway 12 (runway 30 is NA), and it's pretty straightforward:

DEPARTURE PROCEDURE: Rwy 12, climbing left turn via
heading 120° and SJC VOR/DME R-281 to SJC VOR/
DME before proceeding on course.

Which basically translates to "on departure, direct the VOR".

Do they actually use that off runway 12?

If the other quoted departure procedure from PalmPilot is used often, I wonder why they haven't requested a SID with that same routing. Would reduce the amount of times they have to say all that, AND undoubtedly reduce both readback errors and flight errors.
 
asicer said:
Even on a Steinberger Slough entry or crossing over 101? That sounds like a really weird pattern.

http://www.co.sanmateo.ca.us/vgn/images/portal/cit_609/119698171SQL.pdf
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Well, I've heard it inbound from Oakland. It wasn't a published entry, but rather a "base entry."

You probably won't hear it coming out of Class B or over the pass from Half Moon Bay.

Crossing over 101 is frowned upon unless over 1500 feet. The locals complain. And Class B goes down to 1500 right over the runway, so it's very tight. Many of us prefer to make other entries because of that. Class B gets out of the way a couple miles southeast of the airport.
 
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Never flown out of SQL, but many times from PAO when visiting from Europe. Almost any club there gives you a plane if you take a local instructor to sit with you as ballast. Adds $50-80 / hour to the cost. No joining etc needed.

First used http://www.wvfc.org/ - they also have many planes and instructors at SQL as I understand. But they do only one flight for you as a non-club member.

So I switched to https://www.advantage-aviation.com/

Bay Tours are great when visiting. Friendly supportive ATC. Easy even for beginners. Here's the first Google result that came up for Bay tours but search and there are many others: http://blog.mikedalrymple.com/2012/03/08/flying-the-bay-tour/
 
MAKG1 said:
Crossing over 101 is frowned upon unless over 1500 feet. The locals complain. And Class B goes down to 1500 right over the runway, so it's very tight. Many of us prefer to make other entries because of that. Class B gets out of the way a couple miles southeast of the airport.
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Odd that the noise abatement procedure recommends something that's frowned upon. However, the diagram says the neighbors under the midfield overhead entry don't mind. Just don't stray left or right :)

What entry do you make coming from KHAF?
 
Palmpilot said:
"Cherokee xxxxx, San Carlos Ground, cleared to the Half Moon Bay Airport. On departure, fly runway heading until past the diamond-shaped waterway. Then turn right heading 120. Keep your turn within two miles of the airport, for radar vectors to Woodside, direct Tails, direct. Maintain VFR conditions at or below 1,100 until crossing the Oakland 165 radial. Then climb and maintain 2,100. Expect 5,000 five minutes after departure. Norcal Departure Control frequency 135.65. Squawk xxxx
Click to expand...

Ahh, love that one. Flown it many times, but I was always headed east. Great fun heading out of SQL at night and listening to all the International arrivals into SFO.
 
yhuubert said:
Never flown out of SQL, but many times from PAO when visiting from Europe. Almost any club there gives you a plane if you take a local instructor to sit with you as ballast. Adds $50-80 / hour to the cost. No joining etc needed.

First used http://www.wvfc.org/ - they also have many planes and instructors at SQL as I understand. But they do only one flight for you as a non-club member.

So I switched to https://www.advantage-aviation.com/

Bay Tours are great when visiting. Friendly supportive ATC. Easy even for beginners. Here's the first Google result that came up for Bay tours but search and there are many others: http://blog.mikedalrymple.com/2012/03/08/flying-the-bay-tour/
Click to expand...

Thanks. Palo Alto looks close by, too. I'll check that out.
 
asicer said:
Odd that the noise abatement procedure recommends something that's frowned upon. However, the diagram says the neighbors under the midfield overhead entry don't mind. Just don't stray left or right :)

What entry do you make coming from KHAF?
Click to expand...

I go to Palo Alto….

They don't like low altitude crossings over 101 either, but Class B is a whole lot higher.

The problem with SQL is that there are too many billionaires around there. One ***hole has is headquarters directly underneath the left base for 12.
 
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asicer said:
What entry do you make coming from KHAF?
Click to expand...

MAKG1 said:
I go to Palo Alto….
Click to expand...

That sounds nuts. So today being a slow day at work, I pulled up the KSQL liveatc archive for Saturday morning (thank goodness for silence truncation tools). Not counting the GPS Zulu approach, there were 2 straight ins, 2 right base report the cement plant, 3 make right traffic on the KNBR 45 and 6 cross overhead report midfield for right traffic on 30. Sounds like crossing the 101 is pretty popular over there.
 
asicer said:
That sounds nuts. So today being a slow day at work, I pulled up the KSQL liveatc archive for Saturday morning (thank goodness for silence truncation tools). Not counting the GPS Zulu approach, there were 2 straight ins, 2 right base report the cement plant, 3 make right traffic on the KNBR 45 and 6 cross overhead report midfield for right traffic on 30. Sounds like crossing the 101 is pretty popular over there.
Click to expand...

It might be.

There are constant complaints in the local newspapers in Redwood City about the noise. Mostly, they blame it on Surf Air, but those guys aren't the loud ones.
 
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