The old man has a rant...

Three Finger, I am going to regret this I know. Several weeks ago I got involved in a discussion here about instructors. I had the gall to suggest that the CFI rating did not come with a cape and tights. Well I was flamed pretty good.
I would humbly suggest you tread carefully here saying anything critical of CFI's and especially young CFI's. The conventional wisdom is that it is normal to take 50 yours to solo and 100 hours or more to take the private test. And none of this is due to poor instructing. Good luck and keep your flame suit handy.

Ronnie

I still have my NOMEX from the service. :D And I think I was asking a question rather than making a statement. But I could have gone further. I never asked the guy how many hours he had, which was irrelevant, he was a CFI and authorized to conduct the BFR. But I have always understood that a BFR was a review not a pass/fail or a "gotcha" type of encounter, which is what this tool tried to make it.
 
I still have my NOMEX from the service. :D And I think I was asking a question rather than making a statement. But I could have gone further. I never asked the guy how many hours he had, which was irrelevant, he was a CFI and authorized to conduct the BFR. But I have always understood that a BFR was a review not a pass/fail or a "gotcha" type of encounter, which is what this tool tried to make it.
There are fools in all walks of life. You found one -- shouldn't be too big of a surprise :)
 
There are fools in all walks of life. You found one -- shouldn't be too big of a surprise :)

You are correct. And I hope I didn't leave the impression that I judge the profession by one example. I have read posts by many CFIs here that are indicative of professional, logical minds. I guess I am used to an environment where marginal performance was quickly rooted out by the system.
 
No matter who thinks they are G-ds gift to aviation, and for whatever reason they have in their heads they hold that lofty position, the only true G-ds to aviation are the San Diego area Designated Pilot Examiners. If you do not believer me on that, just go and meet one of them, then ask them outright. They will confirm it either with words or actions.

When you depart from your audience with them, be sure to bow at the waist and walk backward away from them.

-John
 
No matter who thinks they are G-ds gift to aviation, and for whatever reason they have in their heads they hold that lofty position, the only true G-ds to aviation are the San Diego area Designated Pilot Examiners. If you do not believer me on that, just go and meet one of them, then ask them outright. They will confirm it either with words or actions.

When you depart from your audience with them, be sure to bow at the waist and walk backward away from them.

-John

I suspect there is a story there, but I will just be at peace with the fact that the only other rating I contemplate at this time is a seaplane rating, and I won't be doing that in CA. :nono:
 
I've said it before, a CG Herc has dropped me pumps when I was single handed, they did it acurately for PU and they all 3 started first pull; Gracias.
 
I've said it before, a CG Herc has dropped me pumps when I was single handed, they did it acurately for PU and they all 3 started first pull; Gracias.

Can't say I deserve the credit.....but if I'm ever in your neck of the woods I'll drink a beer for them!!! :thumbsup:
 
Don't like your CFI? Find another one! I've fired a couple of 'em. Seek and you will find.

Dave

+1.

Not all pilots meet the standard, and not all CFI's meet theirs either. You hire them, you pay them to do a job to your satisfaction, and you can fire them if they don't meet expectations. A low-time CFI is just the same as a low-time PP - it only means they meet the absolute minimum experience requirements that the government will accept to pass at the bottom of the class.

Please do not mistake this statement for any kind of permission to "CFI shop" until you find one that is willing to sign off on a wink and nod - but you do have the authority to tell a young whippersnapper (and yes I'm old enough to call 'em as I see 'em) when to get naked and climb a tree if they are off-base. It's your dollar and your ticket.
 
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+1.

Not all pilots meet the standard, and not all CFI's meet theirs either. You hire them, you pay them to do a job to your satisfaction, and you can fire them if they don't meet expectations.

To a point. The relationship between a student and an instructor is a partnership. You're not hiring someone to paint your house.

You need to find an instructor that you'd like to enter in a partnership with and you must understand there will be times of frustration.

The moment a student tries to abuse me -- I drop them. Thankfully I've only had to do that once.
 
To a point. The relationship between a student and an instructor is a partnership. You're not hiring someone to paint your house.

You need to find an instructor that you'd like to enter in a partnership with and you must understand there will be times of frustration.

The moment a student tries to abuse me -- I drop them. Thankfully I've only had to do that once.

Granted - it goes both ways. There are students looking for that same "wink and a nod" to write a check and get their way in life, and you get to drop them too, as you should.

I work in a very demanding sector of engineering where a mistake on my part (or my customers) can mean not only a handful of dead people but a whole lot of environmental damage - and I have walked away from jobs that would have put a lot of money in my pocket because I was not comfortable with the situation as a whole and the attitude the customer brought to the transaction. CFI's and students (both of them) need to exercise this same filter on any interaction between them. It is unfortunate that most people this day and age do not have the maturity to realize what they are playing with.
 
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He asked what I was doing and when I told him he loftily told me "Well OK, but if you move to bigger planes you will need to follow the checklist exactly." I laughed, and told him I had 5800 hours in C130s..and asked how many he had in four engined transports. After that there wasn't anything I could do with out a sigh or small meaningless comment.

I love that reply :rofl: Did it humble him? Exactly how young was he? 5800 in C-130's= please teach me (if I were the CFI) some stuff as well! I'd think it would be common sense not to belittle any pilot that looks the same age or older at just first glace.

Grey hair generally= Experience.

To date I have only met nine pilots with grey hair. Combined they have more years of varied flying experience than a 40 year old has had of life! One was (passed away this past feb) a CFI with all the bells and whistles (gliders,airship,balloon,heli,ultralights, you name it, he had it!). He was easily aggravated by CFI's from the local school and how they ignored right-of-way. He landed in the grass after a 172 flew in above him and landed long. I drove him and his car over to the FBO (90yr old man can't exactly walk a mile+ in June) and he talked to the cfi. The CFI told him to,"read the f***in' FAR's and use your hearing aid to hear us when we say we are on final!" That CFI was my second CFI, only 21, 500~ hours all ASEL. Obviously my CFI doesn't know student pilot stuff...like right-of-way.

Not all are like this. Personalities can't be standardized.
 
The moment a student tries to abuse me -- I drop them. Thankfully I've only had to do that once.

Heh. I thought asking you to fly late at night for a week solid was pretty abusive, but you seem to not mind. ;) ;) ;)

(And I'll admit, I was ready to drop dead by Friday. Dang youth! Haha! You're really observant though and noticed when I started dragging ass. Especially in the mornings. LOL!)

Seriously though, I think Jack just got his first taste of the younger crowd that grew up with no winners or losers. Everyone gets a certificate of accomplishment even if they came in dead last.

Then they get a real job and either get depressed and surly -- or they believe they're God's gift to whatever the job is. It depends quite a bit on what the expectations were of the parents and how much the parents paid to kick start the kid's career. The less the kid worked for it, the cockier they tend to be.

(I chuckle at Facebook and Twitter posts by nieces and nephews sometimes. Phrases like "I had to work on the yard the WHOLE DAY, FML!" from them when I know the in-laws are paying most of their tuition and all of their room and board. Another goodie today was a just-graduated high-schooler who said, "I just figured out that they scheduled me to work four days straight! They're trying to kill me with work!" Yeah sweetie... Try seven days on for three or four years and get back to me. Haha...)

Doesn't really matter if the job is CFI or Software Engineer. It's a pattern. With job availability low, most sadly, haven't had much of a chance to ease into real life with a part-time job or two while in high-school or really even college. They rack up loans and the parents pay out of guilt or whatever.

I'd wager good money a 20-something CFI is still living with their parents at typical CFI pay scales and couldn't pick up another part time job if they tried. There's too many 50-something's working at gas stations in the "robust" economy the bankers and insurers gave us. That kid was also probably looking at something like five years of well below poverty-line pay. If he had moved out, it was probably with three or four roommates.

So I dunno Jack. I can't decide if they drive me nuts with their attitudes or if their attitudes are to be expected from the crap-sandwich a lot of them were fed. They didn't work jobs in high-school to score high on contrived standardized tests so they could "be accepted" by these huge money-making colleges who're just there to vacuum up as many guaranteed government student loans as they can along with big football advertising money. They get told all the way through that this is the path to a great life.

Then they hit reality.

And as Doc Bruce says, not all are afflicted by it.

I just had a heartbreaking phone call with a young man who's the son of a very old friend on Friday. His dad is a lawyer and knows little about computers or the computer biz. He asked if I'd take a call from his son who's weeks away from graduating with a Computer Science degree. I of course, said yes.

A few minutes into the call I asked the kid what he specializes in. What small projects and accomplishments he could list as experience when looking for jobs in IT. "

What are you into? Do you like coding, or Microsoft stuff, or Linux, or robotics? Anything like that?"

Nothing. He said he just had the degree.

I tried again, "Have you helped any organizations like your church or Scouts or anything maybe with their computers or building a website or something like that?"

Nothing. I backed off but now was curious, "What do you like or see yourself doing in the IT world?"

"I'd like to manage computers and networks, everything really."

I didn't even go into what his definition of "manage" was. When I asked specifics I'd get answers like, "Well, we did some programming."

"Java?" I'd ask.

"Yeah."

"Pretty typical base language to learn these days. Did you play around with any others?"

"Not really."

We chatted for a while about how the "jack of all trades" in IT is almost a thing of the past at all but the smallest companies since they can't afford to hire multiple professionals and that small places are a good way to start if you want to do it all.

I shared that most places are looking for initiative beyond the degree, projects managed and completed. A reason why the newcomer will help the organization.

A bit of discussion about how personality and working with a team are often strong points these days and the story of a recent failed hire who looked great on paper, knew his specialty cold, but refused to do anything outside of his specialty and cussed out a Director on a conference call when under stress. The kid laughed and at least seemed to get that part of it.

But I never felt I'd really gotten though to him on the whole concept of "pick a specialty NO ONE likes and get GOOD at it". It'll get you hired and working while you build relationships and look for opportunities to shift your focus and move to more entertaining and lucrative positions.

I think if I'd have related that my ascension up the IT career ladder started as a phone operator at a growing company and volunteering to cable out wiring closets on weekends and follow senior staff around writing down everything they had to teach or offer in my notebook, he wouldn't have felt it was beneath him. He just followed all society's rules and got a fancy CS degree, after all!

I just don't know where he thinks he'll be useful to anyone with just a CS sheepskin. He's probably headed for "surly 22 year old working at Starbucks" until he gets serious and cracks the books at night. The spoon feeding is about to end.

I recommended some reading material and hinted that he should get some projects under his belt, even if they were done for free or low cost for people he knows, just to prime the pump a bit. I shared that I used to have a tight budget but always bought at least one tech book on a topic that sounded interesting and spent a lot of time reading and experimenting in those inevitable "sit here and monitor this system overnight" jobs that begin any tech career.

Maybe his dad can use his contacts to shove a foot in the door somewhere. The kid really needs to see the complexity level of the systems, politics, and get a feel for how the degree is just base material. It was never enough to garner him a job in the industry.

Tough road ahead for him. In parting I promised I'd watch for entry-level stuff and he was welcome to keep in touch with any questions. I had great (cranky, old) mentors. I'm happy to "pay it forward", but he's got to try a few things and find something he likes first. Like it enough to get up and go into a bad-paying job for a few years doing it to get experience.

I also shared the few shops around here that are known for hiring grads. And I warned him that they're great places to get started but are also ultimately pretty poorly managed sweatshops. That's why they're always hiring. Not because of massive continuous business growth. Get in, learn under fire, and get out. That's how you play those places.

Sorry this ended up long, but the kid and his phone call seemed to nail this. That CFI got his ticket. He now knows he's "done" and just waiting for that big airline job to come along. He's God's gift to CFIs because everything his schools and his parents have ever told him says that he's a winner. No losers. No need to step up.

Sad.
 
Well, short and sweet (re. #1) - obviously, we have two guys who cannot fly together.
Life is too short to waste time over someone you think is full of himself - so don't use him again and forget about it...

I do not view the biennial as a PPL check ride - all over again... And I will dispute any CFI that believes it should be... It should be more about perceived needs or agreed on maneuvers - especially stuff you don't do every day... Whether that stuff is going into a Class B for the pilot who rarely does that - or it is cutting the critical engine during a simulated take-off-and-departure stall under the hood (Thanks Dave, that was a rush and I'm still grinning from ear to ear)

Plan the biennial with the CFI and fly the plan - if not fire him and hire another one...
 
I've flown with a number of young CFI's in the last 2 years. Probably six or so. No problem with their attitudes except for one and it was not related to your question.

I had more problems with older CFI's, again six or so, but no big deal. Just don't fly with them again.
 
Plenty of CFIs out there. I had a BFR with one a number of years ago who got all upset about my over square operation of the engine on the Arrow. Nevermind that the manual has power settings that are over square and the whole thing is an OWT anyway. Never flew with him again. No need.

Oh, and I have 350 hours in the log and I'm always looking to learn something new from anyone I fly with. I'll never know everything about this game.
 
I have never met a pilot or CFI that were full of themself or otherwise like the OP described. Hate to say it, but I have only see such in posts online such as POA. i.e. Nobody here can know anything more than the guy who has over 20k posts...:rofl:
 
The biennial flight review requirement is tailor-made for setting up conflict between CFIs and pilots. It takes a superior CFI to NOT tip the scales in favor of some sort of ****ing match, especially when a young guy is "checking out" an old guy.

I've found the perfect CFI for biennials, IMHO. He's an older guy who looked at my logbook, saw that I had flown every few days (for the last 18 years), had me do one approach to landing, laughed, said "Well, I guess you've done THIS before -- how'd you like to go see the King Ranch?" -- and off we went.

We then went off to see the King Ranch, had a terrifically enjoyable hour, and came back to land. Sure, I did some required or recommended maneuvers along the way, but it was pretty much by accident. THAT is a "flight review" between peers -- which is not what the OP received.

Luckily, there's no requirement to use that guy again. Fire him, and move on....
 
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