Tempest Oil Filter Mess

Discussion in 'Maintenance Bay' started by Cruzinchris, Jun 29, 2020.

  1. Computerjim

    Computerjim Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I just found out about the new ones with lube already on the gasket. Thank you for getting me updated. I bought a case of filters at a good price a while back, and just installed the last of them.
     
  2. timwinters

    timwinters Ejection Handle Pulled PoA Supporter

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    Common sense ain't so common, is it Tom?
     
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  3. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Ok you made look; it’s written right on the filter can;


    26F360C2-8F23-4F55-BAE8-A9C508819CD8.jpeg




    74740921-7F4E-4A1A-BEF4-A0E1ED9464F6.jpeg
     
  4. SoCal 182 Driver

    SoCal 182 Driver Pre-takeoff checklist

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    As someone once told me, "RTFM!"
     
  5. John B Reed

    John B Reed Filing Flight Plan

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  6. Domenick

    Domenick Line Up and Wait

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    Please see post #16.
     
  7. SoCal 182 Driver

    SoCal 182 Driver Pre-takeoff checklist

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    If you read the instructions, and don't lube the filter, a strap wrench shouldn't be necessary.
     
  8. Dan Thomas

    Dan Thomas Final Approach

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    Some filters are stuck just because the installer didn't use a torque wrench to tighten it to the spec. If you just use a plain wrench and do it up to what "feels about right" it will usually end up way too tight. It's the same thing that results in overtorqued bolts and nuts and the damage that does.
     
  9. SoCal 182 Driver

    SoCal 182 Driver Pre-takeoff checklist

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    And then there are those that lubricate Tempest filters...essentially gluing them in place!
     
  10. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man En-Route

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    I always TQ to the lower end of the spec. Use a breaker bar and short socket with no extension. Never had a problem.
     
  11. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    I know it's an old thread, but some gorilla put my LHE filter on at annual, a tempest, and apparently they followed the "just add oil or DC4 to convert this dry lubricant into a steel-welding epoxy mixture" directions. :mad2: My attempt to replace it this evening is cloaked in failure.

    Anyone have advanced ideas for one of these welded-on mofos? I have NO room to work, of course, and about a 15 degree swing for a band wrench. No direct vertical access to the nut on top, which is well rounded now. Barely enough room to get a strap wrench around. Vacuum pump in the way for a ratcheting wrench or other 'fat' box-end. I was thinking about a chain wrench as my next attempt, although it may be pliers and a blowtorch ala marcellus wallace. I ran out of advanced vocabulary and called it a night.


    I bent the ish out of my hangar neighbor's strap wrench trying to get this mofo off. I owe him a better wrench, as this chinesium harbor freight special didn't hold up.

    I'm trying to imagine how much torque it took to bend the stirrup like that. My calibrated cussing-elbow maxes at about 50# :D

    This experience may get me back to Champions.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Bell206

    Bell206 En-Route

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    Big vise grips to filter nut
    Oil filter pliers, or if room large channel locks to filter body (filter pliers my go to solution)
    The ol' screw driver/drift punched through filter trick. Just be sure you poke it through giving you room to loosen the filter.:rolleyes:
    Torch.............................not.
    Good luck.
     
  13. John B Reed

    John B Reed Filing Flight Plan

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    Sorry but you just have to keep trying. I find a strap metal wrench near the base of the filter helps. Even a 15 degree movement is good if you can get the thing moving. If not then something drastic like punching a screw driver through the cannister to move it. Otherwise perhaps calling tempest can give you better advise. We mechanics put the oil filter on finger tight then another full rotation puts the filter in the torque range, then torque with a torque wrench. If you can't do that then the 1-11'2 full rotation after you hand tighten it will put you in the range. Then do a leak check after you run the aircraft up for a few minutes. Otherwise, we all have been there and appreciate when people torque it correctly. I suggest you buy a tool that will enable you to torque it in the future, or go to a filter that is shorter. Ask you mechanic about it.
     
  14. texasclouds

    texasclouds Cleared for Takeoff

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    More cursing and bigger hammer usually works for me.
     
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  15. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

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    If you are still struggling, these might work.

    The last time used one of these I cut a V-belt and wrapped around the crankshaft pulley and wrapped this over the belt, on a 2010 Elantra to loosen the crankshaft pulley bolt.

    (Getting it all assembled with one hand was a PITA but the tool worked perfect locking the crankshaft with it and a prybar)
    upload_2021-2-3_7-52-48.png
     
  16. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Chain wrench. Crescent makes a narrow-handled one that should fit between my oil cooler and engine mount and allow me a little swinging room. I just need to break the sucker over, then I can go back to finesse and kind words :D

    I don't think I put this filter on, but will be very disappointed if it's my own handwriting greeting me. I really hope not. :D
     
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  17. PaulS

    PaulS Touchdown! Greaser!

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    If it doesn't budge, force it, if it breaks it needed to be fixed anyway.
     
  18. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    I love Beechcraft, but this design is some serious BS in general, and the engineer who came up with this combination needs his gonads booted in. oil cooler in foreground, breather line is already removed, engine mount and (behind the elastomeric mount) vacuum pump complete the "no access for you" storm.

    It's not obvious from the pic, but the oil filter is about 1/100" too wide to actually clear the oil cooler - engine mount passage. It has to get snaked around behind the mount, which means removing the alternate air tubes... argh.

    I am considering moving these turkeys to Challenger lifetime filters out of sourness for this job. Anyone use those things with any success? pireps seem thin on the internet at large.

    https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/challengerLifetime.php

    I guess you replace the innards every 5 years or 1200 hours. that's way better than my current "cuss every 25 hours for two straight evenings" regime. :D

    [​IMG]
     
  19. PaulS

    PaulS Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Designed before 3d modeling was readily available.
     
  20. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Wow, something that makes changing the Mooney oil filter look easy!
     
  21. Dan Thomas

    Dan Thomas Final Approach

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    Can you remove the bolts holding filter adapter to the engine and take the whole affair out to where you can work on it?
     
  22. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    Success, but not how I planned. :D

    Chain wrench didn't fit around the filter can, but now I have a new $50 doodad to menace people with. :D

    There was not enough room to maneuver the filter adapter out of the engine mount without hoisting the whole engine (cool idea though, thanks Dan! It got my brain juices flowing)

    In the end, it was a better band wrench, a rich, mouth-filling expletive, and 95% hernia-level force combined that got it to break over.. Napa makes one that makes the chinesium one look like a toy. Should you find yourself in the same predicament, I can recommend the Napa 77-3082. It gripped very well and worked in a very confined space to get that millimeter of break-over that was needed.

    ...and sadly, I discovered my own handwriting on the old filter, so I am that horrible epoxy-making gasket gorilla. Sigh. :mad2: I put the two replacements on dry, hopefully with better results in 25 hours. If not, the challenger "lifetime" filters may feature for the next round.

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    Thanks for being a sounding board for my frustrations and bungling. :D
     
  23. PaulS

    PaulS Touchdown! Greaser!

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  24. UngaWunga

    UngaWunga Pattern Altitude

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  25. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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  26. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach

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    I was thinking the exact same thing about my Aztec.

    And you have to do that twice on your airplane. Yikes!
     
  27. SoCal RV Flyer

    SoCal RV Flyer En-Route

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    Hard to see the logic in Tempest making their "oil-free" seal. On my IO-320-D1A, the filter spins on horizontally, and no matter how much you wipe the mating surface off, a little oil dribbles on there before you can spin the new filter in place...and instant adhesive creation, I suppose. I mean, you've got fresh oil at the ready for your change; not too difficult in grand scheme of things to smear a bit on the rubber seal.

    Champions for me. :) I'm liking Tempest spark plugs, though.

    Van's was thoughtful enough to provide a firewall recess in the kit to make access easy...I don't mean to rub it in, Schmookeeg! Your filters are a challenge for sure.

    IMG_3154.JPG
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2021
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  28. Robert W

    Robert W Filing Flight Plan

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    It just takes a little finesse!
     
  29. AKBill

    AKBill En-Route

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    You could always try a metric socket. 26 or 27mm is just a bit larger than 1 inch. I use Tempest and just tap the socket on never an issue
     
  30. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    That looks like a dream space to work in. :D
     
  31. SoCal RV Flyer

    SoCal RV Flyer En-Route

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    It's pretty good. That pic was from early in the build so there's a lot more wiring and plumbing to negotiate now!

    IMG_4767.jpg
     
  32. mondtster

    mondtster En-Route

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    More like "the engine manufacturer is not the same as the airframe manufacturer."

    Go work on heavy duty trucks for a while and you'll see the same kind of problem over and over again on vehicles designed and built long after everyone had 3d modeling.
     
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  33. LesGawlik

    LesGawlik Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I spent the better part of a day trying to get a filter unstuck. I had no one to blame but myself, since I put it on. I used every trick I knew of, from combo wrenched to strap wrenches to driving a screwdriver through it (what a mess!). I finally got out the chisels and cut a lip in what was left in order to spin it out. It was quite a struggle.
     
  34. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

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    Clearly not following the Beech procedure

    Step 1 remove cowl
    Step 2 remove oil cooler
    :D
     
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  35. LesGawlik

    LesGawlik Pre-takeoff checklist

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    How do you use those Challenger units? Do you remove and clean the filtering assembly at each oil change, or do you just drain the oil and refill?
     
  36. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    From my researches, you change the cartridge inside of the can every 5 years or 1250 hours, and just swap oil otherwise.

    I found a few internet threads about them, but more heat than light about their efficacy.

    I think they're too new to rely on an opinion from an engine shop

    I think it's really a $300 dice throw to try them out and see if they work.
     
  37. Tarheelpilot

    Tarheelpilot En-Route

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    They might cost 300 but the wager is much higher.
     
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  38. Ron Stowell

    Ron Stowell Pre-Flight

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    The Tempest filter instructions say DO NOT use lubricant OR use DC4 on the filter or mounting pad
     
  39. Skymac

    Skymac Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Never had this issue and I remove mine about 1 time ever 3 to 4 weeks for a 50 hour. Good strong hand tight is all you need.