Student Pilot certificates, in the new era of Sport Pilot

kath

kath

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Katherine
Hi, all,

CFI candidate trying to figure out the new Sport Pilot regs!

Back in the day, a Student Pilot certificate was also a medical, since you needed both to solo. But now, a student may or may not need a medical to solo and move forward, depending on what certificate they're going for (Sport or Private). So are Student Pilot certificates now separated from medicals? Does it depend on what certificate you're "going for", and how does that work, since a piece of paper (a student certificate) bestows privileges but doesn't know your intentions? I tried looking up regs, and the closest bit I could find was 61.89(d), which says:

(d) The holder of a student pilot certificate may act as pilot in command of an aircraft without holding a medical certificate issued under part 67 of this chapter provided the student pilot holds a valid U.S. driver's license, meets the requirements of §61.23(c)(3) [which seems to be about BasicMed?], and the operation is conducted consistent with the requirements of paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section and the conditions of §61.113(i) [which is about Private Pilot privileges?]. Where the requirements of paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section conflict with §61.113(i), a student pilot must comply with paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section.

...and this is in the section about student pilots, no matter whether they're going for SP or PP. The regs don't seem to distinguish; a student pilot is a student pilot.

So can someone help steer me through this?
Does a PP candidate still need a 3rd class (or BasicMed) + student cert before soloing? (I'm guessing yes, as suggested by the paragraph above)
Does a SP candidate need *only* a student cert before soloing? (I'm guessing yes, but I can't find this anywhere)
SP's, once they get their certificate, are restricted to LSA, so I'm assuming that someone with a student pilot cert (but "going for" the SP) would be similarly restricted when they solo? (I'm guessing yes, but again, can't find this in the regs anywhere.)
What if a student pilot changes her mind (SP <-> PP) and wants to solo in something else?

Thanks, all!
 
Student pilot certificates are now plastic and the student must apply for one via IACRA; any CFI, DPE, or inspector must verify the student's identity and submit the application.

A sport pilot seeker can only solo in an LSA and he or she does not need a medical -- 14 CFR 61.3(c)(2). Seeking a private pilot certificate or soloing a non-LSA requires a 3rd class medical just as it always has.
 
The new student plastic certificates do not double up as a medical certificate.
The AME can no longer issue a combined medical / student paper certificate on one piece of paper.

For sport pilot student or any initial student, get the certificate through IACRA.
Sport pilot, drivers license medical, any higher and he visits the AME for a Calss III or higher.

I do not believe you can go Basic Med without having had a Class type medical in the previous 10yrs. So that sport pilot wishing to transition to something other than LSA, needs to visit an AME for at least a regular Class 3 medical.
 
Sport pilot, student certificate through IACRA, drivers license medical.
No drivers license, no fly. I would need to do more research for students to young for a drivers license.

Going for private pilot, never held an FAA medical in the last 10 yrs. Basic Med is not an option, must see an AME for at least a Class 3.

Student sport pilot wanting to fly non-LSA, needs at least a Class 3, unless basic Med eligible. (Medical in last 10 yrs).
 
BillTIZ said:
I do not believe you can go Basic Med without having had a Class type medical in the previous 10yrs.
Click to expand...


Nope. Common misunderstanding.

You have to have had a medical after July 14, 2006. That’s almost 12 years. Next year it will be 13, and in 2026 you will only have needed the original medical certificate within the last 20 years.

The initial medical become more meaningless every year.
 
Half Fast said:
Nope. Common misunderstanding.

You have to have had a medical after July 14, 2006. That’s almost 12 years. Next year it will be 13, and in 2026 you will only have needed the original medical certificate within the last 20 years.

The initial medical become more meaningless every year.
Click to expand...
Absolutely right on the date. I think only sorta on the meaningless, since everyone will still need at least a 3rd class medical at least once. Yes, there is a theoretical group of pilots who, in 2026 will have had their last medical 20 years before, but since then, never flew except as sport pilot or passenger or never did BasicMed, etc, etc, but that's an incredibly small sample.
 
So for the young student pilot who wants to solo on their 16th birthday, there seems to be an interesting dilemma.

If they are pursuing PP and have their student certificate and medical, they can.

If they are pursuing SP and have their student certificate but no medical and have yet to get their driver license, they can’t.

Would this be correct?

Yes I know that most teenagers should be able to get a medical but if they can’t or for some other reason decide to go the SP route, their solo will be delayed until they get their DL. Correct?
 
Half Fast said:
Nope. Common misunderstanding.

You have to have had a medical after July 14, 2006. That’s almost 12 years. Next year it will be 13, and in 2026 you will only have needed the original medical certificate within the last 20 years.

The initial medical become more meaningless every year.
Click to expand...

I have heard and read theories that congress worded the law badly and had intended it to be a ten year requirement but messed up the language in the bill and mistakenly set a specific date. So when the FAA wrote the regulation to comply with the law they parroted the law’s language and ignored what they believed to be the intent. The law was passed on July 15, 2016 which is 10 years from the magic date so one can see where this belief might come from. I haven’t heard this theory confirmed by any official source though I know folks at the FAA who believe it. Still barring a rewrite by congress, the regulation is as the law demands and will stay that way. Which is not a bad thing.
 
SkyDog58 said:
So for the young student pilot who wants to solo on their 16th birthday, there seems to be an interesting dilemma.

If they are pursuing PP and have their student certificate and medical, they can.

If they are pursuing SP and have their student certificate but no medical and have yet to get their driver license, they can’t.

Would this be correct?

Yes I know that most teenagers should be able to get a medical but if they can’t or for some other reason decide to go the SP route, their solo will be delayed until they get their DL. Correct?
Click to expand...
That seems to be more or less correct. Remember that, in this case, the drivers license is not for identification (a government issued ID would be sufficient for that). It's to establish a medical baseline, low as it might be.

But I'm not sure how significant it is, practically speaking. Yes, I guess there will be a few kids over the age of 16 who would not be able to get a drivers license and can't get a third class medical, but who are not in the should be self-grounding anyway category.
 
Understand that the FAA has always wanted a pilot in command to have a certificate, even in the old days. While the student pilot certificate was for convenience purposes attached to the medical, it was really an independent concept. Even back then, you could get a student pilot certificate separate from the medical in certain cases.

The new "security" theatre just formally separates the two documents, but as far as the requirements go, nothing changed there.
 
SkyDog58 said:
I have heard and read theories that congress worded the law badly and had intended it to be a ten year requirement but messed up the language in the bill and mistakenly set a specific date. So when the FAA wrote the regulation to comply with the law they parroted the law’s language and ignored what they believed to be the intent. The law was passed on July 15, 2016 which is 10 years from the magic date so one can see where this belief might come from. I haven’t heard this theory confirmed by any official source though I know folks at the FAA who believe it. Still barring a rewrite by congress, the regulation is as the law demands and will stay that way. Which is not a bad thing.
Click to expand...

Why do you believe Congress intended a ten year requirement? What makes you thing the FAA ignored it? Requiring a 10 year look back would essentially require folks operating under BasicMed to get an FAA medical every ten years, which sort of negates the purpose of BasicMed.
 
The FAA doesn't get to write things that are contrary to laws based on what they think the "intent" is. That would not only be unconstitutional but subject the person doing the interpretation to possible criminal penalties. The FAA only gets to play those games on their own regulations, not enacted law.

I don't see how it was "intended" to be a rolling ten years. Congress is full of people who are EXPERTS at statutory construction. The enacted law says "ten years from date of enactment of this Act." It is clear that this is a FIXED date. It was viewed that the medicals from that date forward were sufficiently rigorous to be the foundation for basic med (or perhaps they felt that since the FAA and Congress screwed around for ten years coming up with the idea, that they should grant consideration for those waiting).
 
midlifeflyer said:
Absolutely right on the date. I think only sorta on the meaningless, since everyone will still need at least a 3rd class medical at least once. Yes, there is a theoretical group of pilots who, in 2026 will have had their last medical 20 years before, but since then, never flew except as sport pilot or passenger or never did BasicMed, etc, etc, but that's an incredibly small sample.
Click to expand...
My last medical was 2/2010 and I plan to continue as SP under my previous certificate/ratings
 
midlifeflyer said:
Yes, there is a theoretical group of pilots who, in 2026 will have had their last medical 20 years before, but since then, never flew except as sport pilot or passenger or never did BasicMed, etc, etc, but that's an incredibly small sample.
Click to expand...


Really? On this board alone, consider how often someone comes along who got his license when he was in his twenties, stopped flying while having career and kiddies, and now wants to resume in middle age. Or maybe took lessons back then and now wants to finish.

It may be a small sample, but it’s probably not as tiny as you think.

And regardless of sample size, it will be okay for someone who has gone 20 years or more since his 3rd class to go Basic Med. if that’s okay, why should anyone have to go through the 3rd class process?
 
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