Should I be scared of airplane ownership

[richas]

I owned for a few years and boy do I miss it. :-(

I bought a 58 Pacer PA-22/20 160HP for $19k. Looked rough but was solid with 200 hrs SMOH. Found a hangar 40 minutes out of town for $120 month. Found an A&P that would fly in for owner assisted annuals, $500. He signed off on all the other work I did.

I had to replace one cylinder (failed exhaust seat). Did it myself.

I believe this is about the best bang for the buck but you have to be mechanically inclined. Next time I will go experimental, maybe a Kitfox or an RV if there are more funds.

Sold it for around 23k$.

FWIW

Rich

 

[bradg33]

http://www.universalweather.com/blo...-own-and-operate-your-aircraft-is-a-bad-idea/

This is the "flight department company" trap, and it's really not an issue for an owner-operator unless there's something really, really odd about how the accounting is handled. The issue, in short, is when Company A (the "flight department company") owns the airplane and employs the pilots, then charges Company B (the parent company) to fly around Company B's employees, it sure looks like a charter operation (Company A is providing plane and pilot in exchange for money). This isn't how most owner-operator situations work.

 

[MickYoumans]

I know it sounds like 100 mile sis not a lot but its right through the heart of LA and most of it is on the 405 at rush hour.

I can appreciate what you are saying. Between 2012 and 2015 I worked a consulting job 130 miles from home. I was so greatful for my airplane to commute back and forth each week. My flight would be just under an hour compared to a drive that would be just over two hours and usually through rush hour traffic. I enjoyed my flights but the drives not so much. I fly a Cherokee which I think is one of the more affordable airplanes to own. I purchased my airplane with 2000 hours total on both airframe and engine with a very low initial cost because of the engine time. I bought it with the expectation to refurbish the airplane a little along as I had the money. I had a workable plan in place to refurbish the plane and the financial means to work my plan. Seven years later I now own a fully refurbished airplane including a new radio stack. I was able to fly the engine to 2308 before we did a major overhaul on it.

I love owning my own airplane and the freedom to fly as much as I like, whenever I like. But as others have stated above, do your homework and have a plan in place to cover maintenance, insurance, hangar/tie-down, annual inspections and upgrades. If you have properly planned ahead, ownership is pretty awesome. If not and you are not prepared, it could be a nightmare. If you are having to go deep in debt to purchase the airplane, I would suggest you stay in the club you are in and pay the hourly fees if they are reasonable.

 

[jd21476]

Buy a newer experimental (or build your own) and stop living in fear of high mx costs of certificated aircraft. I wish someone had told me this years ago and that I had taken their advice.

I would build my own but I dont have the time to do so.

 

[danhagan]

Just sold mine. Buyer should be good to go for awhile. Was relatively pain free until last year which was both mags new, HSI rebuild, ASI rebuild, to separate KX-155 failures and the minors battery, etc. Had about 11k in the avionics work. Annuals and other fees excluded.

On the positive side: that plane enabled my son and I to have some GREAT trips for the entire time he was at home prior to college (4 to Disneyland, several San Antonio, ABQ, Phoenix for hockey games, Yosemite, etc.)

 

[LDJones]

Why do people by boats? They are used in most parts of the country

How about if you sporadically employ a CFI, or a mentor pilot?

Not a problem. That’s your own training.

 

[Stephen Shore]

Owning an airplane makes no financial sense....but neither does owning a bass boat or hunting. My cost per pound for venison is probably equal at least to the finest Kobe beef that you could buy. Fishing? I own a $65K Bass Boat and I THROW THE BASS BACK!!!

I do own an airplane and it makes no more "nonsense" than my other passions hunting and fishing. But I work hard so that I can do all three because I sure do love doing them! Just flew back from Houston today and had a blast. You don't get that feeling after stepping off of a Southwest flight (you do get a sense of relief though).

Buy an airplane and have the time of your life. But yes, it is expensive.

 

[frfly172]

If your going to buy,do the numbers,see weather you can afford it. Flying is supposed to be fun,you don’t want to be worrying all the time. I own and love it.

 

[iflyvfr]

Driving thru LA in fear for your life versus flying the 100 miles and LOVING every minute of it? What's the price of landing and tie-ing down at work with a grin on your face? Yeah, I'd buy a 150 or 152 and fly every day that WX and maintenance issues allowed.

As others have said, it doesn't have to make sense, you just have to be able to afford it. I have memories flying that I will cherish for the rest of my life: Yellowstone, Sun-N-Fun, New England, the UP & my first OSH all in my old and slow 172 while VFR. I want more...

 

[iflyvfr]

<snip> The benefit is that the aircraft of co-ownership is obvious.. all cost and expenses are split two or three ways... downside is finding a partner/co-owner I'm comfortable with. Lease backs are good.. the aircraft actually get's flown frequently and minor squawks are taken care of promptly.. in addition, the revenue from the rental of your plane can easily be funneled into an escrow account for the day when you need to do an overhaul. The downside is everyone is flying your plane.. more wear and tear.. and when you want to fly it you have to schedule it just like anyone else.. food for thought..
My search continues..

I've never done a leaseback but I've been here a few years and the only ones who think a leaseback is a good idea are those who haven't done it. Do your research; all the anecdotal evidence I've seen here and on the Red board says they are good only for the FBO or flight school - terrible for ownership and very hard on an airplane.

 

[cowman]

Silly me...I thought you were looking for honesty, not agreement (not saying Cowman isn't honest).

Yeah just don't gloss over the part where I mention that I know any day I could end up with a $30,000 repair bill(new engine) and that I'm ok with the possibility. That's fairly important because it is entirely possible. I've just had the good fortune of(so far) no one repair being much over $1,000 and only having them once or twice a year. It helps that my airplane is fairly low time and doesn't get abused.... and that it was in pretty good shape when I bought it.

I have been in the maintenance hangar many times and had my mechanic point to some other plane that is in pieces on the floor and heard him say "at least you're not that guy... always get a pre-buy". The worst he ever pointed out to me was on the ramp, an Arrow he wouldn't sign off as airworthy because of corrosion "he didn't get a pre-buy".

 

[Flocker]

I'm approaching the 2 year mark on owning my 1st aircraft. No regrets.

 

[tawood]

Yeah just don't gloss over the part where I mention that I know any day I could end up with a $30,000 repair bill(new engine) and that I'm ok with the possibility. That's fairly important because it is entirely possible. I've just had the good fortune of(so far) no one repair being much over $1,000 and only having them once or twice a year. It helps that my airplane is fairly low time and doesn't get abused.... and that it was in pretty good shape when I bought it.

I have been in the maintenance hangar many times and had my mechanic point to some other plane that is in pieces on the floor and heard him say "at least you're not that guy... always get a pre-buy". The worst he ever pointed out to me was on the ramp, an Arrow he wouldn't sign off as airworthy because of corrosion "he didn't get a pre-buy".

My mechanic has pointed those out to me too. Some are just unlucky, and some "ask for it" if you know what I mean.

 

[tawood]

I dont own a plane but I know a couple of people who do. If you are going to use it a lot I would definitely look into it but also look into other factors like paying for gas, if your plane gets damaged by a storm while sitting in the hangar or something depending on where you live. And if your plane gets totaled you would be in the hole even more. However if you REALLY want that plane then get it man, nobody's stopping you. Follow your dreams because you only live once so you should make every second and chance count

The last thing an owner should worry about is fuel...in a small plane it is the least of all your expenses, and one of the few expenses you can control completely: if you can't afford fuel for some reason, don't fly.
As far as storm damage or a total loss, I know of no one, other than complete fools, that don't fly without insurance coverage. Insurance on small planes is waaaaaaay too cheap to not have hull coverage.

 

[Lachlan]

I have been wrestling with this same question.. Add into the mix minimum aircraft performance. I live in Colorado where my home field is at 5885 AGL and density altitude in the summer can easily hit 9000ft. so an aircraft that will allow me to fly westward means a minimum of 180hp...
In order to afford a slightly newer than old airplane with no more than 1300 hours SMOH, I have thought about partnership/co-ownership and lease-back to my local flight school. The benefit is that the aircraft of co-ownership is obvious.. all cost and expenses are split two or three ways... downside is finding a partner/co-owner I'm comfortable with. Lease backs are good.. the aircraft actually get's flown frequently and minor squawks are taken care of promptly.. in addition, the revenue from the rental of your plane can easily be funneled into an escrow account for the day when you need to do an overhaul. The downside is everyone is flying your plane.. more wear and tear.. and when you want to fly it you have to schedule it just like anyone else.. food for thought..
My search continues..

And some leasebacks require the owners to pay a decreased “rental” fee for maint reserves and fuel coverage, etc. whenever they fly their own airplanes.

 

[James331]

Depends on what you buy

Id say anyone who can afford a ski boat could probably swing a C150, 7AC, AA1, etc

But you do need to be hands on unless you have MAJOR money and dont mind wasting it, meaning do the owner assist annuals, change your oil yourself, fuel the plane yourself, buy your own parts, change your own tires, shop around and ask around to find a good APIA, once you find a good one KEEP HIM.

Those little things will make a big difference, both in the $$ area but also in how well you know that plane you're trusting with your life.

AND NUMBER ONE, get a VERY good prebuy, it should be the most in depth inspection YOU ever put the plane through. Its the difference between spending more on fuel and enjoying the plane, or mx and fixing crap.


Id also look into fun aircraft if youre going to buy, buying something you could rent from any school doesnt make as much sense, also C172s are not exactly the best any anything other than being (perhaps too) easy to fly.
Id look at grummans, aeroncas, taildraggers, stinsons, and so on

 

[wilkersk]

... Id also look into fun aircraft if youre going to buy, buying something you could rent from any school doesnt make as much sense, also C172s are not exactly the best any anything other than being (perhaps too) easy to fly.
Id look at grummans, aeroncas, taildraggers, stinsons, and so on

I'll 2nd that! There are some ~$20k airplanes out there that are perfectly airworthy and a ton of fun to fly! You want to really learn stick and rudder? Get proficient in a little Luscombe 8, or something similar . Keep your eyes open for the occasional Cessna 140, or Luscombe 8E that has been lovingly restored only to be sold because life got in the way. Not only are you getting a good deal, but you're helping someone out of a jam! --[how's that for rationalizing?;-) ]

 

[AU_James]

I've owned my Archer II for a whopping 5 months and have spent about $45 outside of routine ops and that was to replace the landing light (not factoring in covers and accessories of course). I'm about to change the oil for the first time as owner so we'll see what happens. I had a very thorough pre-buy and was very happy with what I saw so although I'm not ANTICIPATING a huge first annual, I'm prepared for one.

I fly about 8-10 hours a month, not as much as I would like, but I also get to fly on a whim whenever the weather works out for me and I can go anywhere for as long as I want to stay. This Christmas the wife and I went on a huge trip from Ohio to Virginia to Georgia and back and adjusted what days we would leave or how long we would stay (based on weather and in-law tolerances). That flexibility and freedom, not to mention the flight hours, would have never happened without owning.

Admittedly I'm on a high and feeling great about my first purchase thus far and I'm well aware of the fact that it'll (probably) catch up to me but it's SO worth it right now. I have funds being put aside every month automatically into a separate account just for those large bills when I need it. The idea being when it's time for annual it's no big deal.

Think about it, make the "worst case" predictions and determine if you can support it and then decide. But don't wait until the "right" time to come along or you'll be nearing the end of your flying days having regretted never flying home for Christmas.

 

[Sundancer]

I dipped my toe in. . .bought into a club for $3K, and $90 a month for tie-down, insurance, subscriptions, etc. It's a 172 with G530, AP, Nexrad, ADS-B, some other good electrons, and a new interior.

We're set-up for x-ctry usage; bolt for a week, no minimum. Charge ourselves $85 per tach hour, wet. I was very lucky!

Having been involved in group ownership for a while now, I think I'd go experimental next, maybe E-LSA; lot of fun, much less maintenance headaches.

 

[CRQFlier]

Commuting from SD to LA in the air can be tricky for a few reasons including weather and traffic. You'd definitely need a reliable ifr platform if you wanted to do it with any consistency. And it's not unusual to get vectored around (a lot) in the AM even filed IFR. Think it probably depends on which specific airports to see how much sense it would make. Totally agree though, 100 miles through the mouth of the dragon (405) simply sucks. Plus, you've got the totally random nature of 5 through Pendleton. Quite possibly the most miserable 100 miles around.

Pretty sure I know the club you're in. I bailed when I started flying with my son because I was no longer comfortable with the somewhat opaque nature of the MX - over time I narrowed to a very few rigs I had true confidence in. Not a criticism of the club, but more of not knowing the owners and their individual standard of care.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

 

[wilkersk]

...I still have a year to decide as the military is sending me on a trip for a little while but I know it is something I will be thinking about a lot while I am gone.

...For those of you that own planes, can you give me some stories of ownership.....good and bad.

Fair winds brother! I know what that's like. Prior to one of my last deployments, I ordered the info pack for the Steen Skybolt. Spent the entire 8 months looking at that stuff and daydreaming.

As for stories, here's one:

I've been claiming to be building an RV-8 for quite a few years now. I'm just not very disciplined, and I'm still a ways away from finishing. This last summer, I decided I wanted to by a small inexpensive 2 seater to keep me flying without spending the $140+/hr it was costing me to bomb around in a decrepit old 172.

The first airplane I looked at was a beautiful Luscombe 8A similar to the one pictured below (not this one):

The deal fell through. The pre-purchase inspection turned up an irregularity that was fixable. But, not without spending more money, so I passed.

Then, I found out the Sonerai IIL that is in the cover photo for the Sonerai.net website was up for sale. And, it was in my price range.

I called and made a tentative offer. The seller accepted my contingency. And, I made my travel plans.

I made it to Dallas, and the seller was gracious enough to, not only pick me up at the airport, but he also insisted I stay with him and his wife that night.

I spent that night looking over the builder's log and the aircraft and engine log books. All were in great shape.

The next day we went over the airplane together. And, I taxied it up and down the grass strip a couple of times. That's it! I was sold!

I didn't want to attempt to fly it the 2200 miles from Dallas to Seattle, so we folded the wings and put it in a rental truck.

It took 3.5 days, including a stop at my sister-in-law's house in Wichita. And, it was quite an adventure!

With the help of a few airport friends, I got her unloaded, using a climbing rope a pulley and a belay device (all gear I'd retired years ago after a long life of top-roping some of the local cliffs).

The airport peanut gallery was mostly of the opinion that I was gonna ground loop it on the first flight. But, I was pretty determined to get a handle on it. So, I went and did a few takeoffs and landings from the back seat of the FBO's Champ at Harvey Field with a local legend and chief flight instructor, Arnold Ebneter (The Propeller Under the Bed):

To make a long story short(er), I taxied it up and down the runway, scared the crap out of my self, and, after several go arounds, I managed to make the first flight and safely return without bending anything.

I've now got almost 30 hours in her with no problems. Still not as smooth as I'd like on the landings. But, I'm getting there!

 

[DaleB]

My club was not as expensive as the FBO rentals, but still 'spensive. Then I bought my own airplane. I now have ADS-B IN (out will be done this year or next), GPS coupled autopilot, all glass panel, and it's a few knots faster than the 172 I was flying before. My monthly cost for insurance and hangar is under $300, and my wet cost per flying hour -- all-in, generous engine reserve and all -- is about $30, depending on the cost of premium pump gas at the local station. It's all in what you buy. Oh, and I took on a co-owner now, so my fixed costs are cost are now under $150. So let's do the math:

Single owner, 50 hours per year: $95.44 per hour
Single owner, 75 hours per year: $73.62 per hour
Two owners, 50 hours per year: $62.72 per hour
Two owners, 75 hours per year: $51.81 per hour

So from my perspective, unless you don't fly much at all -- it's a win. Just don't go buy a rickety 40 - 50 year old airplane that will eat you out of house and home, unless you really need to.

 

[TheGolfPilot]

Pay cash for the plane and expect to pay 20% of that every year following until you sell it. If that’s out of your budget don’t buy it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Possum]

We fear the unknown... and the problem with airplanes is that most of us that own have 30+ year old planes, and maintenance and repair is so specialized that cost are multiple times more than other toys we own. If you are conditioned to accept surprises and budget for them and accept that there is no reasoning to the cost of parts and labor, then ownership will work. Best advice I was given when buying a plane... "buy the cheapest plane to own, not the cheapest plane". That is, spending more up front on a well maintained [even paying above market value] for a used plane may end up being a better buy long term than a Craiglists bargain. There is no business justification for me to own my plane. It is a hobby. I have spent about 2K on maintenance in the last 6 months. In a few weeks a Garmin 335 will be installed and get the ADSB out of the way. There are not many planes to rent here in the rural South, and no rentals at my local airport. For me it was either buy or quit flying. My justification is that I have a plane about 10 minutes from home that I can fly when I want. That being said....... there are many unknowns lurking inside of a 30 year old airplane. One must be conditioned to deal with the unknowns from a financial and emotional perspective.

 

[MooneyDriver78]

Pay cash for the plane and expect to pay 20% of that every year following until you sell it. If that’s out of your budget don’t buy it.

Good advice, expensive areas higher (hangars go for $650+/mon in SE Florida), less expensive places 15%.
Hangar is nice to have if you can do some basic maintenance on your plane, reduces corrosion and sun damage, so it can pay you back somewhat. You should decide whether you will hangar it upfront, in most areas there are long waiting lists to get one.

 

[edo2000]

Pay cash for the plane and expect to pay 20% of that every year following until you sell it. If that’s out of your budget don’t buy it.

I think you would definitely be solvent, planning a budget like this, but it seems pretty pessimistic unless you are hangaring in major metro area or something. The only time I remember coming close to expenses that high was when I bought a '63 C310 that hadn't been maintained as well as it should have been. My own fault. Like @Possum said, I definitely believe it is possible to select an aircraft which is much more likely to have low maintenance costs for a long time.

 

[MooneyDriver78]

I think you would definitely be solvent, planning a budget like this, but it seems pretty pessimistic unless you are hangaring in major metro area or something. The only time I remember coming close to expenses that high was when I bought a '63 C310 that hadn't been maintained as well as it should have been. My own fault. Like @Possum said, I definitely believe it is possible to select an aircraft which is much more likely to have low maintenance costs for a long time.

Kind of depends on the airplane doesn’t it:
$25,000 plane, $5000/year....not bad.
Buy the simplest plane that’s cheap to work on, tie down outside.

 

[painless]

Go experimental. As an example of lower ownership costs, I’m just finishing up a panel upgrade (I built the airplane) that includes an EFIS with synthetic vision and internal AHRS, Ads-b compliance, new (used) transponder and new engine monitor that talks with the EFIS all for around $6500 due to me doing the work and none of the equipment needing to be TSO’d. Do all that in a certified aircraft and you’re pushing 20k

 

[hindsight2020]

I think you would definitely be solvent, planning a budget like this, but it seems pretty pessimistic unless you are hangaring in major metro area or something. The only time I remember coming close to expenses that high was when I bought a '63 C310 that hadn't been maintained as well as it should have been. My own fault. Like @Possum said, I definitely believe it is possible to select an aircraft which is much more likely to have low maintenance costs for a long time.

Meh, don't be so self-depracating, a 310 of any condition was gonna be a 250/hr airplane over the span of your ownership. Your only mistake if one could even call it that, was in assuming a 310 could be run for significantly lower yearly operating budget. Unless all you did was look at it, you were in for a 25k/yr adventure every year when amortized. The 20% rule has been surprisingly close enough to my experience in the arrow. But these wags break down quickly for cheap twins, and likewise for expensive simple singles. Meaning a cheap 310 will exceed that rule 'bigly', and a 150k pa28 will grossly undershoot it.

 

[MooneyDriver78]

Go experimental. As an example of lower ownership costs, I’m just finishing up a panel upgrade (I built the airplane) that includes an EFIS with synthetic vision and internal AHRS, Ads-b compliance, new (used) transponder and new engine monitor that talks with the EFIS all for around $6500 due to me doing the work and none of the equipment needing to be TSO’d. Do all that in a certified aircraft and you’re pushing 20k

Not everybody has the time or skills to build a plane, some just want to fly.

 

[MooneyDriver78]

Go experimental. As an example of lower ownership costs, I’m just finishing up a panel upgrade (I built the airplane) that includes an EFIS with synthetic vision and internal AHRS, Ads-b compliance, new (used) transponder and new engine monitor that talks with the EFIS all for around $6500 due to me doing the work and none of the equipment needing to be TSO’d. Do all that in a certified aircraft and you’re pushing 20k

Not everybody has the time or skills to build a plane, some just want to fly.

 

[James331]

Owning an airplane makes no financial sense....but neither does owning a bass boat or hunting. My cost per pound for venison is probably equal at least to the finest Kobe beef that you could buy. Fishing? I own a $65K Bass Boat and I THROW THE BASS BACK!!!

I do own an airplane and it makes no more "nonsense" than my other passions hunting and fishing. But I work hard so that I can do all three because I sure do love doing them! Just flew back from Houston today and had a blast. You don't get that feeling after stepping off of a Southwest flight (you do get a sense of relief though).

Buy an airplane and have the time of your life. But yes, it is expensive.

You and I must hunt a little differently lol

But I agree.

And it also make no financial or health sense to eat red meat, sushi, sea bass, drink good spirits, frankly we all "should" just be living off this crap.

However the thing about life is no one makes it out alive, carpe diem

 

[hindsight2020]

Not everybody has the time or skills to build a plane, some just want to fly.

Yup, certainly why I got into this. I know I don't have the skill, and more importantly, don't have the desire to develop the skill. So I stay in my lane.

I do respect and admire the craftsmanship of some of those who devote their time in perfecting that craft. I think it truly is functional Art, and the World needs that sensibility. After all, we owe a portion of our ability to fly to these artists. I just find it prejudicial that the FAA imposes that gatekeeping dynamic as the perverse incentive in order to allow me the financial ability to fly in an economic climate of 30 year wage stagnation. That I find incredibly prejudicial and petty, let alone against the interest of safety, which is my exception to buying an E-AB not professionally de facto majority-built at the factory.

Maintaining otoh, that I have the time, inclination and skillset to accomplish, but the FAA stonewalls me a second time.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

A few more thoughts.

I'm only a 400+ hour pilot, and am on my second plane (I bought a 172 to train in, then moved up to a 182.) There are certainly risks to ownership - someday you'll need to write a $35,000 check for a new engine if you're actually flying regularly; it's inevitable, but hopefully you will get years before you need to think about that.

The thing about owning a plane is this: it's your plane. It's available on your schedule. It's maintained to your standards. It's equipped the way you want. The settings are as you left them. But mostly, the advantage of general aviation is you can go to the airport when you want, fly where you want, and do it on your terms (within reason, of course.) This is really only true if you own your own plane and maintain it properly.

I think it's worth it. It certainly is better if you walk into ownership with enough of a reserve around that you can buy a new engine next week if needed. It also feels pretty good to have your mortgage completely paid off, but that doesn't stop people from buying a house and financing it over time. You can do the same with unexpected repairs if you need to. It's not optimal, but it's an option that can be reasonable.

If you and the wife are bored for the upcoming three-day weekend, there's a really good feeling that comes with knowing your plane is in good shape and (weather permitting) you can make it to your hangar tomorrow whenever it's convenient and be in DC/Miami/New Orleans/Wherever three hours after you take off. I've never rented (no place to do so here) but I imagine dealing with scheduling and other renters kills a lot of the spontaneity you would otherwise enjoy.

Being a pilot is cool. Owning your own plane is a life-changer. I say find something you can afford, that'll do most of what you want to do, and don't look back. Deal with problems as they pop up and enjoy the hell out of the thing. Hell, next year you could be dead anyway.

 

[DaleB]

Go experimental.

^^^^^^^^^^^^ This.

Not everybody has the time or skills to build a plane, some just want to fly.

No problem. The country is crawling with well built, well maintained experimentals for sale. Like T/C'd aircraft there are some lemons and deathtraps out there too, so like a T/C'd aircraft it's helpful to have someone who is an expert in the type help with a prebuy. I know there are a few very well respected people in the Van's community who will do it for a reasonable fee, and I suspect there are others who know other types just as well.

When I had to get rid of my RV-7 project, I just didn't have it in me to start fresh with a new build. I found an RV-12 for sale fairly close to my price range, flew down with an expert to do the prebuy, made an offer and became an airplane owner. I'm happy that I did. Operating and maintenance costs are ridiculously low.

 

[James331]

Fair winds brother! I know what that's like. Prior to one of my last deployments, I ordered the info pack for the Steen Skybolt. Spent the entire 8 months looking at that stuff and daydreaming.

As for stories, here's one:

I've been claiming to be building an RV-8 for quite a few years now. I'm just not very disciplined, and I'm still a ways away from finishing. This last summer, I decided I wanted to by a small inexpensive 2 seater to keep me flying without spending the $140+/hr it was costing me to bomb around in a decrepit old 172.

The first airplane I looked at was a beautiful Luscombe 8A similar to the one pictured below (not this one):

The deal fell through. The pre-purchase inspection turned up an irregularity that was fixable. But, not without spending more money, so I passed.

Then, I found out the Sonerai IIL that is in the cover photo for the Sonerai.net website was up for sale. And, it was in my price range.

I called and made a tentative offer. The seller accepted my contingency. And, I made my travel plans.

I made it to Dallas, and the seller was gracious enough to, not only pick me up at the airport, but he also insisted I stay with him and his wife that night.

I spent that night looking over the builder's log and the aircraft and engine log books. All were in great shape.

The next day we went over the airplane together. And, I taxied it up and down the grass strip a couple of times. That's it! I was sold!

I didn't want to attempt to fly it the 2200 miles from Dallas to Seattle, so we folded the wings and put it in a rental truck.

It took 3.5 days, including a stop at my sister-in-law's house in Wichita. And, it was quite an adventure!

With the help of a few airport friends, I got her unloaded, using a climbing rope a pulley and a belay device (all gear I'd retired years ago after a long life of top-roping some of the local cliffs).

The airport peanut gallery was mostly of the opinion that I was gonna ground loop it on the first flight. But, I was pretty determined to get a handle on it. So, I went and did a few takeoffs and landings from the back seat of the FBO's Champ at Harvey Field with a local legend and chief flight instructor, Arnold Ebneter (The Propeller Under the Bed):

To make a long story short(er), I taxied it up and down the runway, scared the crap out of my self, and, after several go arounds, I managed to make the first flight and safely return without bending anything.

I've now got almost 30 hours in her with no problems. Still not as smooth as I'd like on the landings. But, I'm getting there!

Arnold and the champ!

I learned how the fly in 84842, also did my CPL land add on it with Arnold.

Great guy and great plane, what learning to fly should be like.

 

[Skyrys62]

The club that I currently fly with has some decent C172's and Grumman AG5Bs,

What are your experiences between these two?

I've never flown one, but kinda thought the Tigers were good little x-country options from what I've read.

 

[James331]

What are your experiences between these two?

I've never flown one, but kinda thought the Tigers were good little x-country options from what I've read.

The grummans are better planes, all around, only draw back is they aren't as idiot proof as the cessnas (spins), which in my mind also makes them a better trainer too.

I'd rather transition a AA1 pilot to a turbo prop than a C182 pilot.

 

[Skyrys62]

btw... jd, thanks for serving man.

Check out this list. If it sounds right, then check out the listing.

1. you are mechanically inclined
2. want to cruise quick for x-country
3. want to get good gph
4. want to look pretty cool doing it
5. don't mind buffing
6. want low time plane/engine
7. don't mind this price range
8. don't need more that 2 seats

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/21909695/2009-vans-rv-9a\

You buy it, I'll keep it flown regularly until you get back
It's the least I can do right?

 

[FormerHangie]

Brb brb

What are your experiences between these two?

I've never flown one, but kinda thought the Tigers were good little x-country options from what I've read.

I learned in Grumman AA1s, then moved up to the AA5A Cheetah, which is essentially a 150 HP Tiger. Later, my father bought a 172N, and I started flying that. The 172 was better at low speed, and would get in and out of shorter fields. The Cheetah was faster and much more fun to fly. Being able to taxi with the canopy fully open and fly with it partially open is truly wonderful in a hot climate.