Routing based on equipment

Discussion in 'Cleared for the Approach' started by paflyer, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    So on filing /A, for example, can the computer assign routes not achievable without GPS?
     
  2. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Do you mean will it 'correct' your route to an rnav route even if you file vor's?
    Because when I am /A, I file non rnav routes and that is usually my clearance.
    Now, ATC will sometimes not know, or forget I am /A and offer direct xxxxx and then the chat begins.
     
  3. airheadpenguin

    airheadpenguin Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I have filed /A and been given Q-routes which require a GPS. Usually a simple reminder and a proposed route that you want resolves this.
     
  4. Radar Contact

    Radar Contact Line Up and Wait

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    When planes file /A our NAS computer assigns the appropriate PDR (preferred departure route) if needed based on the route you filed. As mentioned, sometimes a controller may (trying to be helpful) clear you on a short cut that you can't accept and you'll have to remind them about your /A. In today's world primarily dominated by /G IFR planes, sometimes we gloss over that part.
     
  5. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    All too easy to enter the clearance from C/D into the iPad and then not realize until after signing off (because now you have to get the charts out to see how you're going to do it) that you can't legally fly it. What do you do, tell the C/D guy you'll check to see if the routing is legal and call him back?

    The enroute reroute is even kookier esp single pilot in IMC with no autopilot...
     
  6. Radar Contact

    Radar Contact Line Up and Wait

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    That's what I would do. It is very easy for C/D to amend your route. Easier than the approach controller who has to call over to C/D and ask them to do it. Center's have the ability to re-route at the scope. I'd just make sure you are happy/legal with your route prior to departure and if not tell C/D what you need to make sure you are.
     
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  7. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    You will be familiar with the first part of your route (ie the first waypoint or SID) from preflight, will immediately notice if the clearance they give you is not possible (ie rnav or direct to a fix), and can ask for changes on that right away. That will likely get you 15-20 minutes away depending on your speed and by that time you will have reviewed and know if the rest of the route is possible, negotiate for something you can do. Saves time idling or sitting in a hot airplane.
     
  8. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    And if it's not negotiable, you get vectored to God knows where. Or get asked "say intentions". After all, you did accept the clearance before departing.
     
  9. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Have never ever experienced this nor heard of it. It could happen. But the atc I deal with mostly wants to help you on your way as expeditiously as possible.
     
  10. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    In other words, get you the hell out of their airspace just as soon as possible!
     
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  11. bobmrg

    bobmrg En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Everything is negotiable. You can always ask for a different route. In the case of an IFR clearance, however, once you read it back you own it...so don't read it back until it is what you want.

    Bob
     
  12. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Final Approach

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    I really don’t see a problem with reading back an IFR departure clearance received on the ground, hearing “readback correct” to ensure I heard it right, then reviewing it and, upon discovering a problem, calling back to say unable.
     
  13. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    Is that like voting on it to see what's in it?
     
  14. luvflyin

    luvflyin En-Route PoA Supporter

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    I wouldn't go quite that far. You don't really 'own it' until you take off.
     
  15. luvflyin

    luvflyin En-Route PoA Supporter

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    I agree there. Reading it back and then calling back later to get it changed if necessary works. Getting it and then saying "I'll get back to you with the readback" also works. In the long run over the course of many clearances I'd guess that reading it back right away would result in fewer transmissions.
     
  16. Larry in TN

    Larry in TN Line Up and Wait

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    "Unable [RNAV segment], request [alternate routing you can fly]".

    Also, It's not "without GPS", it is "without RNAV" (or 'suitable RNAV'). GPS is just one kind of RNAV but there are others.