Robin Williams

A brilliant mind is stilled. We all will miss his genius. I mourn his tremendous despair. Love and best wishes to his family, friends and all mourners. Peace.
 
Yeah, that does change the story. Like Jesse, I'd figure out some more interesting way, though.
 
nddons said:
My dad had Parkinson's, but didn't die from it. He died of colon cancer. It is debilitating, yes, and the drugs are often worse than the tremors. But I think it is manageable in many people. Michael J. Fox has had it and dealt with it pretty well.
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Agree. I've known a few people with it and, while there are obvious symptoms and some limitations in what you can do, most people can live a long time with it. I know someone who was diagnosed a couple years ago in his 60s. He and his wife are using the opportunity to travel and do the things they want to do now instead of waiting for a nebulous "later", which is probably what we all should be doing.
 
Henning said:
Interesting, the articles made them sound miraculous, meh, it was probably a sponsored article.
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The best one I saw definitely had an impact on mobility and motor function. But it was so transitory to be barely worthwhile. Oh, and expensive.
 
steingar said:
The best one I saw definitely had an impact on mobility and motor function. But it was so transitory to be barely worthwhile. Oh, and expensive.
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My dad died in 1995 so I haven't kept up, but aren't there surgical treatments that have been pretty successful?
 
There are some cold, hard hearted people on this board or who clearly do not have a clue what a mental illness will do to someone. Like the guy who distances his very dear crazy friends just to keep sane. Or the one who thinks suicide is a choice.
We allow "not guilty by reason of insanity" which basically means the person did the crime but was not aware of what that crime was. If you really believe some of the stuff you are shoveling, then you should be a champion of changing the laws. Obviously, being crazy isn't a defense.
There are many reasons for mental illness and not all can be controlled through medicine. Causes include but not limited to biology. Many Bi-polar are victims of their own body chemistry. It is a MEDICAL issue first even though it is treated (thanks to insurance) as a mental illness. Anyone going through a manic episode probably does not realize it. Those closest to them probably don't realize it. Even the doctor or dipstick clinical psychologist cannot see it. Five minutes later, they become unresponsive, or they're up at 3 in the morning with all the lights on, cooking ffor an army, talking away to their long dead granny.
So have some sympathy and compassion for what Robin was going through and what others face daily still. Sure you MIGHT think he had a choice, but realize, it is entirely likely that nothing could be further from the truth.
 
silver-eagle said:
There are some cold, hard hearted people on this board or who clearly do not have a clue what a mental illness will do to someone. Like the guy who distances his very dear crazy friends just to keep sane. Or the one who thinks suicide is a choice.
We allow "not guilty by reason of insanity" which basically means the person did the crime but was not aware of what that crime was. If you really believe some of the stuff you are shoveling, then you should be a champion of changing the laws. Obviously, being crazy isn't a defense.
There are many reasons for mental illness and not all can be controlled through medicine. Causes include but not limited to biology. Many Bi-polar are victims of their own body chemistry. It is a MEDICAL issue first even though it is treated (thanks to insurance) as a mental illness. Anyone going through a manic episode probably does not realize it. Those closest to them probably don't realize it. Even the doctor or dipstick clinical psychologist cannot see it. Five minutes later, they become unresponsive, or they're up at 3 in the morning with all the lights on, cooking ffor an army, talking away to their long dead granny.
So have some sympathy and compassion for what Robin was going through and what others face daily still. Sure you MIGHT think he had a choice, but realize, it is entirely likely that nothing could be further from the truth.
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This is a much more enlightened post than many that preceded it. I did a psych rotation during medical school and it was an eye opening experience.
 
silver-eagle said:
There are some cold, hard hearted people on this board or who clearly do not have a clue what a mental illness will do to someone. Like the guy who distances his very dear crazy friends just to keep sane. Or the one who thinks suicide is a choice.
We allow "not guilty by reason of insanity" which basically means the person did the crime but was not aware of what that crime was. If you really believe some of the stuff you are shoveling, then you should be a champion of changing the laws. Obviously, being crazy isn't a defense.
There are many reasons for mental illness and not all can be controlled through medicine. Causes include but not limited to biology. Many Bi-polar are victims of their own body chemistry. It is a MEDICAL issue first even though it is treated (thanks to insurance) as a mental illness. Anyone going through a manic episode probably does not realize it. Those closest to them probably don't realize it. Even the doctor or dipstick clinical psychologist cannot see it. Five minutes later, they become unresponsive, or they're up at 3 in the morning with all the lights on, cooking ffor an army, talking away to their long dead granny.
So have some sympathy and compassion for what Robin was going through and what others face daily still. Sure you MIGHT think he had a choice, but realize, it is entirely likely that nothing could be further from the truth.
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Exactly! Hear Hear!
 
What I think is rather odd is that some people think suicide is more understandable with a Parkinson's diagnosis but not so much so if the person is mentally ill. I think we are all influenced by our biology, some more than others.
 
Everskyward said:
What I think is rather odd is that some people think suicide is more understandable with a Parkinson's diagnosis but not so much so if the person is mentally ill.
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Perhaps because the former is incurable, while the latter is treatable?
 
You need to learn to read more carefully. I said he had to make multiple cognitive fine motor skill choices and deliberate actions.

And he had tried two separate methods. Quite literally he had to work at it.

If you want to believe he had absolutely no control over those multiple decisions, fine. It doesn't jibe with anything scientific.

And we still haven't seen the Tox report.

Try and make it an emotional attack at me all you like. My opinion is not based on my emotions.

If you want my emotional reaction, it's posted elsewhere. Easy to find.

I also did NOT say it was easier emotionally to kill oneself if one had a terminal disease. Re-read my post and the exact words I typed. I said it was a trigger. As in the mental state definition of trigger. External stimuli. Additional input. Something he wasn't expecting.

Most of his life he knew his demons well and said clearly that alcohol was the one thing that he could not control nor could he control himself via sheer willpower against. I suspect we'll see alcohol in the coroner's final report.

I've known people who fought that daemon. I've hurt for them. I know it's a killer. I've also seen those people get luckier than Mr. Williams and have someone find them in time to save them. They later all say the same thing, "I still had to start by putting the bottle to my lips. My fault."

Yes mental illness was involved. But those that survive all are the best people to know where the fault fell. Themselves. They still had to choose to drink.

I'll put $20 on a depressant being in his system. He had to put it there. Maybe. Just maybe... The rest was truly out of his conscious control. But he had to start it. And he had admitted numerous times to millions that was what he could never ever ever do.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Perhaps because the former is incurable, while the latter is treatable?
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The symptoms of both can be treated, although not with complete success. I don't think you can "cure" mental illness either. And as others have said, life is fatal.
 
My Take on this sad episode....

He fought deamons for years and was able to overcome them temporarly.

His life and medical conditions were becoming overwhelming and his plan was to lessen the pain, both real and mentally and his option was suicide.
You can bet he ran that scenerio over in his mind for decades and this time he didn't back down and let the suffering continue.

IMHO....All the people close to him were riding the gravy train, of his fame and fortune, his ability to fund all their vices and bad habits....

After watching numerous news clips of Robin at Hollywood events, Red carpet gala's and interviews there is one curly blond gal who is always around and seems to choriograph the setting.. She might be his wife, or a handler, or his publicist, or just a groupie , but............

After living in Miami during the 70's -80's and watching people addicted to cocaine, it is crystal clear to me she is strung to the max.. Just look at her pupils and watch her wipe her nose numerous times to catch the nose candy running out..

He was a victim of his surroundings and it was not healthy to his mental or phyical state and his "close friends" didn't do squat to help him over the hurdles of life...

For instance, One of the first things to come out was the family spokesman said he was battling severe depression in the last few months,,, yet not ONE of them got him committed to a mental facility, which is pretty easialy done using the Baker act... And.....

You can bet they attempted to sanitize the house before the police were called to clean up and hide cocaine and other drugs... Nate is right too,,,, lets wait for the Tox tests to come back.. But my money is on Robin was NOT sober...

In closing,,,,,,,,,, NO ONE knows what is going on in another persons mind.

If I ever get to the point where life is not enjoyable and there is constant pain and mental turmoil, then I will "check out" on my own schedule and method..... ( I ) will make the choice if suicide is better then lingering on with a life that is headed to a dead end.... And not society's vision of what is proper...

Rant off.....:(
 
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Jay Honeck said:
Perhaps because the former is incurable, while the latter is treatable?
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They are both both. They are both incurable, and the are both treatable. The difference is Parkinson's makes you look like a freak, and mental illness makes you act like a freak. In reality Parkinson's is a type of mental illness, just not a variety of insanity.

The reason it's ok to kill yourself with Parkinson's is that we value vanity more than sanity.
 
Henning said:
They are both both. They are both incurable, and the are both treatable. The difference is Parkinson's makes you look like a freak, and mental illness makes you act like a freak. In reality Parkinson's is a type of mental illness, just not a variety of insanity.



The reason it's ok to kill yourself with Parkinson's is that we value vanity more than sanity.
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Define " freak ". That's just a label that means "different than me", to my thinking. And a really weak one at that.

Your explanation goes well to why a *lot* of people would make this decision but I doubt Mr. Williams was very vain. Or worried about being a freak.

He certainly could have hidden it via the magic of Hollywood, but I highly doubt that our society's values about "freakishness" would have had much effect on him personally. He joked often that he was a freak, more than once. Hairy, sweat all the time, etc. All in his comedy routines over the years.

He'd have found a way to make his disease a source of laughter. That's what he did best. The class clown may truly be the saddest person in private but they're still the class clown.

If anything, societal pressures to not shove a kilo of coke up his nose and run around with his pants on his head for a laugh, probably bothered him more than the disease ever would have.

Which is why I called the disease a trigger. Maybe a better word is an excuse. I think it was a circumstantial excuse to start using drugs (alcohol is a drug) again, which he knew very well was likely a death sentence for him.

The toxicology report will tell. I think his biggest demons were chemical addictions. They were there at the beginning, and things tend to come back around at the end. Most of us regress back to our youth as we age.

Just thoughts. We'll see. One of his best friends and mentors was Johnathan Winters and if you look up the Carson interview with both of them you'll see a brief moment in it where Winters joked about Robin's access to "lots of chemicals" in the past.

Your best friends always see your downfalls. They know what will bite you in the ass. Winters joke probably nailed it, long before he died.

Robin was also hiding in work. Four movies with him in them, to be released, and all shot while he was also shooting a TV show? That's a really heavy workload, even for Hollywood. Probably not doing it for the money ... Just a guess.
 
People are to quick to judge someone on what they see.

I would bend over and my nose would run like you turned on a water facet. Many times I had someone say, need another line, or take another bump or whatever they call it. I would try and explain I have a sinus disease and am having a lot of problems. I have had surgeries for this and it helped, but still today sometimes when I bend over my nose runs like a facet. It happened in front of my first CFI, He just gave me this look, I saw what he was saying in his eye's. I tried to explain. Did no good, if you talk with this man today and mention my name he will tell you I use cocaine and will tell you this story of me bending over an my nose just runs.
Friends have come and told me this who have spoke with him. Its people like this who think they know it all, run thier mouths and ruin peoples lives or make them hell.

R.I.P. Robin
 
1600vw said:
People are to quick to judge someone on what they see.

I would bend over and my nose would run like you turned on a water facet. Many times I had someone say, need another line, or take another bump or whatever they call it. I would try and explain I have a sinus disease and am having a lot of problems. I have had surgeries for this and it helped, but still today sometimes when I bend over my nose runs like a facet. It happened in front of my first CFI, He just gave me this look, I saw what he was saying in his eye's. I tried to explain. Did no good, if you talk with this man today and mention my name he will tell you I use cocaine and will tell you this story of me bending over an my nose just runs.
Friends have come and told me this who have spoke with him. Its people like this who think they know it all, run thier mouths and ruin peoples lives or make them hell.

R.I.P. Robin
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And your pupils were noticably different and you were acting paranoid during these sinus disease events too???..

I have been around cocaine users and there is a combination of actions that can be observed... Put them all together and it paints a clear picture...

If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, and swims like a duck... It is a friggin DUCK...:wink2:
 
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I don't think anyone posting here knew Robin Williams, but some believe they did because of what they know of his work and what they have seen in the media. I don't think people here can even make an educated guess about what he was thinking or feeling. We think we know celebrities but we don't.
 
Everskyward said:
I don't think anyone posting here knew Robin Williams, but some believe they did because of what they know of his work and what they have seen in the media. I don't think people here can even make an educated guess about what he was thinking or feeling. We think we know celebrities but we don't.
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Maybe not but an educated guess is that he was consumed by thoughts of sadness and hopelessness.
 
Scott Simon did a nice tribute on WeeSat this morning. Audio available here after noon EDT.

Two notable quotes:

Why can't some of the people who seem to bring the most joy into this world find it for themselves?

But Levant also remembers how Williams flagrantly fueled himself with drugs. "Every time he'd sneeze, he'd say, 'There goes a hundred bucks.'
 
Gary F said:
Maybe not but an educated guess is that he was consumed by thoughts of sadness and hopelessness.
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Given that he committed suicide, that's probably true. But speculation about the reason for these feelings is just speculation.
 
timwinters said:
Scott Simon did a nice tribute on WeeSat this morning. Audio available here after noon EDT.

Two notable quotes:

Why can't some of the people who seem to bring the most joy into this world find it for themselves?

But Levant also remembers how Williams flagrantly fueled himself with drugs. "Every time he'd sneeze, he'd say, 'There goes a hundred bucks.'
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Scott Simon is terrific.

After watching some of Williams' frantic, manic, stream of consciousness improvisations, some that go on and on for ten minutes or more, one has to wonder how exhausting it must have been to be saddled with such a mind. Is it possible to turn that fire hose OFF?

Of all the most creative minds I've known, all were into drugs and alcohol. My guess is that it's their only escape.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Scott Simon is terrific.

After watching some of Williams' frantic, manic, stream of consciousness improvisations, some that go on and on for ten minutes or more, one has to wonder how exhausting it must have been to be saddled with such a mind. Is it possible to turn that fire hose OFF?

Of all the most creative minds I've known, all were into drugs and alcohol. My guess is that it's their only escape.
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No, they can't control it although meds can help. During medical school I did a psych evaluation on a woman with bipolar disorder. She was immaculately dressed and initially seemed completely normal. I was wondering why she was even being seen in the psych clinic. After first few minutes I sensed some agitation. Then it was like someones flipped a switch and she transitioned a full blown manic phase. She was actually manic when she arrived and had desperately tried to remain "normal" until she could no longer maintain control. That happened in 1988 and I still remember it clearly.
 
Gary F said:
What's wrong with speculation?
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As far as I'm concerned, it's not a matter of right or wrong and no one is going to stop speculating because of what I write. But I think it's an interesting phenomena that we think we "know" people just because of what we have seen in the media, when we really don't.
 
I never met Robin, and certainly can't guess what he was going through.

But all I know is...

Was the world a better and more humorous place with him in it? Yes.

RIP Robin
 
LoneAspen said:
I never met Robin, and certainly can't guess what he was going through.

But all I know is...

Was the world a better and more humorous place with him in it? Yes.

RIP Robin
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I agree with that. The entertainment industry is populated with so many arrogant self absorbed narcissists that he seemed a little out of place.
 
"Freak" is the most commonly used word I came across that the mentally ill used to describe how they feel about themselves when I'd talk to them. That's why I purposely used the word. Take it for its ugly connotation and you can see the self loathing that goes on.
 
"Freak" is the most commonly used word I came across that the mentally ill used to describe how they feel about themselves when I'd talk to them. That's why I purposely used the word. Take it for its ugly connotation and you can see the self loathing that goes on. I will guarantee there were many points in his life when he thought to himself,"My God, what kind of freak am I?"

Chemical addictions are far more often a symptom of mental illness rather than a cause. They are often a form of self medication.
 
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Jay Honeck said:
Scott Simon is terrific.

After watching some of Williams' frantic, manic, stream of consciousness improvisations, some that go on and on for ten minutes or more, one has to wonder how exhausting it must have been to be saddled with such a mind. Is it possible to turn that fire hose OFF?

Of all the most creative minds I've known, all were into drugs and alcohol. My guess is that it's their only escape.
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No, you can never turn the fire hose off, that's why the drugs.
 
The one thing I would wish for everyone to learn from this is that your own mind is your worst enemy, so learn it well so you can recognize when it's trying to screw you over.
 
Henning said:
The one thing I would wish for everyone to learn from this is that your own mind is your worst enemy, so learn it well so you can recognize when it's trying to screw you over.
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The German saying "Work makes life sweet" refers to this tangentially. Keeping busy is the best possible path to mental health, and too much leisure time will make you bat***** crazy.

This is the hardest lesson to learn, and the hardest thing to teach, because it is so counterintuitive.
 
Jay Honeck said:
The German saying "Work makes life sweet" refers to this tangentially. Keeping busy is the best possible path to mental health, and too much leisure time will make you bat***** crazy.

This is the hardest lesson to learn, and the hardest thing to teach, because it is so counterintuitive.
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This is an excellent point, and rather than derail this thread, I hope you don't mind if I take your quote to a new thread.
 
Gary F said:
I agree with that. The entertainment industry is populated with so many arrogant self absorbed narcissists that he seemed a little out of place.
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This. Y'all see the story about when someone let him use some material about Marin County being full of old white guys on $6000 bicycles? He asked the person if he rode. The guy says, "No. Honestly I can't afford the bike." (Not only did he ask for the other comic's material, which is rare... These guys nowadays just steal lines. But then...)

He told the guy bicycling was "therapy on wheels" and bought him a really expensive bike and asked him to come join the gang on a ride. He used to train and ride with Lance Armstrong.

(Which has some other ironies about substance abuse behavior and birds of a feather flocking together, but anyway... )

There's also one actress who came out this week crediting her entire career to him. She couldn't afford to attend or continue attending Juliard and Robin just flat paid the bill.

His body of work is so vast he touched a generation or three.

How many people here have seen The Survivors? The scene at the survivalist expo has got to be one of the funniest things I've ever seen. And Robin playing against Walter Mathau is just brilliant. Mathau dead-panning the line, "You are a professional **** disturber, that's what you are." in the straight guy character that only Mathau could play, is comedy gold. It's not played in re-runs much, but if you get a chance, it's hilarious.

Mari lamented that people here seem to have known him. In that, I agree. None of us really knew him. Many of us have known people very like him though, I'm sure. Complete with the drive to perform for the crowd, the actual care, and the internal sadness, and certainly the addictions. I doubt there is a person here who's life hasn't been directly involved or affected by an alcoholic. Robin was everyone's alcoholic uncle.

Or someone with an incredibly quick wit who uses comedy, bicycling, drugs, whatever they can, to take the edge off their hyperactive mind that sees lots more of the good and bad around them than the average person's attention span has time to process. Robin was also everyone's class clown friend.

Comedians are drawn to the stage as an outlet for that amazing ability to see the truth about the stuff happening around us and how funny and therefore sad that it all really is. The downside is, the better they are at it, the more pressure builds to always be "the funny man". Imagine everyone you met expected you'd make them laugh. That's a tough life on days when you just don't feel like being funny.

People got angry at Cosby for becoming "too serious" after his kid was shot and killed. Seriously?

Funny men and women sometimes are the only thing that keep the rest of us sane. Life is better with them than without, for sure.

Crystal and Goldberg really got it right. There are, "No Words". I found it interesting that Whoopi in an interview once said they were deciding on what to support as a charity for Comic Relief and Robin virtually demanded it be for the homeless. I found a reference below.

How many "awareness" campaigns do you see today for homelessness? Celebrities dump buckets of ice water on their heads for diseases, and "challenge" their buddies to do the same, or millions of women march around with pink ribbons for a corrupt organization that makes a really good living off of organizing such things...

For diseases. Natural diseases. Genetics. Not something as utterly fixable by society as homelessness.

Let's not even talk about how far above homeless humans our current society places pound animals. If it's furry it's plastered on Facebook.

But when was the last time you saw three Hollywood headliners and numerous top notch entertainer guests go on TV for a couple of days to pay for simple shelter for fellow humans?

Robin demanded it be for the homeless. That's impressive. Takes some guts in the entertainment world, too. There's no fuzzy warm "hook" and there's no cute wiggly puppies to shoot B-roll of.

http://m.eonline.com/news/568668/bi...eact-in-kind-to-robin-williams-death-no-words
 
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