Request Bravo Clearance

SixPapaCharlie

SixPapaCharlie

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Usually I just fly along toward the bravo wondering if they are going to clear me in or start stepping me down.

Maybe everyone already knows and does this but I haven't.
Tonight I was 15 miles out and wondering and just decided to ask
"Reg. Appr. Cirrus 5MV (6PC), request bravo clearance"

The guy said sure and vectored us around giving us a night tour of the city.

Point being not that I got the cool view but that I knew 5 minutes prior whether I was going to get in or not so I wasn't getting closer and closer and waiting on them.

So just a tip. If you are not sure if they are going to let you, ask.
 
"Atlanta, for the tapes, requesting clearance into the Bravo"
 
I requested class b transition one day, and they responded with cleared into class b and promptly issued headings and altitudes that took me around. I never entered the class b.

Last week I asked for classB transition, was radar identified and then denied, remain clear of the class b. She kept giving me frequency changes, but no headings, just remain clear and recommended routing around. Got to the north side and military side of the class b turned me over to the military tower who cleared me through to the class D I needed.
 
BillTIZ said:
I requested class b transition one day, and they responded with cleared into class b and promptly issued headings and altitudes that took me around. I never entered the class b.
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I've done nearly that around here (Denver) west-to-east. The Bravo clearance was for the initial descent and then outside the Bravo forevermore. Sometimes there's not a lot ATC can do when it's busy and your route crosses their routes...
 
Well, sometimes the routes are easy to predict, especially if there are published VFR transition routes. If you listen to the B airport's ATIS, you can know which runways and approaches are in use, but even that's sometimes overkill.

Try to stay out of their way, and be specific about your requested route and altitude.

I've only been denied B clearance a few times. At least sometimes, it seems to be limited by VFR traffic, not IFR arrivals and departures.
 
Were you on ff? Was your destination in bravo? I've never had to transition a bravo. For me, the destination is always bravo (SLC). I just cancel ff and then contact SL approach for clearance. I don't know the procedure for transitioning a bravo while on ff. Might need to learn that someday.
 
If I read this right you were likely in class E airspace while vfr. If I'm right, did the controller issue you a hard altitude restriction or a traffic call that in your judgement would prevent a safe decent? Is their mountainous or otherwise hazardous terrain requiring you to operate in the bravo prior to descent?

If I'm right and the answer to my questions is no, why would the the controller step you down? Don't confuse class E with b c or d. It is controlled airspace true, but it applies to ifr only. Think of it another way. If you're landing at the primary class b airport approach will assign you a runway. Do they assign one at a closed delta towered field that reverts to e upon closing?
 
Was flying F44 to KDTO at 6500
So flying from G through E and B to D under B on FF
Hoping to avoid being told to fly low under the shelves at night
 
Ummm....

This is how it's supposed to work. You ask, they either say "cleared into the bravo" or "remain clear of the bravo."

Now, it has been a few years, but to the best of my knowledge it hasn't changed.
 
I've never been denied a NY Bravo transition. Those guys always help out when they can, even when they are busy.
 
In that case do exactly like you did. Just explain you want to avoid flying low under the shelves as soon as convenient. The problem starts when pilots assume the burden is on atc to say remain clear and don't ask for a clearance until their spinner is in the airspace. That second part is becoming a trend bordering on commonplace.
 
I got "remain clear of the Bravo" both ways today. But then again, I always hear that around KORD.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Usually I just fly along toward the bravo wondering if they are going to clear me in or start stepping me down.

Maybe everyone already knows and does this but I haven't.
Tonight I was 15 miles out and wondering and just decided to ask
"Reg. Appr. Cirrus 5MV (6PC), request bravo clearance"

The guy said sure and vectored us around giving us a night tour of the city.

Point being not that I got the cool view but that I knew 5 minutes prior whether I was going to get in or not so I wasn't getting closer and closer and waiting on them.

So just a tip. If you are not sure if they are going to let you, ask.
Click to expand...

My guess is most people do but, based on the numerous discussions I see on Class B VFR here and elsewhere, a surprising number don't.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Was flying F44 to KDTO at 6500
So flying from G through E and B to D under B on FF
Hoping to avoid being told to fly low under the shelves at night
Click to expand...

I forced the issue one night and got what I needed. I called in the usual place for a transition through the B on the normal routing. I was denied, "remain clear of the class b".

I responded, it's dark, it's windy, it's not a night to be near Red Rock. They cleared me through, I had to climb some, but they got me through.

Unpublished transition through Las Vegas Class B, from south of Henderson (HND) to LAS Rwy 25L threshold then either a heading of 010 or direct Rwy 19 threshold and at some point direct to VGT, normally at 5500MSL, descending to enter the VGT Class D at or above 3500MSL. Coming up from Boulder City expect westerly headings then Rwy 25L threshold to avoid the final approach to 25.

Transition does not work if they are using Rwy 1/19 for primary operations, which has been the case this winter with Rwy 25R closed.
 
BillTIZ said:
I forced the issue one night and got what I needed. I called in the usual place for a transition through the B on the normal routing. I was denied, "remain clear of the class b".

I responded, it's dark, it's windy, it's not a night to be near Red Rock. They cleared me through, I had to climb some, but they got me through.

Unpublished transition through Las Vegas Class B, from south of Henderson (HND) to LAS Rwy 25L threshold then either a heading of 010 or direct Rwy 19 threshold and at some point direct to VGT, normally at 5500MSL, descending to enter the VGT Class D at or above 3500MSL. Coming up from Boulder City expect westerly headings then Rwy 25L threshold to avoid the final approach to 25.

Transition does not work if they are using Rwy 1/19 for primary operations, which has been the case this winter with Rwy 25R closed.
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Night is usually when I request Class B Clearences. If you don't here in the DC SFRA, you'll end up flying 1500 feet in the dark, surrounded by 1200 foot towers for way longer then I'm comfortable with.

I typically say "Any chance I can get a class B clearence, it's dark and I'd like get some altitude." They always comply.
 
Got a clearance into the bravo today,and also advised of the route ,I was going to get to my destination.was told I was basically going to parerlell a major highway.
 
Walboy said:
In PHX class B, it seems like people that sound like they know what they're doing on the radio routinely get cleared in. People who sound like an amateur get cleared in on slow days, otherwise "remain clear class B." It also seems like they usually clear everyone for the transition route, engrish charrenged or not. I have to say ATC here in PHX are very patient folks.
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I've heard that happen in other geographic areas also.
 
We're lucky here - if Regional Approach ( as DFW's Approach facility is known) has time (and they almost always make time), they'll clear you in and help you out. They only sometimes read minds, though, so you might have to actually tell them what you want and where you want to go.
 
We did several class Bravo transitions in the past (LAX, PHX, LAS, ...) and usually got what we have asked for. Now living close to DTW, we have a 50/50 chance for 'cleared into' or 'stay clear of' class Bravo. We plan our routes and altitudes to stay clear of Bravo but certainly take the chance if we are cleared into Bravo. The most exciting thing was when we were allowed to do two touch & gos on DTW's runway 3R during the night... :D:yes:

DTW's controllers are very nice and patient. :):yesnod:
 
If I'm approaching and am a ways out, I ask if I'm going to be able to get a direct routing through the B or if I should start my climb/descent. Usually they come back to me in a few minutes with an answer so I have plenty of time to set myself up with minimum added distance.
 
Skywalker said:
We did several class Bravo transitions in the past (LAX, PHX, LAS, ...) and usually got what we have asked for. Now living close to DTW, we have a 50/50 chance for 'cleared into' or 'stay clear of' class Bravo. We plan our routes and altitudes to stay clear of Bravo but certainly take the chance if we are cleared into Bravo. The most exciting thing was when we were allowed to do two touch & gos on DTW's runway 3R during the night... :D:yes:

DTW's controllers are very nice and patient. :):yesnod:
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VFR Class B transitions at LAS is very rare right now.
We complain and they'll do better for a while, then they put up the no VFR wall again. Rwy 19/1 operation is the worst for GA traffic coming up from the south to get into VGT.
 
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