Property Damage by Minors

Gerhardt

Gerhardt

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Gerhardt
My son is in the high school marching band. Friday they were playing at a football game and when they returned to the locker room found that all the kids' clothes were put in the toilets.

I got a call from the cell phone repair shop today saying his phone is beyond repair, so I called the school. The principal said they identified the pranksters from video and have punished them. I asked if they had an incident number for the police so I could get info for reimbursement for property damage for his clothes and iphone. They didn't think a crime had been committed so they didn't call the police. And they can't release the name of the students to me because of their ages.

I called the police to have them help out, but they won't release info because of the kids' ages. I was hoping the police could be an intermediary, but they won't.

WTF? What do most people do in cases like this? (this is below my own insurance deductible, not that I'd file anyway since it would surcharge my policy)
 
Surely some kids know who did it. I'd do an investigation, find out who did it, and pay some other kids to give them an ass-whupping.

Or you could file a complaint and demand for reimbursement with the school seeing as how they didn't provide adequate security. If they don't pay up, sue 'em. They're probably indemnified anyway.

Rich
 
Make a claim against the school. That will clear the air real quick.
 
Start with the band director. He knows who did it. Ask him for the info for your reimbursement so you don't need to bother suing the school, and the band director, and the athletic dir, etc. If he doesn't cooperate then ask for his full legal name. That should get things rolling.
 
Around here the schools have an SRO (School Resource Officer) - city cop whose desk happens to be at the school. If your district has something similar, that would be a good place to start with filing a police report. Then you could get the Principal and the SRO together and let them explain to each other how it works.
 
docmirror said:
Start with the band director. He knows who did it. Ask him for the info for your reimbursement so you don't need to bother suing the school, and the band director, and the athletic dir, etc. If he doesn't cooperate then ask for his full legal name. That should get things rolling.
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That and ask whether he is willing to sign a waiver of service of the complaint by a sheriff, and will instead accept service by regular mail.
 
Make a claim or sue the school,school committee ,and the town,just to make a point that some pranks are criminal. Did they say what the punishment was. Get there names and go after the parents.
 
Gerhardt said:
My son is in the high school marching band. Friday they were playing at a football game and when they returned to the locker room found that all the kids' clothes were put in the toilets.

I got a call from the cell phone repair shop today saying his phone is beyond repair, so I called the school. The principal said they identified the pranksters from video and have punished them. I asked if they had an incident number for the police so I could get info for reimbursement for property damage for his clothes and iphone. They didn't think a crime had been committed so they didn't call the police. And they can't release the name of the students to me because of their ages.

I called the police to have them help out, but they won't release info because of the kids' ages. I was hoping the police could be an intermediary, but they won't.

WTF? What do most people do in cases like this? (this is below my own insurance deductible, not that I'd file anyway since it would surcharge my policy)
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Have your son take a hammer and destroy the Principle's windshield..... and when he is caught.....

Tell the cops and the principle that caving in a glass windshield is NOT a crime... So GO away...:rolleyes:....:D
 
Prank my ass. That's what is wrong these days Minimizing assaults on persons and property by calling it a prank. Like the shootings out on the Arizona highways are a prank. Or the sexual assault of a woman is a prank.
Cops and DAs love to kick up the charges when they can get milage on them. In this case, total the actual replacement value of each item and file a complaint for grand larceny with the police. As we all know, a smartphone's replacement costs could reach $1,000.
 
When I worked for the port district, some kid on a motorcycle rode around kicking out taxiway lights at the airport. Our maintenance man caught him. The kid's mom literally dragged him into the port office, sat him down, and asked the manager how much the kid now owed the port for light replacement. She then dragged the kid out, and about six months later he came back with the money he had earned mowing lawns and such. The mom had kept us informed as to his progress. Taxiway lights are expensive. I was impressed with that mom. So don't underestimate parents. They really are our last best hope.
 
Sam D said:
I'm probably not most people, but I'd ask my son what he plans on doing about it.
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This

Much more important for your son compared to some iphone and clothes.
 
A good lesson about leaving anything of value out and unlocked.

Your only hope is probably going to be finding the parents and hoping they're the sort of parents who care about their kid taking responsibility. It's very clear the school and police don't care.
 
Gerhardt said:
My son is in the high school marching band. Friday they were playing at a football game and when they returned to the locker room found that all the kids' clothes were put in the toilets.

I got a call from the cell phone repair shop today saying his phone is beyond repair, so I called the school. The principal said they identified the pranksters from video and have punished them. I asked if they had an incident number for the police so I could get info for reimbursement for property damage for his clothes and iphone. They didn't think a crime had been committed so they didn't call the police. And they can't release the name of the students to me because of their ages.

I called the police to have them help out, but they won't release info because of the kids' ages. I was hoping the police could be an intermediary, but they won't.

WTF? What do most people do in cases like this? (this is below my own insurance deductible, not that I'd file anyway since it would surcharge my policy)
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The school doesn't think a crime was committed? Duh... You need to get the police to do their job. A crime was committed and the perpetrators need to make your loss good. Sitting in detention a few days doesn't get your phone or clothing replaced. I'd be making a whole lot of noise until someone at that school and police department got on the ball.
 
Sam D said:
I'm probably not most people, but I'd ask my son what he plans on doing about it.
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:yeahthat:

I'd tell my son to go get the money for a new phone from the kid. Could do it peacefully by going to his house and telling his parents what he did and have them pay for it(prankster kid probably doesn't have an after-school job so he probably doesn't have two nickels to rub together). If not...give the kid a good old fashioned arse-whooping.
 
Let's not bull**** here. It's a "prank" when football players do it.
 
It amazes me how many people would escalate a petty crime -- vandalism -- into a violent crime.

The results may not be what you want. Is a cell phone really worth going to jail over?

Some of this advice is terrible. A crime has been committed, but compounding it with a much more serious crime will have almost exactly the wrong effect.

The right thing to do is file a claim with the school, like an adult.
 
MAKG1 said:
It amazes me how many people would escalate a petty crime -- vandalism -- into a violent crime.

The results may not be what you want. Is a cell phone really worth going to jail over?

Some of this advice is terrible. A crime has been committed, but compounding it with a much more serious crime will have almost exactly the wrong effect.

The right thing to do is file a claim with the school, like an adult.
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Yeah, an adult who wants to waste a lot of his time and get nothing in return, which is exactly what "filing a claim" is going to do. Getting an attorney involved will probably get results quickly. Most districts don't want lawsuits, especially the kind which could lead to public embarrassment.

I do agree that letting the kid(s) deal with it is likely to get you and the kid(s) in hot water. The parents of the original perp would likely have no problem getting the police to come after you and your kid, and have their lawyer on speed dial. After all, what their kid did was just a prank and nobody got hurt, but what your kid did was assault and their kid will now never get that football scholarship due to physical and emotional injuries. Good luck trying to defend yourself in that type of situation. You have to be smarter than the perp, or use the leverage that you have as a parent, which is the ability to hire an attorney.


JKG
 
Here's where we are now. The school is the only one who knows who did it at this point, and they're not talking. I called the police and they had the SRO call me back. She said the damage to the kids' clothes being put in the toilet isn't property damage since they can be washed. I asked if she would wear clothes again if they had been put in the toilet, and she wouldn't respond. She did say that the damage to the phone would be enough to file a police report, but that any copy given to me would have the kids' names blacked out to protect their privacy.

As far as filing a claim with the school, they require parents to sign a liability waiver to participate in the marching band, so that's off the table.

A secretary gave me almost all the info. I have. The principal would give me NO information whatsoever, and was rather hostile. It was the secretary who told me that they didn't lock the doors, which violates their procedures and is to be corrected, and that the coach rushed them and has been lectured to not let that happen again.

I've contemplated having my kids find out who it was by word of mouth and taking them to small claims court. But in court I'd have to have proof - and I have none...the school and police have it all and they're not sharing.

One bright side was that the SRO said that she would talk w/ the principal (who wouldn't take her call at 3:30 this afternoon) tomorrow and ask for permission to talk w/ the kids' parents. She would tell them that criminal charges would not be filed if they reimbursed me for the phone. I'm not sure why she needs the school's permission, but she says that she does.

As for my son taking matters into his own hands, not going to happen. You'd have to know him. He's incredibly timid and would be mortified if he knew I'd even talked with the principal about this.

It's not a huge deal, but it is $100 in clothes and a $600 iphone, nothing I'm willing to just throw away without at least some effort.

And hiring attorney would be fruitless since his time would cost more than we would stand any hope of recovering.
 
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MAKG1 said:
It amazes me how many people would escalate a petty crime -- vandalism -- into a violent crime.

The results may not be what you want. Is a cell phone really worth going to jail over?

Some of this advice is terrible. A crime has been committed, but compounding it with a much more serious crime will have almost exactly the wrong effect.

The right thing to do is file a claim with the school, like an adult.
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But to do nothing won't help either. Slap the little JVs down hard and maybe next time, they won't do the crime. Or you could take it out on the parents. Sure, that helps too. Take it out on the school system. School systems are real good at sweeping this kind of stuff under the rug... and keeping it internal.
I say make the charges fit the crime. Let the courts figure out the correct punishment. And while we're at it, get the school system to change their policy about reporting crime.
 
Make a call or send a letter to the school board or someone on the board. Put a date on when you expect a response.

Point out the facts as simply as you can. Your kid's stuff was vandalized, the school hasn't been cooperative, but you do understand that 1) They know who the perp's were and 2) They didn't follow procedures and lock the locker room when the band were out, so the school has some culpability.

Tell the board that you expect the school to either make good on the phone or to have the parents of the miscreants make good.
 
If the school is protecting the preps, they are accessories-after-the-fact. Name the principal personally. At the very least, they have admitted that are in possession of material evidence (video), that would be subject to a subpoena.
 
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Gerhardt said:
I've contemplated having my kids find out who it was by word of mouth and taking them to small claims court. But in court I'd have to have proof - and I have none...the school and police have it all and they're not sharing.
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I gather they feel they have a legal obligation to not divulge the names of the minors involved, but I would think that their parents are who you would sue, and they are not minors.

I'm wondering if small claims court has any process for plaintiffs to subpoena school officials to testify and/or to force them to make the video evidence available to the court.
 
$700 in clothes and phone * how many kids?

If the school doesn't act soon, a phone call to the local newspaper or TV station letting them know that many thousands of dollars of damage was done to student property and the school is covering it up. That might get some attention.
 
Gerhardt said:
...
As far as filing a claim with the school, they require parents to sign a liability waiver to participate in the marching band, so that's off the table.
...
No it's not. Liability waivers are about the most useless piece of legal mumbo jumbo out there.

They're kids, it's a cell phone. It happens. Thank GOD nobody wanted to press the issue on all the **** we pulled when I was in HS. This is minor by comparison... we just got even... with interest.
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silver-eagle said:
Prank my ass. That's what is wrong these days Minimizing assaults on persons and property by calling it a prank. Like the shootings out on the Arizona highways are a prank. Or the sexual assault of a woman is a prank.
Cops and DAs love to kick up the charges when they can get milage on them. In this case, total the actual replacement value of each item and file a complaint for grand larceny with the police. As we all know, a smartphone's replacement costs could reach $1,000.
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We would have called it a prank in my day, too. But kids didn't have $600 phones in my day because in my day, a $600 phone would have been cheap! I think the kids have changed a lot more than the pranks.
 
Gerhardt said:
My son is in the high school marching band. Friday they were playing at a football game and when they returned to the locker room found that all the kids' clothes were put in the toilets.

I got a call from the cell phone repair shop today saying his phone is beyond repair, so I called the school. The principal said they identified the pranksters from video and have punished them. I asked if they had an incident number for the police so I could get info for reimbursement for property damage for his clothes and iphone. They didn't think a crime had been committed so they didn't call the police. And they can't release the name of the students to me because of their ages.

I called the police to have them help out, but they won't release info because of the kids' ages. I was hoping the police could be an intermediary, but they won't.

WTF? What do most people do in cases like this? (this is below my own insurance deductible, not that I'd file anyway since it would surcharge my policy)
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Either write it off, or contact the DA. It is not up to the police or school to decide whether a crime has been committed, that the duty of the District Attorney. Get a group of the parents together and take it to the DA. Vandalism is a crime everywhere I know of in the U.S., and while one phone adds up to a misdemeanor, a band's worth of phones and personal property likely ads up to a felony. Since DA is an elected position, a group of parents walking into the DA's office may very well see action.
 
Wondering if the school provides a place for the kids to lock up their valuables. What do they do with their wallets?
 
Everskyward said:
Wondering if the school provides a place for the kids to lock up their valuables. What do they do with their wallets?
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I think this was a home game? At my kid's school the marching band met in the band room to get ready, and they had lockers in the hall, and the band room was locked when they left.

From the description above, it sounds like the band met in the same locker room the FB team uses, or maybe a secondary locker room. The band probably did not have assigned lockers because they were already in use for gym class or whoever else uses them. The school said it's supposed to be locked when they leave, so probably they left their bags and backpacks on benches.
 
Matthew said:
I think this was a home game? At my kid's school the marching band met in the band room to get ready, and they had lockers in the hall, and the band room was locked when they left.

From the description above, it sounds like the band met in the same locker room the FB team uses, or maybe a secondary locker room. The band probably did not have assigned lockers because they were already in use for gym class or whoever else uses them. The school said it's supposed to be locked when they leave, so probably they left their bags and backpacks on benches.
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If it's supposed to be locked and wasn't, the school is financially liable for the damages.
 
So was there blasting and pick axes?

Oh, minors....
 
Henning said:
If it's supposed to be locked and wasn't, the school is financially liable for the damages.
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"It was the secretary who told me that they didn't lock the doors, which violates their procedures and is to be corrected, and that the coach rushed them and has been lectured to not let that happen again."

Yeah, and the liability waivers I remember from my kid's band days covered things like injuries, not school negligence and vandalism.
 
Turn it around from being a prank into the dreaded, fearful,word bullying! I would press the SRO to get things done the right way. And then send the school board a detailed account of what happened.
 
Everskyward said:
Wondering if the school provides a place for the kids to lock up their valuables. What do they do with their wallets?
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Yes, they have a locker room with lockers (not sure about locks). Matthew's description is right on. But in this case they were rehearsing for quite a while before hand, and then were rushed into changing into their uniforms and didn't have time to find empty lockers so they all just tossed their clothes on the benches. It wasn't supposed to be a problem because the school was supposed to be locked. The secretary told me that the band director was reprimanded for the time constraint. I'm not sure who was supposed to lock the school, but she said that mistake wouldn't happen again either.

It sounds like I'm making a bigger deal out of this than necessary on here. My wife just wants me to drop it and not stir the coals. In all honesty, it's not a huge deal to me, but I'm not going to just roll over. I have no doubt that if the kids had ruined her phone/property to the tune of $700 that the student info being confidential wouldn't keep her from getting reimbursed. It's just a thorn in my side that she couldn't care less about our loss and acted hostile and aggravated that I even called.
 
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Lindberg said:
We would have called it a prank in my day, too. But kids didn't have $600 phones in my day because in my day, a $600 phone would have been cheap! I think the kids have changed a lot more than the pranks.
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This too.

Please tell me your kid worked and paid for this phone himself?
 
Hey - bullying. That's the way to do it. Maybe play the race card. I'd push it too. I don't like to be ignored.
 
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