Practicing drawing holding patterns and writing five Ts?

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Melissa2983298

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Melissa
Does anyone know where I can find some holding clearances to practice drawing the holding patterns and figuring out the correct entries? I'm really bad with makin them up...

Also, with the five Ts, when you put something for "turn", when do you turn to the assigned radial or it's reciprical? That still really confuses me.

Thank you for your help!!!
 
Do you have a smart phone or tablet? There are some apps for both android and ios, looks like.
 
I know exactly what your talking about. I found the easier option is to sit down with another pilot (don't waste money of an instructor, just a friend who is a pilot) and have him give you random clearances.
 
Get a friend and some approach plates,and go fly a few.
 
AggieMike88 said:
http://www.langleyflyingschool.com/Pages/Holds and Hold Entriesl.html
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That site comes up a lot when you google instrument stuff. Just be warned that it's a Canadian flight school and there are subtle differences between us and them. Not huge, but enough to confuse instrument students.


timwinters said:
That's a pretty nice little refresher. I've never seen a "teardrop" entry referred to as an "offset" entry though. Is that new or something I've missed?

Or?
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Case in point.


Here's another thread that snagged someone:
http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=70762
 
To answer the second part of the question, you turn when you cross the station for the first time and after that when your timer expires.

Note that depending on the entry you may not be turning to a the holding course or its reciprocal. Further you're not turning to the holding course (or it's reciprocal) you're turning to incept/track that course.
 
Clark1961 said:
yabut Tim is from Misery so he gets a pass anything not found on a hillside....:D
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Hey watch it now! I get really mad when I have to quit kissing my sister long enough to post a reply to some jerk picking on me.
 
Bring up the plate in y our GTN 750 and let the plane fly itself.
 
timwinters said:
Hey watch it now! I get really mad when I have to quit kissing my sister long enough to post a reply to some jerk picking on me.
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What? Did yer father get bored with your sister?
 
timwinters said:
Hey watch it now! I get really mad when I have to quit kissing my sister long enough to post a reply to some jerk picking on me.
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Wait a minit...thought you were in Canada, not Alabama.....
 
Melissa2983298 said:
Does anyone know where I can find some holding clearances to practice drawing the holding patterns and figuring out the correct entries? I'm really bad with makin them up...
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Like they said, get someone who knows the format well enough to talk like a controller to flip through the approach book and read you clearances for the holds depicted.

Also, with the five Ts, when you put something for "turn", when do you turn to the assigned radial or it's reciprical? That still really confuses me.
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If you're tracking inbound, put the radial on the bottom (both CDI and heading indicator). If you're tracking outbound, put the radial on the top. So, if you have to track the 151 radial inbound, turn to put 151 on the bottom of the HI, then when you get to "twist", twist 151 to the bottom of the CDI. The reciprocal will take care of itself.
 
Thanks for asking Melissa...I just started learning this stuff as well. Downloaded the app for $3.99 and started practicing. Need to get my head around the idea that looking at it from a heading of North vs. the aircraft's actual heading is a bit different in how you draw the lines for teardrop, parallel, or direct...
 
Thank you very much everyone! The app was EXTREMELY helpful and made things more clear! Thanks again!
 
murphey said:
Wait a minit...thought you were in Canada, not Alabama.....
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It's SE Missouri. It's not as bad as the "boot heel" (i.e., the part down at the extreme SE corner of the state which, if Missouri ceded it to Arkansas, would raise the IQ of both states) but it's close. :yes:
 
I once did a set of flash cards with holding clearances (still have the 11 year old template). Shuffle the deck, pull one out and do it based on where you are relative to the holding fix.
 
Ron Levy said:
Like they said, get someone who knows the format well enough to talk like a controller to flip through the approach book and read you clearances for the holds depicted.

If you're tracking inbound, put the radial on the bottom (both CDI and heading indicator). If you're tracking outbound, put the radial on the top. So, if you have to track the 151 radial inbound, turn to put 151 on the bottom of the HI, then when you get to "twist", twist 151 to the bottom of the CDI. The reciprocal will take care of itself.
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I watched the video cited above and said to myself "got it." Then re-read the posts and got here and became :confused:

Is the knob twisting just for a reminder? Is it necessary? I am willing to concede that I'm missing something here...help a brotha out.
 
Jaybird180 said:
I watched the video cited above and said to myself "got it." Then re-read the posts and got here and became :confused:

Is the knob twisting just for a reminder? Is it necessary? I am willing to concede that I'm missing something here...help a brotha out.
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I think Ron was trying to simplify the inbound/outbound situation. Rather than thinking "OK, I'm on the 137 radial inbound... what should my TO indicator show?" and then doing the math to figure out you should have 317 TO... he's suggesting you just worry about where you put the 137 on the CDI. If you're headed FROM the station, put the radial on top. If you're headed TO it, put the radial on the bottom (and the top, being 180 degrees opposite will automatically figure itself out vs. doing the math above).
 
Jaybird180 said:
Is the knob twisting just for a reminder? Is it necessary? I am willing to concede that I'm missing something here...help a brotha out.
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If you don't twist the OBS knob on the CDI to the desired course, how are you going to track the desired radial?
 
mjburian said:
I think Ron was trying to simplify the inbound/outbound situation. Rather than thinking "OK, I'm on the 137 radial inbound... what should my TO indicator show?" and then doing the math to figure out you should have 317 TO... he's suggesting you just worry about where you put the 137 on the CDI. If you're headed FROM the station, put the radial on top. If you're headed TO it, put the radial on the bottom (and the top, being 180 degrees opposite will automatically figure itself out vs. doing the math above).
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That is exactly why I recommend this technique. Too many people have too much trouble coming up with the reciprocal in a hurry while flying the plane. This way, all you have to do is remember inbound means radial on the bottom, and outbound means radial at the top -- no "+200, -20" and then maybe +/- 360 to boot in your head while flying the plane or anything like that.
 
I think I get what you're saying now and think the reason some get confused is really because of weak VOR interpretation skills (to/from flag specifically) since the inbound course was put at the bottom of the CDI.
 
Jaybird180 said:
I think I get what you're saying now and think the reason some get confused is really because of weak VOR interpretation skills (to/from flag specifically) since the inbound course was put at the bottom of the CDI.
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Well, I can't say I fully understand what you just said, but as long as you always head the right way on the right radial, whatever you're doing is working, so don't change a thing.
 
In that case, I'll make sure to put in some VOR Nav practice to ensure I always go the right way. :D
 
Why draw it?

The proper entry is the easiest one
 
midlifeflyer said:
You answered your own question: because for some, drawing it is the easiest way to visualize which is the easiest one.
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Especially those learning how to visualize the hold and entry. Draw it out a few dozen (hundred?) times, and eventually you don't need to draw it anymore, but with an IR trainee like the OP, it's the journey, not the destination, we're talking about here.
 
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