Police shooting dogs

I have nothing against "public servants", what I am against is the sheer numbers of them. Why do we need so many people to govern us?

Ask yourself and your neighbors. You hired them.
Why are police officers convinced they are our masters, rather than public servants?
Brrrrp.

My real thought is, we need people to manage the affairs of our country, that is a given. What I question is, why does a free people need so much governing?

John
There is a branch of science dedicated to the study of this question, called sociology.
 
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Ok not that anyone has asked but I will through out my $.02. First of all saying that ALL cops think they are rulers is not only rediculous but seems to show you do not know many police officers. As with any profession, when you have a large number of people not everyone is going to be a boy scout. As far as can you "arrest" a police officer, I for one would not recommened that you approach an officer that has just drawn his weapon because he thought his life was in danger. It will not end well for you. I would absolutely encourage anyone that observes an officer doing something that they believe is wrong to contact that officer superior SGT or etc and have them investigate the matter. Alot of the larger police departments do have internal affairs branches and believe me they are not going to just let it go because the person is an officer. There job is to police the police. I can tell you from a police officer that there is nothing or no one that I hate more than a "dirty cop". As far as the officer that shot the dogs, I was not there so I can not and will not judge them. I would hope they do get investigated and if they are found to be guilty of wrongdoing I would hope they would receive disiplinary action against them.

I know most of you on this board do not seem to be anti cop however I did feel compelled to reply to this thread. Saying that we are all on a power trip or think we rule the rest of the people is absolutely appauling to most officers. I would equate it to saying that all airline pilots are drunks or over sleep and miss airports. Basically what I am trying to convey is that you shouldnt judge all of us by the actions of a few. Ok I will get off my soap box now.
 
Ben,

Though I agree that whole thing is bizarre, how is he "toast"?

Just google the case and follow the actions he is up against, both legally and careerwise.. He might be be able to work at Walmart as a greeter but holding another law enforcement job is slim to non,,,,, and slim left town last year. :yesnod:
 
N801BH said:
Just google the case and follow the actions he is up against, both legally and careerwise.. He might be be able to work at Walmart as a greeter but holding another law enforcement job is slim to non,,,,, and slim left town last year. :yesnod:
Ok I was just going on the article.

This one is not much like the others linked. Though I could see an old school sheriff taking care of business this way...
 
Brrrrp.

.

After this response I decided to move my original post that I had deleted over to the spin zone where it belongs. It is apparently very controversial.

A few years ago a young pilot from Los Angeles went to Vancouver, Canada to take his private check ride. He was only fourteen at the time, and unable to get it here. When asked what he thought of Vancouver, he asked, "where are all the police?"

In Europe, several cities have been experimenting with the need for traffic control. They have removed all traffic signs, including stop signs, all traffic lights, crosswalks, everything. The accident and fatality rate has dropped by seventy percent.

Not every country feels they need army sized police forces to manage their cites.

John
 
Ask yourself and your neighbors. You hired them.

Well, not quite. As most civil servants will tell you if you use that fateful phrase: "you work for me" or "I pay your salary", the civil servants work for the government. They are hired by the government (typically an unelected bureaucrat in higher office). While the elected officials control the budget and set the laws, they don't hire 'em either ('least not in most places).

I will also point you to the "what do we cut" thread to see how hard it is to reduce the numbers. It is FAR easier to not do a program than it is to eliminate it later. Budget cuts cause headlines about people who will suffer. You hear far less noise when a corporation cuts.

In fact , the larger the community/the more the governing body covers the harder it is for you and your neighbors to insist on any cuts. :mad2:
 
Let's say someone saw Piper attacking your SO and called 911 about the dog attack. When the cop arrived, he sees her covered in blood and the the dog comes after him. What's he supposed to do? Offer him a doggie treat?

Defense from Richard in 3...2...1....

"He's just doing his job!"
 
Let's say someone saw Piper attacking your SO and called 911 about the dog attack. When the cop arrived, he sees her covered in blood and the the dog comes after him. What's he supposed to do? Offer him a doggie treat?

No, he's supposed to shoot the dog.

Now, Piper sitting, like a good dog, Officer walks up, and Piper, as he always did, runs up to lick the officer. What should the officer do?

According to Richard and most of the rest of the force, put 5 slugs in his head, spit on his body, and then claim self defense.
 
SkyHog said:
No, he's supposed to shoot the dog.

Now, Piper sitting, like a good dog, Officer walks up, and Piper, as he always did, runs up to lick the officer. What should the officer do?

According to Richard and most of the rest of the force, put 5 slugs in his head, spit on his body, and then claim self defense.

Richard who? I've just wanted to know what the Internet tough guy citizen's arrest dude is going to charge these police officers with after the official review has cleared them.
Edit: I mean beyond the horizon of his fantasy world.
 
And there's no record of what I think (based on 9 years of PD management rather than a few sensationalist internet posts) are the thousands of cases each year when any injuries to the dogs are prevented by officers, many of whom are dog owners themselves.

I had to make the call on every disciplinary action in our department, and tolerated no misbehavior, especially if it was intentional or premeditated. If you've studied LE training, you know that street cops often don't have much time to decide what to do in such situations, and you would also know that dogs are very hard targets to hit. I'm willing to bet whatever you want that severe dog bites to officers highly outnumber dog shootings by officers every year.


No, he's supposed to shoot the dog.

Now, Piper sitting, like a good dog, Officer walks up, and Piper, as he always did, runs up to lick the officer. What should the officer do?

According to Richard and most of the rest of the force, put 5 slugs in his head, spit on his body, and then claim self defense.
 
Then I'm sure you can quote me saying anything of the sort.

Am I mistaken, I thought you were a police officer. Is that not what your whole defense is about?

"They couldn't have done anything wrong, they're cops!"

Afterall, you were passing judgment without even reading the stories, just based on "Without cause" and "cleared of all wrongdoing."

I assume that same rash judgment applies when a chihuahua runs up to you yipping, right? No worries, you'll be investigated "fairly" by your fellow officers at a later date, and I'm sure their judgment will be fair, like it is every other time, right?
 
SkyHog said:
Am I mistaken, I thought you were a police officer. Is that not what your whole defense is about?

"They couldn't have done anything wrong, they're cops!"

Afterall, you were passing judgment without even reading the stories, just based on "Without cause" and "cleared of all wrongdoing."

I assume that same rash judgment applies when a chihuahua runs up to you yipping, right? No worries, you'll be investigated "fairly" by your fellow officers at a later date, and I'm sure their judgment will be fair, like it is every other time, right?
So... you can't quote me?
 
And there's no record of what I think (based on 9 years of PD management rather than a few sensationalist internet posts) are the thousands of cases each year when any injuries to the dogs are prevented by officers, many of whom are dog owners themselves.

I had to make the call on every disciplinary action in our department, and tolerated no misbehavior, especially if it was intentional or premeditated. If you've studied LE training, you know that street cops often don't have much time to decide what to do in such situations, and you would also know that dogs are very hard targets to hit. I'm willing to bet whatever you want that severe dog bites to officers highly outnumber dog shootings by officers every year.
Wayne, don't waste your breath, man - the guys that are making the outlandish and ugly statements about police already know what they think that they think and aren't open to actual information - you give 'em some actual information and they just exaggerate everything you're trying to say and mis-state what you are thinking. It's dumb, but what are you gonna do, you know? :rolleyes:

Anyone more than 7 minutes into their first patrol shift knows that mess they're spouting is bullsht, but again, what can we do? :rolleyes:
 
Best I can tell, these boards are EOO's. Whatever crap they peddle, they can expect to get back. It's easy to parrot all the answers when you don't understand any of the questions.

Wayne, don't waste your breath, man - the guys that are making the outlandish and ugly statements about police already know what they think that they think and aren't open to actual information - you give 'em some actual information and they just exaggerate everything you're trying to say and mis-state what you are thinking. It's dumb, but what are you gonna do, you know? :rolleyes:

Anyone more than 7 minutes into their first patrol shift knows that mess they're spouting is bullsht, but again, what can we do? :rolleyes:
 
etsisk said:
Wayne, don't waste your breath, man - the guys that are making the outlandish and ugly statements about police already know what they think that they think and aren't open to actual information - you give 'em some actual information and they just exaggerate everything you're trying to say and mis-state what you are thinking. It's dumb, but what are you gonna do, you know? :rolleyes:

Anyone more than 7 minutes into their first patrol shift knows that mess they're spouting is bullsht, but again, what can we do? :rolleyes:
Well, having finally gotten all the links to work this morning, I think there is room to agree that all four are sad situations. And the one in Idaho too. Much worse than the others. But of course we have to dramatize them into something they're not.

In real life you can sometimes learn as much about what someone is thinking by what they don't say as what they do say. On web boards, not so much. So, Nick, afaik you don't know what I think beyond my opinion of your ridiculous theories about citizens arrest.

I love my iPhone, my airplane, my mother, my wife, my dogs, my country and my fellow man - and even my wife's cat - each in their own measure and way. I don't get my feelings for them mixed up, and just I don't get those who do.

Pets and livestock are considered property in the eyes of the law. They aren't human and Clark whatsyournumber I reserve most of my humanity for humans. Inasmuch as I would be terribly sad and angry if someone ran over my dog, or shot it in self defense, I'm not going to be assigning human values to my loss. If we were to do that we should be redirecting the tremendous energy we apply in this country on antiabortion and human rights initiatives to the thousands of dogs and cats destroyed as nuisances in the pounds and shelters.

So when it comes to self defense, the bar is lower when it comes to animals. Sorry.

Police mistakes and misconduct need to be addressed. Even if there was misconduct, with the exception of the Idaho case (and that is pretty iffy - wasnt long ago that was SOP in rural areas) I don't see criminal conduct. That leaves civil liability. What is the value of your dog? We'll write you a check.

Point being, strip away everything but the legal aspects and you get what you got.
 
Wayne, don't waste your breath, man - the guys that are making the outlandish and ugly statements about police already know what they think that they think and aren't open to actual information - you give 'em some actual information and they just exaggerate everything you're trying to say and mis-state what you are thinking. It's dumb, but what are you gonna do, you know? :rolleyes:

Anyone more than 7 minutes into their first patrol shift knows that mess they're spouting is bullsht, but again, what can we do? :rolleyes:

And when a non-officer presents a personal situation that happened, you get called a liar by the officers, saying that could never happen, and blindly defend the two dirtbags that ruin some kid's life. It goes both ways Tom. Don't pretend because you or Wayne are (ex) cops your **** doesn't stink.
 
Well, having finally gotten all the links to work this morning, I think there is room to agree that all four are sad situations. And the one in Idaho too. Much worse than the others. But of course we have to dramatize them into something they're not.

In real life you can sometimes learn as much about what someone is thinking by what they don't say as what they do say. On web boards, not so much. So, Nick, afaik you don't know what I think beyond my opinion of your ridiculous theories about citizens arrest.

I love my iPhone, my airplane, my mother, my wife, my dogs, my country and my fellow man - and even my wife's cat - each in their own measure and way. I don't get my feelings for them mixed up, and just I don't get those who do.

Pets and livestock are considered property in the eyes of the law. They aren't human and Clark whatsyournumber I reserve most of my humanity for humans. Inasmuch as I would be terribly sad and angry if someone ran over my dog, or shot it in self defense, I'm not going to be assigning human values to my loss. If we were to do that we should be redirecting the tremendous energy we apply in this country on antiabortion and human rights initiatives to the thousands of dogs and cats destroyed as nuisances in the pounds and shelters.

So when it comes to self defense, the bar is lower when it comes to animals. Sorry.

Police mistakes and misconduct need to be addressed. Even if there was misconduct, with the exception of the Idaho case (and that is pretty iffy - wasnt long ago that was SOP in rural areas) I don't see criminal conduct. That leaves civil liability. What is the value of your dog? We'll write you a check.

Point being, strip away everything but the legal aspects and you get what you got.

What I don't get is how normal citizens can get hit with animal abouse/cruelty, etc, and if cop puts down a dog, it's an "oh well" situation.
 
I've fired cops for a lot less than shooting a dog. Any abuse of power by law enforcement people is unacceptable, and should be dealt with accordingly. And I'm not an ex-cop, I'm an ex-commissioner of a department that was organized with a private citizens in charge of personnel issues in order to assure that personnel problems weren't entrusted to the high-ups in the departement.
And when a non-officer presents a personal situation that happened, you get called a liar by the officers, saying that could never happen, and blindly defend the two dirtbags that ruin some kid's life. It goes both ways Tom. Don't pretend because you or Wayne are (ex) cops your **** doesn't stink.
 
I've fired cops for a lot less than shooting a dog. Any abuse of power by law enforcement people is unacceptable, and should be dealt with accordingly. And I'm not an ex-cop, I'm an ex-commissioner of a department that was organized with a private citizens in charge of personnel issues in order to assure that personnel problems weren't entrusted to the high-ups in the departement.

Well it's a little hard to prove anything when it's the word of a 17 year old kid vs two cops. Who are you gonna believe?
 
I've dealt with good cops and bad cops. Certain like the rest of us humans none are perfect and most I think are just trying to do their job. That said, the number of bad experiences I've had (including walking up to a cop and asking a simple question like directions) have been profoundly negative. This may be influenced by my New York City upbringing.

Three things cops can do to improve public image:

1) Be polite (I think this is less of an issue in places outside of New York)
2) Stop breaking traffic rules just because they can when they'd pull any non-cop over and ticket him/her in a heartbeat
3) At least pretend they're going to do something about the report you filed. I've had cops outright tell me that they can't do anything about a drunk driver hitting my friend's car when I got the license plate. "That doesn't prove who did it, someone else could have borrowed the car." Wait, what?

Those of us who aren't public servants are expected to be polite to our customers even when they aren't polite to us. We are customers of cops. Why should it be different?
 
Well it's a little hard to prove anything when it's the word of a 17 year old kid vs two cops. Who are you gonna believe?

And that is part of the problem with police policing themselves. Absent all other evidence (no video, no audio, no witnesses), a police officer gets irritated with a teenager and beats the crap out of him.

Then he arrests the teen for assault on an officer, despite no assault ever happening.

Who will the "independent" internal affairs group side with? Its sure not going to be the teenager.

Or, this happens:

Cop stops for directions (ie, has no business being where he was in the first place). Gets out, sees a dog charging, shoots it, drives away without any other action. The "trustworthy" internal affairs department claims self defense until she lets them know she has video. Then they change their story.

But yeah, I'm going to go ahead and trust the internal affairs dept.
 
I have nothing against "public servants", what I am against is the sheer numbers of them. Why do we need so many people to govern us?

Why are police officers convinced they are our masters, rather than public servants?

My real thought is, we need people to manage the affairs of our country, that is a given. What I question is, why does a free people need so much governing?

John

Because John that is what today's "people" want. I am not a fan of it either, but I do not go out and make blanket statements about cops because of it.

I was a cop, knew/know many...some a good, some are bad, most are surprisingly "middle-of-road" and see their job as just that, a job.
 
Cop stops for directions (ie, has no business being where he was in the first place).

EXCUSE me Nick? He, like anyone else, can stop and ask directions. Yes you (HUMAN) can ask him to leave but come on man....he is stopping to ask for directions and you pull this anti-authority, anti-government, "who the hell does he think he IS" crap.....for stopping to ASK DIRECTIONS?!


Gets out, sees a dog charging, shoots it,

By your statement...and the video, the dog DID charge him. You cannot tell a dog to stop and expect them to listen, you cannot warn them, you cannot REASON with them. If I, as a civilian, pull in front of your house and get out to ask directions and your dog charges me....I will shoot it Nick, plain and simple.


drives away without any other action.

He was WRONG for doing that, period. He should have called dispatch and his supervisor and advised them of the situation. For that he should be reprimanded.

The "trustworthy" internal affairs department claims self defense until she lets them know she has video. Then they change their story.

But yeah, I'm going to go ahead and trust the internal affairs dept.

This is all conjecture based on the statements of a party deeply and emotionally involved. I am not saying she may not be telling the truth, but I also take her statements with a grain of salt.

I have also see works like "murdered" bandied about in regards to killing a dog...sorry, you can never, ever murder a dog. We must quit this over-humanization of animals (and I am one hell of an animal lover....got two cats and love my friends dogs)...but this is getting ridiculous.
 
By your statement...and the video, the dog DID charge him. You cannot tell a dog to stop and expect them to listen, you cannot warn them, you cannot REASON with them. If I, as a civilian, pull in front of your house and get out to ask directions and your dog charges me....I will shoot it Nick, plain and simple.


If you can't tell, maybe you shouldn't be carrying. I have had more dogs come at me than I can count, and I have never, ever been unable to tell whether it was coming at me to attack me, coming at me because I was someone to play with, or just doing what most dogs do, chasing me off the property, and once I leave their territory they leave me alone. My dog does that with everything. Rabbits, deer, birds, utility reader. Chases the rabbits, deer, and birds, until the property line, and then stops and watches em till they are no longer a threat to his turf. With the meter reader, or other stranger, he will bark and bark and growl, and intimidate, until the guy gets in his car and starts to back out of the driveway, then he's back his his normal "I'm a 90lb lapdog" self.

You don't like it? Stay off of my property.

If the cops can't tell, maybe they should find a new line of work. Reading animals isn't that hard to do. Taking it to the next level, what happens when someone who doesn't speak english comes running at them screaming hysterically? "I was afraid for my life, so I blew em away." Nevermind the possibility was that they were screaming for help for x, y, or z reasons.
 
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Dunno. It can go either way. My cops had to agree to polygraphs. Does the kid?

Well it's a little hard to prove anything when it's the word of a 17 year old kid vs two cops. Who are you gonna believe?
 
Dunno. It can go either way. My cops had to agree to polygraphs. Does the kid?

Wayne, I have no doubt that you kept a tight ship for the cops you were in charge of. You must spend your time doing something since you never found time to paint your plane. :D

You also point out - your cops had to agree to things. That doesn't mean that other cops did or did not. Standards vary from district to district, and with that comes a different view of cops. In NYC people either fear cops or hate them as a rule, I never came across any who actually liked them. The nice ones I come across are typically in the mid-west.
 
I see much of this as an unfortunate and unwelcome side effect of the war on drugs. As narcotics became more expensive, those distributing and selling them had more money to purchase more effective weapons, and more of them. This resulted in the authorities engaging with military tactics with increased firepower. As I understand it, a fad with the criminal set was to have large dogs like pit bulls and rottweilers. These were often trained (or possibly likely simply due to their treatment) to attack strangers. Unfortunately, most of this takes place in areas that house the socio-economically disadvantaged, and is unlikely to change in the near future.

I certainly can't blame the officers in every instance. Any dog is likely to run toward a strange person, if for no other reason than curiosity. The officer won't be able to tell the animal's intent until it is too late, thus some animals wind up getting shot inappropriately.
 
If I, as a civilian, pull in front of your house and get out to ask directions and your dog charges me....I will shoot it Nick, plain and simple.
If I walked onto someones private property in a rural area and the dog "charged me" I sure wouldn't shoot the thing. I'm on its turf and I chose to put myself there. Shoot the wrong man's dog on someone's private rural property and you might end up like the dog.

OTOH - I'd be less forgiving if a dog aggressively charged me on public property. If I saw it attack someone and it was continuing it's aggression it would be ended as well.

Shooting a charging dog with a hand gun wouldn't exactly be that damn easy either. I'd much rather get away from the dog then get close enough to shoot it.

I've never really confused a dogs intentions though. I met a LOT of farm dogs when I was going door to door trying to sell aerial pictures on farms a few years back. The vast majority were just trying to tell me hello and every once and awhile there would be a dog that I wasn't comfortable with and I'd just move on down the road.
 
I've been charged by all sorts of dogs on roadways while riding bike.

Pennsylvania has a statewide 'leash law" (Actually, you must "control" your pet), so a dog running after a runner or cyclist on a road is no longer controlled.

Should the dog bite or knock someone down, the owner will be paying (or should, if the injured party sues).

My technique for dog avoidance (this has included BIG shepherds and one ridiciculously demonic pit bull) is to wait until the dog is about a yard or so away and then YELL as loud as possible "NO!!!!"

Stops every dog for at least a moment -- giving me time to vamoose.

Of course I have a rather loud, deep voice so that helps, but I think the sudden "NO!" command causes enough confusion that it provides time and space -- both critical in avoiding or defending against a dog attack.

It also works for getting a horse's attention, BTW.
 
If you can't tell, maybe you shouldn't be carrying. I have had more dogs come at me than I can count, and I have never, ever been unable to tell whether it was coming at me to attack me, coming at me because I was someone to play with, or just doing what most dogs do, chasing me off the property, and once I leave their territory they leave me alone. My dog does that with everything. Rabbits, deer, birds, utility reader. Chases the rabbits, deer, and birds, until the property line, and then stops and watches em till they are no longer a threat to his turf. With the meter reader, or other stranger, he will bark and bark and growl, and intimidate, until the guy gets in his car and starts to back out of the driveway, then he's back his his normal "I'm a 90lb lapdog" self.

You don't like it? Stay off of my property.

If the cops can't tell, maybe they should find a new line of work. Reading animals isn't that hard to do. Taking it to the next level, what happens when someone who doesn't speak english comes running at them screaming hysterically? "I was afraid for my life, so I blew em away." Nevermind the possibility was that they were screaming for help for x, y, or z reasons.

I'm very good at reading animals myself, Ed. When I was in college and for some time thereafter I worked off-and-on doing animal control in Upstate New York. I had a good friend in that business, and it was decent-paying work that no one wanted to do; so I'd do it when I needed some extra cash.

I dealt with everything from chipmunks to bears, although raccoons, bobcats, and so forth were the most common, along with stray dogs and feral cats. After a relatively short time dealing with animals, you do get to understand their lingo; and with this understanding, I believe, comes a certain amount of confidence and clarity of intention that the animal is able to comprehend. We give off pheromones, too, after all.

On the one hand, I don't know if its completely fair to expect a police officer to have that acquired ability to communicate with animals, because it's not something I suppose they're trained in. In addition, because of a cop's training and job, I doubt that the pheromones they're exuding when they see a dog "attacking" are conveying the message, "Come on, puppy! Let's play!" I have profound respect for police officers, possibly because my own interactions with them have been overwhelmingly positive. But I also understand that cops, like soldiers, exist in a world that requires a certain amount of what in any other job would be considered borderline paranoia.

On the other hand, anyone who deals with the public (including myself) really should learn to deal with the public's dogs. In my case, it's easy. I read the dog's posture, usually let it sniff the back of my hand, and verbally explain why I'm there. I have no idea how much they understand, but it always works. It's a rare thing for me to ask someone to restrain their dog. More often, the dogs sit or lie down next to me while I work, sometimes assuming a watchful posture, but usually not.

I also wonder why police officers don't carry Halt! or whatever the popular dog repellent is these days. I used to carry it when I did animal control, even though I also carried a gun. The reason was because I would prefer to stun an animal, especially a domestic one, than kill it. I never actually used the Halt! (nor the gun for that matter, except for putting down a few rabid or seriously injured animals), but I'm told by others that it works very well and is much easier than shooting a moving animal.

The fact that cops don't carry dog repellent, despite being in a job that does require quite a bit of contact with citizens' dogs (and other dogs), suggests to me that their departments have a tacit policy of using lethal means as the first course of action when the officer is in doubt as to a dog's disposition or intent. Is that a sensible policy? I really don't know, having not been a cop. But in general, I think most people believe it's better not to kill someone's pet unless you really have to.

The other thing I wonder about is along the lines of Ed's earlier question. If I, as a civilian, were to pull up, uninvited, to someone's private property to ask for directions, see their dog running toward me, and fatally shoot their dog when another option existed, I think I would face some sort of legal consequences.

In the video, it's clear that the officer had the option of getting back in the car (or not getting out of it in the first place). Remember that the officer could see the dog before it became visible in the video's field of view. Possibly he could see the dog before he even got out of the car, and certainly he saw it before it got so close that the video picked it up. There were no exigent circumstances that required him to quickly get past the dog and to the house. He was stopping to ask for directions, not responding to an emergency.

When I pull up to a driveway and see a dog on the porch, my SOP is to open the door very slightly, then start to step out of the car, and see how the dog reacts. If I am at all in doubt, I close the door and wait for the owner to advise. That's rare. Most times I just introduce myself to the dog and explain my reason for being there, and the dog escorts me to the door. But the point is that I understand that even a "friendly" dog is still a dog, and is doing his dogly duty by protecting his family's home. So I exercise caution.

Now, I'm not all that smart a guy, so I find it surprising that a police officer wouldn't use pretty much the same sort of procedure in that situation. In fact, I find it hard to understand the way the cop acted in the video. I'm at a loss to come up with an explanation other than a profound lack of concern for a citizen's "property" (which is how the law views pets). He took absolutely no actions -- none at all -- to avoid the use of lethal force against the animal. To me, this reflects an attitude that is cavalier -- at best -- and doesn't speak well of the deputy's fitness for the job.

-Rich
 
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By your statement...and the video, the dog DID charge him. You cannot tell a dog to stop and expect them to listen, you cannot warn them, you cannot REASON with them. If I, as a civilian, pull in front of your house and get out to ask directions and your dog charges me....I will shoot it Nick, plain and simple.
Bah whatever. The dog was not charging him. The dog's course was to run by him like dog's do. They run around, people, yay people, excited, run run run! It's clear in the video that he was on a course to run by him.

It's also clear the officer could have got back into his car with plenty of time to spare.

I'm not one to put the police at fault for everything but I have a hard time defending them in that video.
 
It was offered that the kid volunteered to take a polygraph. The judge said it was not admissable in court. When asked why, he said it was only admissable in rape cases. What the ??????. I'm sorry the whole system stinks when the cops,judge, prosecutor have it all figured out and planned before the hearing or trial.
The new system when I become "king" will be the use of sodium pentathal for both plantiff and defendant.
"Did you do it" "Yes" ok your guilty.
" Did you do it" "No" ok your off the hook.
Simple , cost effective, fair, no more buddy buddy, good old boy, I'm running for re election ,etc,etc.etc. bull crap on either side.
I like good cop's, despise one's that make things up, or enhance what they determine to be needed for the prosecution. Worse yet are prosecutors that push things through to look good at election time. Judge's well, God will sort them out ,there will be a few that spend time in a very warm place in their eternal retirement years.
I do agree with a previous post that some out there are humanizing animals way to much, shooting a few dogs and cats? Where's all the b--ing
about all the dog's and cats eaten in the far east? HUh ?
I'm for PITA (people eating tasty animals):yesnod:
 
Because John that is what today's "people" want. I am not a fan of it either, but I do not go out and make blanket statements about cops because of it.

I was a cop, knew/know many...some a good, some are bad, most are surprisingly "middle-of-road" and see their job as just that, a job.

I've never been a cop, although years ago a friend tried to talk me into joining the SDPD. Lets see now, civilians making blanket statements about cops. I makes me wonder if cops make blanket statements about "civilians". Do you think that could be possible?

"If their lips are moving, they're lying" I know is one of them. I'll bet there are more.

I think blanket statements are double edge sword. Both civilians and cops use them in descriptive terms of each other. The difference between civilians and police are that police are expected to be held at higher standards of conduct than civilians, that is why they are referred to as "officers".

When one cop does not live up to his expected standards, all cops pay the price. That price also creates a division between the police and the policed, with bitterness on both sides.

Police officers should police their own, and I'm not talking internal affairs, I'm talking the guy sitting next to them. Silence is approval.

No matter how you slice the cake, people who pack are scary to those who don't. It does not matter if they have a badge or not, they are regarded with suspicion by many of those who do not pack. Good guy, bad guy, it's best to avoid them.

A few years back there was a thing going around San Diego that said if you are confronted by a San Diego police officer, your life was at risk. From the SDPDs history, that is a very reasonable statement.

It does not take much for a barrel of shiny fresh apples to go bad. If I remember right, it only takes one bad apple. The other apples just sit there, they don't say a thing, as they too, slowly turn bad.

John
 
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I wonder how many people posting in this thread go to court to fight traffic tickets.
 
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