Pilot's Roadrage

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bigblockz8

Pre-takeoff checklist
Joined
Nov 8, 2011
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Gore
So headed to the airfield today since I was in the area and I do not get to go to KGAI often. About two miles away this little red car is blaring it's horn at me. I am driving on a two lane road with a speed limit of 45mph, I am in the slow lane doing 52mph, no traffic to my left! The guy rides my a** for a good mile and then pulls up next to me. He throws a few water bottles at us. My mom flips out and gets upset telling me to floor it and slow down in front of him to **** him off (as the two lanes were going to merge soon).

Light turns green and I go normally, fully expecting the guy to floor his little Aveo. He doesn't, he was too preoccupied with giving me the finger and yelling. He starts swerving as if he is going to hit us and I slow down, this guy is a nut. He slows down and I end up in front of him. I continue to the airport. Keep in mind that this nut still has his horn going.

I arrive at the airport and pull in at the bottom lot. He pulls in next to us! He gets out yelling and throws more trash at us. The guy is five foot two and resembles Dale Gribble from King of the Hill... My mom is out of the car and falls out laughing. She tells him to "get back into your little clown car before your napoleon syndrome gets you in trouble." He grabs his flight bag and enters through the gate...

:eek: He's a pilot! He starts the 172 and taxis out whilst giving me the finger.

I have to wonder why he got upset when he could have easily passed me on the road. If he's that angry on the ground, what about in the air!?!?!?

Here is a stock photo of this tough guy's car:
ls-sedan-front-side.jpg


I get that he may have a weapon or be crazy but it is rather hard to take a five foot two guy serious when he hops out of this tiny little red car.

(If I had to drive the little Aveo in order to own an airplane I would and heck, I'd even drive a hot pink one with wire hangars for door locks.)

Stupid Question: Does Air-rage exist?
 
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See, that is the reason I don't conceal carry, I would have put a double tap at his forehead. That's why I thought Hannibal Lector was a hero, he ate the rude. :D

Every driver in the western world needs to drive one hour, and ride a scooter for 2 days in Jakarta . They will experience traffic the likes of which I have seen no other (neither had my crew from Bombay). They will also experience how safe things are on that scooter when there is no road rage at all. A quick double tap and people make a little space if they can, if not they just take it as a warning it's close there and try not to encroach further. It's pretty cool; I spent about 4 months total there. Interesting study with all the similarities to Los Angeles.
 
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Ok, that's funny right there. Your mom sounds like a gas. :D

Boy, if that car just had a chin scoop and a spoiler, he would be a cute little bad-ass in a clown car. :mad2:

In all seriousness, you may want to ask around about that guy. He's the type who seems more than capable of killing someone in the sky as well as on the ground. I'd stear clear of him.
 
Henning said:
See, that is the reason I don't conceal carry, I would have put a double tap at his forehead. That's why I thought Hannibal Lector was a hero, he ate the rude. :D

Every driver in the western world needs to drive one hour, and ride a scooter for 2 days in Jakarta . They will experience traffic the likes of which I have seen no other (neither had my crew from Bombay). They will also experience how safe things are on that scooter when there is no road rage at all. A quick double tap and people make a little space if they can, if not they just take it as a warning it's close there and try not to encroach further. It's pretty cool; I spent about 4 months total there. Interesting study with all the similarities to Los Angeles.
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What's a double tap?
 
Palmpilot said:
What's a double tap?
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Two shot in quick succession; standard protocol if you're gonna shoot someone. If you shoot, you shoot to kill, so if you shoot you put 2 bullets in them to make sure the job is done.

I have seen wheels shot at but rarely hit, I did once have a back window shattered on a repo way back when, but that's it.
 
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I'm not saying you did anything wrong, but what set the guy off?

Throwing stuff at you is assault. Call the cops and make a report.
 
Why is that driving anything special beyond normal driving nowadays? This is the year of aggressive hostile driving. Give it another 3 months and you'll likely get a ticket for not driving aggressively and running people off the road.
 
fgcason said:
Why is that driving anything special beyond normal driving nowadays? This is the year of aggressive hostile driving. Give it another 3 months and you'll likely get a ticket for not driving aggressively and running people off the road.
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Jakarta really is amazing, complete gridlock, scooters everywhere and no rage or injuries. The place is the size and population density of LA with similar climatic, ecological, and economic influences. The difference in everything is night and day, it's like an equatorial opposite rather than polar.:dunno:
 
Henning said:
Jakarta really is amazing, complete gridlock, scooters everywhere and no rage or injuries. The place is the size and population density of LA with similar climatic, ecological, and economic influences. The difference in everything is night and day, it's like an equatorial opposite rather than polar.:dunno:
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I'm actually looking forward to riding a motorcycle in those countries. Here you can be the only person on the road for 50 miles and they'll run you down then still be mad at you for being in their way.

Anyone have a used sherman tank for sale that I can drive to/from work? It's a warzone out there.
 
fgcason said:
I'm actually looking forward to riding a motorcycle in those countries. Here you can be the only person on the road for 50 miles and they'll run you down then still be mad at you for being in their way.

Anyone have a used sherman tank for sale that I can drive to/from work? It's a warzone out there.
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There was a dude in San Diego once that took off in an M1A1:rofl: You're gonna need an International Drivers License for Indonesia or you'll get tickets. Not so bad except Bali where you get targeted for 'driving while white'. You ride 175cc 20-24" wheel scooters with a leg pass through, these are the best thing to use, you want the leg pass though for when it gets real tight. I payed like $300 a month plus it would take another $3 week in gas. You buy your gas by the liter in Coke bottles of roadside carts as well as gas stations. Stop lights are replaced by guys you pay 10 cents and they block a path for your car through an intersection. Complete comedy, here that occupation is replaced by the automation of 3 light bulbs. This is what you get with no tax base. There is very little tax collected on the people in Indonesia and no service is provided them.
Oh, if you go to Jakarta, go to Hotel Alexis..;):yesnod:
 
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Tell your mom we all love her! :D
 
If you shoot, you shoot to kill, so if you shoot you put 2 bullets in them to make sure the job is done.
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Not exactly: one shoots to stop the threat. Whether the outcome is death or not is irrelevant.

The "double tap" is also referred to as a "controlled pair," and though not taught much today, was practiced for many years as two to center mass (chest), followed by one to the head in what was called a "failure to stop" or "mozambique" drill.

A double tap isn't putting two shots in the same place, but an issue of trigger cadence.

Certainly upset pilots are a reality, as aviators are human. I've seen people have screaming fits in the cockpit, and knew one individual who was finally suspended and sent to anger managment classes before he could return.

The individual in his Chevy Aveo who was throwing water bottles and garbage, however, could very easily lose his medical certificate if his actions were reported to the local FSDO. That kind of instability and uncontrolled behavior would easily be enough to cause a temporary grounding, and possibly longer term adjustments which might follow. Personally, I'd have been in contact with the FSDO. As a former Aviation Safety Counselor, I'd have been in favor of speaking with the pilot, but given his irrational behavior, the next step is to an operations inspector for investigation and subsequent enforcement action.
 
He was mad that you probably had a better car then he did. Funny that you both ended up at the airport together.
 
Probably a Phillies fan that ran from Nats Park after Werth hit the home run. :rofl:
 
Henning said:
Jakarta really is amazing, complete gridlock, scooters everywhere and no rage or injuries. The place is the size and population density of LA with similar climatic, ecological, and economic influences. The difference in everything is night and day, it's like an equatorial opposite rather than polar.:dunno:
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The population density of Jakarta is almost twice that of Los Angeles.
 
Henning said:
See, that is the reason I don't conceal carry, I would have put a double tap at his forehead. That's why I thought Hannibal Lector was a hero, he ate the rude. :D

Every driver in the western world needs to drive one hour, and ride a scooter for 2 days in Jakarta . They will experience traffic the likes of which I have seen no other (neither had my crew from Bombay). They will also experience how safe things are on that scooter when there is no road rage at all. A quick double tap and people make a little space if they can, if not they just take it as a warning it's close there and try not to encroach further. It's pretty cool; I spent about 4 months total there. Interesting study with all the similarities to Los Angeles.
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I do indeed drive and ride scooters in Southeast Asia ( not Jakarta but the same thing traffic wise.) I actually think it makes me a better driver here, in terms of situational awareness and merging capability.

Interesting to note that in those places, the horn is used frequently, and it is intended to be constructive. Here, the horn means "buddy you royally screwed up and this is your last warning before I run you off the road or put a double tap in your head."

I blow off a$$wipes that lay on the horn and issue the one finger salute. I would not have a sense of humor about objects being thrown at me. I suspect my fist might have a bonding moment with Aveo driver's face had it been me in the story.
 
Geico266 said:
I'm not saying you did anything wrong, but what set the guy off?

Throwing stuff at you is assault. Call the cops and make a report.
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Well he got even more set off by my mother. Not sure what initially set him off but in the end if he got physical we would have been prepared. I carry no less than one buck knife on me and my mom has a hunting shop in the glove box. The guy throwing stuff at us, yes that's assault but I was more concerned about my mom because she's this kind of person: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6hzqQHJChM

So long as my mom is in the car we should be fine. I proceeded to the airport (didn't know that's where he was going) because it was the closest public area plus there is usually at least one cop around (of course the cop was NOT there today!). Plus Saturday and good wx= lots of witnesses :D
 
I would find out who he is if possible and make appropriate reports. That is not behavior a pilot should be exhibiting.
 
bigblockz8 said:
Well he got even more set off by my mother. Not sure what initially set him off but in the end if he got physical we would have been prepared. I carry no less than one buck knife on me and my mom has a hunting shop in the glove box. The guy throwing stuff at us, yes that's assault but I was more concerned about my mom because she's this kind of person: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6hzqQHJChM

So long as my mom is in the car we should be fine. I proceeded to the airport (didn't know that's where he was going) because it was the closest public area plus there is usually at least one cop around (of course the cop was NOT there today!). Plus Saturday and good wx= lots of witnesses :D
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No fists, double taps or controlled pairs (there is a difference...)necessary, IMO. If the legal route works, fine, report it to the fsdo and/or cops. If that's going further than you wish, after the turd takes off, use the stem puller in your tire kit and give him a reason to see if he has a full size spare. Of course, on such a fine day with so many witnesses around that may not be so smart, but it is another avenue...
 
We actually made a report, I should prob add that to the original post. On the way home we saw a county sheriff's deputy and asked if he would be willing to take a report (he was sitting on the hood of his car looking at traffic) and he took it. We got the tag since he parked next to us and left (kind of stupid to park your car after such an incident right next to the people you assaulted...bad things could happen). I was smart enough to move our car even though the guy left.

FSDO can't really do anything, at least I don't think so. Only reckless act that he committed was giving me the finger while taxiing in a confined and congested area. If he chewed up another plane, that'd be his fault.
 
One time while I was making the long drive home in the Mustang* I was in the center lane of 3 nowhere within a mile of another car when this dufe came up at like 99 MPH changes lanes to nose dive and screech and hit the horn on my back bumper. He gave me the salute and the evil eye and was SCREAMING as he passed on the left. He went ahead and picked fights with every vehicle ahead on the tollway until a semi decided that he wasn't allowed to pass on the left shoulder. I was about a mile back laughing my a* off watching the gravel fly.

He got out of sight before I could safely call 911 to report him.

Some drivers are just nuts.
 
Dude,
He flies a Cessna 172, of course he is ****ed off!!! He wouldn't be like that if he could afford a real airplane!
 
bigblockz8 said:
Why do I have a feeling that this hotel has a couple of off menu services?
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No sir, the menu is complete...:rofl::rofl::rofl: There are many levels of menu items as well, not all forbidden. There is an Asian bath in the spa which is very nice. Jakarta is such a filthy place, the sky is always black and it stained. It would not wash off, you had to wax it off. I had 3 Indonesians waxing the boat continuously. The filth and polution is staggering. It overwhelms the senses to drive next to a river that provides septic drainage for 12 million people. Had we not passed the environmental acts in the early 70s, Los Angeles would be much like Jakarta.

Jakarta doesn't really have twice the population density because they are half the size.:rofl: Seriously, the typical Indo is half my volume. I thought it was 25 million in the greater Jakarta area. I remember the first time I jumped on the back of a scooter with one (everyone with a scooter is a taxi) we didn't even make it to the gate of the marina before we swapped.

BTW, Jakarta traffic is the worst in the world. People from all over SE Asia come and say "Damn!" lol.
 
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We had family friends in the oil biz in Jakarta. The company wouldn't let them drive, period. If they'd have had an accident it would have cost insane amounts of money.

The Indonesian vehicle accident system apparently was some kind of roadside barter system that multiplied 1000-fold if you weren't Indonesian.

They moved back to the States and the girls were shocked that people had to drive themselves after growing up there, even though the parents had explained it.
 
I bet if I made the OPs post and asked 'if this guy is a jerk' this thread would have gone a whole different direction.

: (
 
He flies a Cessna 172, of course he is ****ed off!!! He wouldn't be like that if he could afford a real airplane!
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What's wrong with a 172?

FSDO can't really do anything, at least I don't think so.
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It most certainly can. Direct certificate action can be taken against the holder of an ATP, because behavior has a direct bearing on his moral character. Action can be taken against any holder of a medical certificate who is exhibiting the behavior that this individual showed.

Think about it: how one operates one vehicle is a very valid indication of how one will operate another. That's why DUI's impact one's ability to hold a medical certificate. Showing irresponsibility in driving a car is a good indication of one's potential behavior and judgement when operating an aircraft.

I've deal with situations very much like what you've described here, and I've seen some of them develop into problems for the aviator, because of his or her attitude, behavior, or actions.

The fact that this individual was behaving that way on the way to the airport, and that he immediately took flight while so enraged speaks volumes about his judgement and competence to hold a pilot certificate. Most certainly the FAA is interested in that.
 
Captain said:
I bet if I made the OPs post and asked 'if this guy is a jerk' this thread would have gone a whole different direction.

: (
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Is this guy jerk?

Haha I don't get the whole "is this guy a jerk" trend not only here but other forums tambien. I mean I've seen them from bus forums,RR forums, through Lego Forums. New movement?
 
DouglasBader said:
What's wrong with a 172?



It most certainly can. Direct certificate action can be taken against the holder of an ATP, because behavior has a direct bearing on his moral character. Action can be taken against any holder of a medical certificate who is exhibiting the behavior that this individual showed.

Think about it: how one operates one vehicle is a very valid indication of how one will operate another. That's why DUI's impact one's ability to hold a medical certificate. Showing irresponsibility in driving a car is a good indication of one's potential behavior and judgement when operating an aircraft.

I've deal with situations very much like what you've described here, and I've seen some of them develop into problems for the aviator, because of his or her attitude, behavior, or actions.

The fact that this individual was behaving that way on the way to the airport, and that he immediately took flight while so enraged speaks volumes about his judgement and competence to hold a pilot certificate. Most certainly the FAA is interested in that.
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Wow I had no idea! I forgot about the "must be of sound moral character" requirement for the ATP (not sure what he holds). I certainly will be contacting the FSDO with the police report # since I didn't exactly make it a point to take down the guy's N#, believing it was irrelevant. That should give them a way to ID him as well as having an official source/reference for my complaint. At least I assume so. If not I'll have them try Rusty Shackleford and Dale Gribble as names :D

No telling if the guy does this daily so definitely will inform them.

Actually, Question: Any 5'2" Aveo driving 172 pilots based out of KGAI on this forum to anyone's knowledge?

Hopefully not.
 
Very sad thing about roadrage, last night's headline :

21-year-old woman dead in possible case of road rage in Fairfax County
 
bigblockz8 said:
Very sad thing about roadrage, last night's headline :

21-year-old woman dead in possible case of road rage in Fairfax County
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We live in a very violent society, I don't see these levels of violence and aggression in any other developed society. The only place it's worse is in Africa.
 
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