[NA] SUV upgrade from sedan [NA]

Caramon13

Caramon13

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I am currently leasing a 2017 Acura TLX which, for my needs so far has been great. Gets decent gas mileage, tech package is nice, pretty decent get up and go.

My mission has changed and I'm looking into a compact or subcompact SUV with a bit more storage space.

I've looked at:
  • Mazda CX-3
  • Maxda CX-5 (test drove)
  • Subaru Forester (test drove)
  • Honda CR-V (test drove)
  • Honda HR-V (test drove)
Of the ones above, in my opinion the Subaru had the best ride. It felt heavier, but also much more stable due to the AWD. None of the models above aside from the Subaru had AWD, even though some offer that feature. An Outback would be even better but it's a bit outside my budgeted range (between $20-30K).

I priced these out and it looks like the Honda CR-V is actually the MOST expensive, but has the MOST gadgets and features and the best gas mileage. Subaru is dead last for blingy stuff, but for interior space and gas mileage it's pretty darn close to the Honda CR-V and it has AWD and drives nice, cost is also the lowest.

Mazda is somewhere in between. Decent drive, mid-range cost, gadgets are "meh" and there's a lot of folks that seem to think the "infotainment" center in the car sucks.

My primary factor in looking at cars is cost, followed immediately by interior space, then comfort/drive and lastly by gadgets. I'm looking HARD at the Subaru, probably will end up with a 2017 Subaru Premium trim but I dunno. Have any of you gone through the process recently and have any insights on these models?

I should also note that I'm not looking at other brands due to sub-par reviews. I strongly dislike Kia (can't explain why) and Nissan has a stupid amount required for a downpayment so they are out. Toyota has gotten some REALLY poor reviews for the '17 Rav 4.

I'm not looking at used cars because the best way I can keep my monthly costs down is to lease at the moment.
 
My wife had a Forester for years. It has the reputation of being the school teacher car. Decent handling in all weather and a reasaonable amount of storage. It had snowed about six inches the day we test drove it, so we went to some unplowed parking lots to test it and it was great. Thing handles well. Never really had any problem with it. My daughter and her husband drove soobs as well out in Colorado.

My wife was just nervous parking it around our EAA friends as she was afraid the engine might find it's way onto someone's homebuilt project.
 
flyingron said:
My wife had a Forester for years. It has the reputation of being the school teacher car. Decent handling in all weather and a reasaonable amount of storage. It had snowed about six inches the day we test drove it, so we went to some unplowed parking lots to test it and it was great. Thing handles well. Never really had any problem with it. My daughter and her husband drove soobs as well out in Colorado.

My wife was just nervous parking it around our EAA friends as she was afraid the engine might find it's way onto someone's homebuilt project.
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Hah! :). I think the Mazda and the Honda were "OK", but in fairness I did drive the FWD versions..so maybe the AWD is better. But it does add about $1,300 to the Honda and who knows what to the Mazda.

I'm not too concerned about looks right now of the car, it's more about functionality, cost, comfort and of course safety. Don't get a lot of snow here in FL, but we DO get a lot of rain..well, we USED to get a lot of rain, not so much lately heh..
 
My mom has the Buick Encore. She loves it, zero issues . I dont like CVT, so we dropped a lot of models when looking. Drove the Jeep Renegade. Nice car, but the dealer was on crack when talking pricing. Drove the HR-V, mom said it was too slow for her. Cant help past that.
 
I recently did a 2-3 month car search, and ended up with an Outback 3.6R Limited. I'm very pleased so far. Runner up was the Ford Escape Titanium.
 
When we were in the market last year, it was down to the '17 Forester and the '16 rav4. I thought the rav4 was the better vehicle. The Forester seems to be slightly better value. Ended up with the Forester.
 
charheep said:
My mom has the Buick Encore. She loves it, zero issues . I dont like CVT, so we dropped a lot of models when looking. Drove the Jeep Renegade. Nice car, but the dealer was on crack when talking pricing. Drove the HR-V, mom said it was too slow for her. Cant help past that.
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Thanks! Yeah, the forester has the CVT and I think the Honda does too, but honestly I didn't notice a mega difference (aside from the "shifting" feeling). HR-V was too slow for me too. Got on the interstate and floored it when I was test driving and it felt like it was REALLY struggling to get up to speed...no thanks.

I looked at the Encore, but never drove it.
 
Bill Jennings said:
I recently did a 2-3 month car search, and ended up with an Outback 3.6R Limited. I'm very pleased so far. Runner up was the Ford Escape Titanium.
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Yeah, that is a nice car. The only thing keeping me away from the Outback is it sits lower than the Forester, which is a bit odd. After many years of looking at the bumpers of SUVs or trucks, the idea of being higher up is appealing. The 2.0XT Forester is a bit out of my range, else I would definitely consider it since it's a turbocharged version of the 2.5L.

GeorgeC said:
When we were in the market last year, it was down to the '17 Forester and the '16 rav4. I thought the rav4 was the better vehicle. The Forester seems to be slightly better value. Ended up with the Forester.
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I looked at the Rav 4 reviews for the '17 model and I was really surprised it scored as low as it did..I used to think the Rav 4 was waay better..I would consider used if I could manage to get the payments lower than what I'm at right now, but there's not likely a chance of that unless I go out 72 months which I don't wanna do.
 
I thought it was a good indicator when I saw lots of '16 rav4s being used as taxis.
 
Caramon13 said:
Yeah, that is a nice car. The only thing keeping me away from the Outback is it sits lower than the Forester, which is a bit odd. After many years of looking at the bumpers of SUVs or trucks, the idea of being higher up is appealing.
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Ha, I'm going the other direction. After driving my F-150 Supercrew for 17 years, I'm ready for a more car-like experience. Better handling, smaller, smoother, quieter, easier parking, easier on gas, etc.......just tired of driving a truck.
 
I have an Outback. I like the extra space in the back vs the Forester.

My feeling on the OB is that it does everything...OK. It isn't bad in any area, it isn't great in any area. With one exception, the AWD. The Subaru AWD system is outstanding.
 
Another angle to reviewing which car is to look up major components on Car-Part.com. Factors to evaluate are amount of inventory and price of the component.

Lots of inventory means many customers are opting not to repair the vehicle after a major event and its going to the salvage yard. Prices should be average to low due to lots of availability.
Lack of inventory and higher prices for the part type can indicate a design issue that is keeping the assembly from lasting for lots and lots of mileage.

In both cases, it can help you know what your budget should be (after adding the mechanic costs) should that component or assembly fail.
 
Matthew said:
My feeling on the OB is that it does everything...OK. It isn't bad in any area, it isn't great in any area.
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Funny.... some folks apply that description to the Cessna Skylane ;););)
 
I'm very anti-SUV for a long list of reasons we can cheerfully discuss over beers.

In your case, the relevant part is I do not believe they have additional space. Most SUVs are very space-inefficient, so if they have more space than a car, it's because they are much larger.

The bad news - if you want space efficiency, get a minivan.
 
The Nissan Murano always worked fairly well when I've had them as rentals, dunno what an AWD version sells for, but the regular version starts in the low-20's. It does have some blind spots, but the rear-view cameras and such have mostly eliminated that stuff. Obviously, it runs the CVT transmission, but that doesn't bother me. The Ford Edge is a nice ride, too, but I don't think you'll be able to pick up an AWD version for under $30K, maybe slightly used.
 
G-Man said:
I'm very anti-SUV for a long list of reasons we can cheerfully discuss over beers.

In your case, the relevant part is I do not believe they have additional space. Most SUVs are very space-inefficient, so if they have more space than a car, it's because they are much larger.

The bad news - if you want space efficiency, get a minivan.
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They generally have more "usable" space because there's no upper trunk structure to interfere with bulky items. The overall length isn't generally too much different, but being able to lay down the seats and have the space from the rear hatch to the front seats is something sedan's can't do, even with the fold-down seat backs. I will generally agree that there's not much advantage to most "SUVs" over cars because they generally don't have much more ground clearance or off-road capability than many sedans. You have to get into the larger body-on-frame models before you get into something deserving of the SUV name.
 
SoonerAviator said:
They generally have more "usable" space because there's no upper trunk structure to interfere with bulky items. The overall length isn't generally too much different, but being able to lay down the seats and have the space from the rear hatch to the front seats is something sedan's can't do, even with the fold-down seat backs. I will generally agree that there's not much advantage to most "SUVs" over cars because they generally don't have much more ground clearance or off-road capability than many sedans. You have to get into the larger body-on-frame models before you get into something deserving of the SUV name.
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Yes, that's almost exactly my problem. I have no issues with stuff that is flat and longer. I can put seats down in my car now to accommodate that. What I can't do is get say...a 50 qt. cooler in the trunk. It's JUST barely short enough to make that impossible. The Acura TLX has some really nice horizontal trunk space, but not enough vertical. The ground clearance is also a problem. I feel like I have to park farther out in spaces with the cement block in front, for fear of scraping it if I get too far in. Also, a lot of camp sites have gravel or dirt roads, and for me that's a problem in the Acura.

I also travel a lot and with my luggage and my wife and son, we almost always pile some in the trunk and some in the car. I want it ALL in the trunk.

AWD is almost a requirement for me. I can fishtail the Acura by flooring it at a light or if I'm passing someone quickly, it takes a bit more control.
 
Caramon13 said:
I am currently leasing a 2017 Acura TLX which, for my needs so far has been great.

I'm not looking at used cars because the best way I can keep my monthly costs down is to lease at the moment.
Click to expand...

What are you paying for a lease of a 2017 Acura?

What's it going to cost you to get out early?
 
We have a '10 Outback 2.5 that I bought new. No it does not sit that high and you still can't see around taller vehicles but that also gets rid of most of the tippy body roll feel you get in most SUVs. On the highway you can just get to 30mpg but realistically you'll mostly be in the 25-29 range. Power with the 2.5 is adequate but it's definitely no sports car. For it's size and price the interior cargo space is nice, we've found for most of what we want it's big enough. I have on some occasions wished for a bit more cargo room but a little intelligent packing and it all fits.

No major problems with it yet, we're over 130k miles on it now. I recently had to replace an O2 sensor. Oil changes are not bad for a modern foreign car. One gripe I have with the '10 models is they've made the headlight bulbs EXTREMELY hard to change. I mean hard to the point Subaru sent out a letter saying they'd do it at the dealerships for free now which was nice of them but too late for my scraped up battered hands and bulb change PTSD. Other than the oil changes, O2 sensor, and headlights I've put new brakes on twice and it's on it's 3rd set of tires.... basically just wear items.

For some reason this AWD car comes with highway tires from the factory.. I assume for fuel economy. Yokohama Geolander all-terrain tires are a nice upgrade and give it a more "butch" look.

As one would expect it does well in the snow and better than a car in general in off-road situations. Do not buy one of these thinking you have a jeep or anything... I've had to pull it out of a few snow drifts with my F-150 but as long as you don't get high centered on anything it does well enough for most normal situations. One nice thing about the Outback is unlike most AWD vehicles it truly is full time AWD with power going to all wheels at all times. Most modern systems primarily or entirely are FWD until you start to spin and only then do they route power to the rear.

Overall it's a good car, I have a few minor grips(the 2010 hands-free phone interface is terrible, hopefully they've updated it since then). Might buy one again although I'm also considering a Ford Edge for a little more cargo room down the line.
 
paflyer said:
What are you paying for a lease of a 2017 Acura?

What's it going to cost you to get out early?
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Well, the RDX Acura would be the only "in family" lease I could get and I'm betting it would AS much or more than what I'm paying now. I'm at about $425 / month for my 2015 TLX w/ tech package, leather, etc...

I have 4 payments remaining, so about $1,700 to get out now. The Suburu dealership I'm working with is offering to cut me a check for the remaining payments on the Acura and I'd just put some additional money down to get into the Suburu. That's a better deal than the other dealerships I've spoken with that just bundle that in with the lease.

I think the Suburu is going to be about $250 /month (tax,title everything included) which is where I want to be (ish) payment wise.
 
I haven't driven the Hyundai Tucson, but they look like serviceable vehicles for what you're looking for. The Santa Fe is a bit bigger, but I have had no complaints when I've driven them for rentals. You might give them a look, as they have 100K warranties and have made some big leaps over the past decade or two in their respective markets.
 
I like the fit and finish of my Hyundai Elantra Touring, but the Santa Fe felt too plasticy when I test drove it.
 
If you have a TLX now you would hate anything with CVT.
Bring your stuff and suitcase load for a test-drive in any of the vehicles you are considering. I find the CRV to be cramped. It's a tippy version of the Civic.
I believe the trunk in the current model Accord is taller than that in the TLX. I wish they still made the Accord wagon.
 
weilke said:
If you have a TLX now you would hate anything with CVT.
Bring your stuff and suitcase load for a test-drive in any of the vehicles you are considering. I find the CRV to be cramped. It's a tippy version of the Civic.
I believe the trunk in the current model Accord is taller than that in the TLX. I wish they still made the Accord wagon.
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I dunno, it's not that bad (CVT), I mean, yeah I have a leadfoot sometimes, but if I can save a couple bucks on gas and learn to be patient maybe that's what I need to do.

It IS different though.

Having driven the CX-5 and the CRV I will say that the thing I don't like about them is the "tippy" aloof feeling compared to the AWD feeling. My mother has a 2003 CR-V and the space inside that is a LOT less than the 2017 model.
 
Caramon13 said:
I am currently leasing a 2017 Acura TLX which, for my needs so far has been great. Gets decent gas mileage, tech package is nice, pretty decent get up and go.

My mission has changed and I'm looking into a compact or subcompact SUV with a bit more storage space.

I've looked at:
  • Mazda CX-3
  • Maxda CX-5 (test drove)
  • Subaru Forester (test drove)
  • Honda CR-V (test drove)
  • Honda HR-V (test drove)
Of the ones above, in my opinion the Subaru had the best ride. It felt heavier, but also much more stable due to the AWD. None of the models above aside from the Subaru had AWD, even though some offer that feature. An Outback would be even better but it's a bit outside my budgeted range (between $20-30K).

I priced these out and it looks like the Honda CR-V is actually the MOST expensive, but has the MOST gadgets and features and the best gas mileage. Subaru is dead last for blingy stuff, but for interior space and gas mileage it's pretty darn close to the Honda CR-V and it has AWD and drives nice, cost is also the lowest.

Mazda is somewhere in between. Decent drive, mid-range cost, gadgets are "meh" and there's a lot of folks that seem to think the "infotainment" center in the car sucks.

My primary factor in looking at cars is cost, followed immediately by interior space, then comfort/drive and lastly by gadgets. I'm looking HARD at the Subaru, probably will end up with a 2017 Subaru Premium trim but I dunno. Have any of you gone through the process recently and have any insights on these models?

I should also note that I'm not looking at other brands due to sub-par reviews. I strongly dislike Kia (can't explain why) and Nissan has a stupid amount required for a downpayment so they are out. Toyota has gotten some REALLY poor reviews for the '17 Rav 4.

I'm not looking at used cars because the best way I can keep my monthly costs down is to lease at the moment.
Click to expand...

I just bought a '17 mitsubishi outlander. It's been about a month, but all in all a decent vehicle. Good fit/finish, great mileage.. Pretty dang happy with it
 
cowman said:
For some reason this AWD car comes with highway tires from the factory.. I assume for fuel economy. Yokohama Geolander all-terrain tires are a nice upgrade and give it a more "butch" look.
Click to expand...

I see what you did there.
 
cowman said:
We have a '10 Outback 2.5 that I bought new. No it does not sit that high and you still can't see around taller vehicles but that also gets rid of most of the tippy body roll feel you get in most SUVs. On the highway you can just get to 30mpg but realistically you'll mostly be in the 25-29 range. Power with the 2.5 is adequate but it's definitely no sports car. For it's size and price the interior cargo space is nice, we've found for most of what we want it's big enough. I have on some occasions wished for a bit more cargo room but a little intelligent packing and it all fits.

No major problems with it yet, we're over 130k miles on it now. I recently had to replace an O2 sensor. Oil changes are not bad for a modern foreign car. One gripe I have with the '10 models is they've made the headlight bulbs EXTREMELY hard to change. I mean hard to the point Subaru sent out a letter saying they'd do it at the dealerships for free now which was nice of them but too late for my scraped up battered hands and bulb change PTSD. Other than the oil changes, O2 sensor, and headlights I've put new brakes on twice and it's on it's 3rd set of tires.... basically just wear items.

For some reason this AWD car comes with highway tires from the factory.. I assume for fuel economy. Yokohama Geolander all-terrain tires are a nice upgrade and give it a more "butch" look.

As one would expect it does well in the snow and better than a car in general in off-road situations. Do not buy one of these thinking you have a jeep or anything... I've had to pull it out of a few snow drifts with my F-150 but as long as you don't get high centered on anything it does well enough for most normal situations. One nice thing about the Outback is unlike most AWD vehicles it truly is full time AWD with power going to all wheels at all times. Most modern systems primarily or entirely are FWD until you start to spin and only then do they route power to the rear.

Overall it's a good car, I have a few minor grips(the 2010 hands-free phone interface is terrible, hopefully they've updated it since then). Might buy one again although I'm also considering a Ford Edge for a little more cargo room down the line.
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Clark1961 said:
I see what you did there.
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Well I'm sure Subaru just wants their mpg-ratings to be all sunshine and rainbows . . .
 
sferguson524 said:
I just bought a '17 mitsubishi outlander. It's been about a month, but all in all a decent vehicle. Good fit/finish, great mileage.. Pretty dang happy with it
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Not to jinx you, but I've had two close friends with the Mitsu Outlander ('12/'13 models I think) who said the damn thing started falling apart after about 3 years and they'd never buy another. I haven't seen too many Mitsus stand the test of time. Maybe some 90's Diamantes.
 
SoonerAviator said:
Not to jinx you, but I've had two close friends with the Mitsu Outlander ('12/'13 models I think) who said the damn thing started falling apart after about 3 years and they'd never buy another. I haven't seen too many Mitsus stand the test of time. Maybe some 90's Diamantes.
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Hopefully this isn't the case.. Thankfully 5/60 for bumper to bumper and 10/100 on powertrain gives a little solace..
 
Caramon13 said:
I dunno, it's not that bad (CVT), I mean, yeah I have a leadfoot sometimes, but if I can save a couple bucks on gas and learn to be patient maybe that's what I need to do.
Click to expand...

I've had to adapt my driving style to the CVT, but the end result is that I have been very impressed with the mileage I get in the Forester.
 
I
Caramon13 said:
I dunno, it's not that bad (CVT), I mean, yeah I have a leadfoot sometimes, but if I can save a couple bucks on gas and learn to be patient maybe that's what I need to do.

It IS different though.

Having driven the CX-5 and the CRV I will say that the thing I don't like about them is the "tippy" aloof feeling compared to the AWD feeling. My mother has a 2003 CR-V and the space inside that is a LOT less than the 2017 model.
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I have an older Legacy Outback, and that one is clearly a car. It does have some extra ground clearance and with 4 snow tires I never got stuck. The new one got fat and is more of an SUV.
 
Subaru hands down, best Engneering and easy/cheap to service.

I live somewhere where we have a real winter and a Subaru is by far the best snow car, also they handle well and just have a good fit and finish and hold their value well, I currently have a older forester for my DD, put full length 3/8 aluminum skid plates on it, had it in snow that would close most urban cities, even with all season tires, it just goes

Not that it would interest you, but they are also Lego cars, you can pretty easily swap engines, brakes, etc between most all of them, new to old. There are some STI brats and loyales out there that are mighty impressive.
 
cowman said:
One gripe I have with the '10 models is they've made the headlight bulbs EXTREMELY hard to change. I mean hard to the point Subaru sent out a letter saying they'd do it at the dealerships for free now which was nice of them but too late for my scraped up battered hands and bulb change PTSD. .
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That is no exaggeration. I have an '11 Legacy and I had to change the left front bulb. I now have nightmares of a parking lot full of Subarus that all need one headlight bulb changed.

I will sell the car before I change another headlight bulb.
 
My '13 Outback is the same way. There are people on some of the Outback forums that have cut access panels rather than try to change the bulb the way the manual instructs.
 
Matthew said:
My '13 Outback is the same way. There are people on some of the Outback forums that have cut access panels rather than try to change the bulb the way the manual instructs.
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VW has placed sharp metal spikes surrounding the bulb to add to the experience.
 
Out of the list, if I were buying new (and I don't do that... cash or I don't buy it...) I'd go with the Subaru... but I'd also be looking at Toyota, as someone else mentioned, if you want it to last forever.

Watch out on all of them for parts costs, and purposeful designs that make working on almost anything on them, damned near impossible without a lift.

The manufacturers have figured out that they give their dealerships a pat on the back indirectly by making things impossible to work on. And/or turn every job into, "Well, since it took 30 hours to get to THAT, while we're in there... you should probably replace... X..."

Frankly, Ford started it... but everyone's copied it by now...

One of many examples... Chevy Canyon timing chain change... amongst other stupidity...


The newer the "design" generally, the stupider it is.
 
Actually I just remembered one more gripe on the Subaru. The dome lights have multi-position switches that manage to get moved into the wrong position all the time... or the map lights get left on and since like most modern cars it leaves the lights on for a minute after you close the doors you don't notice and THE LIGHTS STAY ON AND DRAIN THE BATTERY FLAT. I was really shocked that a car made in 2010 allowed that to happen... that's the first car I've seen since the 90s that didn't have an automatic shut-off for everything.
 
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