Most economical VOR option

Huckster79

Huckster79

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Huckster79
So I just picked up a really nice little c150 for the kiddos to take lessons… without a VOR they can’t do all of their private ticket in it, correct?

Besides renting for a few hours and the check ride what would be the most economical route to go to have a VOR so they can go start to finish in it?
 
Huckster79 said:
So I just picked up a really nice little c150 for the kiddos to take lessons… without a VOR they can’t do all of their private ticket in it, correct?

Besides renting for a few hours and the check ride what would be the most economical route to go to have a VOR so they can go start to finish in it?
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With all the VORs being decommissioned I wonder if you can find one for sale on a government auction site. They’re pretty big and I doubt they’d fit in a 150 but maybe.

Oh wait…

I think you may mean a Nav radio

/Yes, being an unhelpful smarta$$ :D
 
Find a removed KX155 with indicator and harness. Keep as single com and connect to an inexpensive intercom.
 
Jesse Saint said:
Find a removed KX155 with indicator and harness. Keep as single com and connect to an inexpensive intercom.
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i think i would spend a bit more and try to find a SL30 first. the 155 was a great radio, but is getting long in the tooth and harder to get fixed nowadays. displays and FD driver chips are about impossible to get now days.
 
VAL INS429. VOR/LOC/GS, indicator and marker beacon receiver all in one. Only 3 wires to hook up so it should also save you on labor hours.
https://www.valavionics.com/ins-429.html

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Even cheaper and along a similar vein would be a Narco NAV-122, but the downside is that you'd have a Narco.
 
unsafervguy said:
i think i would spend a bit more and try to find a SL30 first. the 155 was a great radio, but is getting long in the tooth and harder to get fixed nowadays. displays and FD driver chips are about impossible to get now days.
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Yes, but replacement kx155’s are getting easier to find if the current one fails. You could easily pay $3,000+ for an SL30 with indicator. If you shop, the kx155 setup could be less than $1,500, and possibly closer to $1,000.
 
Do you really need a VOR for a private pilot checkride? Asking because I almost did mine in a cub, and the only concern the DPE had was being able to demonstrate flying without external visual references, so we were planning on using a portable AHRS. He believed it was OK, because there didn't seem to be a regulation that the artificial horizon needed to either be certified or installed in the aircraft.
 
Albany Tom said:
Do you really need a VOR for a private pilot checkride? Asking because I almost did mine in a cub, and the only concern the DPE had was being able to demonstrate flying without external visual references, so we were planning on using a portable AHRS. He believed it was OK, because there didn't seem to be a regulation that the artificial horizon needed to either be certified or installed in the aircraft.
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GeorgeC said:
A VOR is not required.
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that is fantastic news! The local cfi said it would be...
 
Don't make $$ decisions based on what SGOTI said. Take a look at the Private Pilot ACS says:

PA.VI.B.S1 "Use an airborne electronic navigation system"

it doesn't say it has to be a VOR receiver. It could be a GPS, an ADF, etc. You do need to be able to:

-Determine the airplane’s position using the navigation system.
-Intercept and track a given course, radial, or bearing, as appropriate.
-Recognize and describe the indication of station or waypoint passage, if appropriate.
-Recognize signal loss or interference and take appropriate action, if applicable.
 
Brad Z said:
Don't make $$ decisions based on what SGOTI said. Take a look at the Private Pilot ACS says:

PA.VI.B.S1 "Use an airborne electronic navigation system"

it doesn't say it has to be a VOR receiver. It could be a GPS, an ADF, etc. You do need to be able to:

-Determine the airplane’s position using the navigation system.
-Intercept and track a given course, radial, or bearing, as appropriate.
-Recognize and describe the indication of station or waypoint passage, if appropriate.
-Recognize signal loss or interference and take appropriate action, if applicable.
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Exactly. And all that can be accomplished with portable GPS of some kind.
 
The language in the ACS does make it sound like a VOR is needed (radial, station passage etc..) but in fact you can fly an airplane with no electrical systems at all. Your phone should be sufficient as an "airborne electronic navigation system".
 
sarangan said:
The language in the ACS does make it sound like a VOR is needed (radial, station passage etc..) but in fact you can fly an airplane with no electrical systems at all. Your phone should be sufficient as an "airborne electronic navigation system".
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The "or" in "Course, radial OR bearing" suggests that no specific bac system is required.
 
If you did want to go the KX155 route I have one I could sell you. I don't have a working indicator though.
 
The cheapest and easiest solution to start with is talk with the DPE you plan to use.
 
TommyG said:
The cheapest and easiest solution to start with is talk with the DPE you plan to use.
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This is great advice. When I was headed down the road of doing PPL in the cub, my CFI did just that. It's unusual enough that it won't be seen as a stupid question, in my opinion.
 
Does that artificial horizon looking like gizmo work backwards from a standard artificial horizon? It looks adorable, but I'm not sure I'd want to have that someone's first experience in instrument training. Just me, maybe it's not an issue.
 
Like Albany Tom mentioned, I'd probably use my first nickel to replace that artificial horizon with a modern unit. Sure, a pilot can learn to use those old-style AI's, but you have to wonder how long it's been since it's had a gyro overhaul, and probably not worth having the work done.
 
Albany Tom said:
Does that artificial horizon looking like gizmo work backwards from a standard artificial horizon? It looks adorable, but I'm not sure I'd want to have that someone's first experience in instrument training. Just me, maybe it's not an issue.
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Backwards in that the horizon bar moves and not the "airplane." Welcome to the 1940s, 1950s, 1960s. By the 1970s manufacturers were replacing these with the AI you are now familiar with.
 
I thought that might be it...never flown with one. Maybe they have a collector value if they're operational, but I think they'd be confusing to a new pilot.
 
Albany Tom said:
I thought that might be it...never flown with one. Maybe they have a collector value if they're operational, but I think they'd be confusing to a new pilot.
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might be less confusing to a newbie - if they know nothing else …
 
Maybe. But it probably won't be when they switch. I don't know if primacy is a law, but I wouldn't want to teach a beginner a dial that's going to work backwards from the ones they'll use later on. Maybe not a big deal, but it might be.
 
Albany Tom said:
Maybe. But it probably won't be when they switch. I don't know if primacy is a law, but I wouldn't want to teach a beginner a dial that's going to work backwards from the ones they'll use later on. Maybe not a big deal, but it might be.
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probably good point. I fly a 1947 Cessna 140 as my baby and it’s not equipped with all that new dangled technology…. Are they all pretty standard for a qualified installer? As in would a used one likely “plug and play”? As I think the uvonix AV20 for $900 would probably be the most economical route…
 
I don't think the AV-20 is usable as primary attitude indicator (could be wrong).
Direct replacement plug-and-play for your old-style AI would be a basic vacuum powered attitude gyro, SigmaTek or other brands, you can probably get an overhauled unit for $700, or less.
 
Jim Carpenter said:
I don't think the AV-20 is usable as primary attitude indicator (could be wrong).
Direct replacement plug-and-play for your old-style AI would be a basic vacuum powered attitude gyro, SigmaTek or other brands, you can probably get an overhauled unit for $700, or less.
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mill have to look again I thought the av20 was but I’ve not got into it deep yet - just perused…
 
Huckster79 said:
My question to that would supplemental be fine for 3 hrs simulated time in vfr? I mean my ol C140 doesn’t have one at all… and not a smart arse question either…
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Well, if it's not required for simulated time in VFR and it enhances safety then it would seem to be fulfilling its mission.
 
Jesse Saint said:
Yes, but replacement kx155’s are getting easier to find if the current one fails. You could easily pay $3,000+ for an SL30 with indicator. If you shop, the kx155 setup could be less than $1,500, and possibly closer to $1,000.
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Yes, but you can’t get parts for them, so when they quit your buying another on, that eats the savings real quick. I say buy a newer radio
 
Another thing to keep in mind when it comes to NAV radios is that there are some places where there are a lot of airports where the AWOS broadcast is transmitted over the VOR on the field (I'm looking at you Minnesota). But, the handheld radio that has a NAV receiver easily solves that problem.
 
Huckster79 said:
So I just picked up a really nice little c150 for the kiddos to take lessons… without a VOR they can’t do all of their private ticket in it, correct?

Besides renting for a few hours and the check ride what would be the most economical route to go to have a VOR so they can go start to finish in it?
Click to expand...

May or may not need a VOR. My DPE for PPL specifically required it. I see others posting that it isn't required.

You could leave the plane alone, or you could spend a bit and get the C150 into an IFR certified place where they can do use the plane for their IFR as well as their PPL. You'd make more use of your plane that way. If my kiddos were flying, I'd just assume yes, they were going to get their instrument.

As hard it is to find good planes these days, I would hazard a guess that you could sell the 150 after you're done with it to a club or school.

This isn't about what is the cheapest, as that would be renting and you've crossed that Rubicon.
 
WDD said:
May or may not need a VOR. My DPE for PPL specifically required it. I see others posting that it isn't required.

You could leave the plane alone, or you could spend a bit and get the C150 into an IFR certified place where they can do use the plane for their IFR as well as their PPL. You'd make more use of your plane that way. If my kiddos were flying, I'd just assume yes, they were going to get their instrument.

As hard it is to find good planes these days, I would hazard a guess that you could sell the 150 after you're done with it to a club or school.

This isn't about what is the cheapest, as that would be renting and you've crossed that Rubicon.
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lol you have a valid point in the last sentence! The fleet is now 2 1/12 planes so yea the rubicon has been crossed!
 
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