Mogas stored in hanger

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by Utah-Jay, Sep 26, 2020.

  1. Utah-Jay

    Utah-Jay Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I am about ready to move from my training airport (UT9) which has Mogas available to my home airport (KHCR) which does not have mogas available. I am looking at options for a 30 gallon container with a nozzle and pump to keep in the hanger and refill as needed. Firstly, will the FBO (OK3) at KHCR have a problem being they do not offer mogas? Secondly is this a good option:
    https://www.amazon.com/SUNCOO-Gallo...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=HM1623HKVGY7BD9F35VN

    And yes I know... I am so lucky to have KHCR/OK3 as my home airport... NOT
     
  2. RyanB

    RyanB Administrator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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    Check your lease agreement. I would guess that it has a provision against storing flammable liquids inside the hangar space and that includes fuel. If it’s unclear, talk to your airport manager.
     
  3. kkoran

    kkoran Cleared for Takeoff

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    It really comes down to what is allowed/prohibited by the airport rules and your lease.
     
  4. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    The airport is the controlling factor, what they allow, but also is the county fire codes.
     
  5. catmandu

    catmandu Cleared for Takeoff PoA Supporter

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    30 gallon containers are a pain to transport when full unless you have a liftgate. I have four of these, with one cap tapped so I could install a threaded pvc fitting, 1/4 turn shutoff valve, and length of clear hose.

    [​IMG]

    I place it on the wing with a moving blanket, tube into fill hole, and let gravity do the work. Maybe once in a while I store 3 gallons in the hangar until I make some room in the plane, Fire Marshall Bill has yet to notice.
     
  6. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    when I am forced to use 5 gallon cans I use one of these.
    ref=sr_1_2_sspa

    The pour spouts sux and holding 5 gallon cans isn't a option any more.
     
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  7. Utah-Jay

    Utah-Jay Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I am thinking of going the 5 gallon containers and siphon route. I used this method for backcountry boating in the Florida Keys years ago. Put the container on a ladder and it will be very easy for sure
     
  8. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    just place a towel on the wing, then put the can on the wing. should provide enough head to empty the can.
    Low wing-- high wing, doesn't matter, the rise is what matters.

    a foam garden mat works too.
     
  9. Stewartb

    Stewartb Final Approach

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    Race jugs like the red ones in the pic above are excellent for fueling a plane. Like all plastic jugs they're susceptible to static so be careful with that. I use a rag to cover the filler neck to keep fumes inside the tank. Works great.

    To the airport regs, some airports prohibit self fueling unless at an approved pump. Read your local regs.
     
  10. Utah-Jay

    Utah-Jay Pre-takeoff checklist

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    It’s a rag wing so we don’t set things on the surfaces.
    Interesting on the static, is it an issue with a plastic container? If so what is the best way to mitigate the static?
     
  11. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    The rag/fabric has a painted surface, paint scratches. plus add a plate of some sort, to bridge the rib so the fabric is not stretched, that will crack the paint.
    Worry -- about plastic cans, plastic does build up static, we have a piece of copper wire we place between and the can and the wing.
     
  12. Utah-Jay

    Utah-Jay Pre-takeoff checklist

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    So if placing the plastic container on a ladder, should I have a wire attached to the aluminum ladder and set the container on the wire, or would just resting the container on the ladder be safe?
     
  13. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform En-Route

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    I think you’d want the bond between the container and the plane where a spark would tend to jump.
     
  14. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    I used to use one of those. Not a bad way to go, but kinda slow.

    Hadn't been an issue for me - foam mat and overlap the spar. I have since put an aluminum cover over the tanks. Still use the foam mat.

    Plastic can? Just hope for the best. Chances are you will get away with it.

    I use metal cans and attach a bonding wire between the can and the aircraft. (also required by the airport)

    I've got three of these cans (but only one funnel): https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/...s/eagle-type-i-safety-can-5-gallon-funnel-red
     
  15. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Most fabric aircraft have metal tanks, so all you need is a metal can, bonded between the two.
     
  16. Stewartb

    Stewartb Final Approach

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    You can't bond plastic jugs. I have one pour cap for my jugs. The long tube and separate vent make fueling easy and fast. 26FEDA4E-1366-41F3-91CE-758CC006042F.jpeg
     
  17. Dana

    Dana Pattern Altitude

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    When I had my Kolb I had a longish hose on the 5 gallon can with a brass valve on the end. I would lightly pressurize the can, which was sitting on the ground, with a foot pump made for air mattresses. Worked great.
     
  18. wilkersk

    wilkersk Pattern Altitude

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    I use 5 gal race jugs. The spouts are long enough, I just tilt and pour. Just like refueling a dirt bike. And once a year, when the fire dept. does their walk through, my 5 gal. jugs just happen to be in the back of my truck.
     
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  19. MacFly

    MacFly Line Up and Wait

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    That thing is cheap Chinese junk. Read the reviews on Amazon. I had one and sent it back

    I don't use portable fuel at the airport since a) I don't use mogas b) they fuel my plane at the hangar promptly with a phone call (and at a discount), c) they don't allow storage of fuel in the hangar.....but I use a lot of gasoline at home for mowers and boats etc and a moderate amount of diesel for tractors so I do store that fuel on premises. The diesel comes out of a 30 gallon drum that I assembled into fuel storage, and the gasoline is in a tank that I put on a trailer that I can pull around the yard and down to the dock. Works well, but for that kind of modest bulk storage, you'd have to figure out how you'd refill it.
     
  20. Daleandee

    Daleandee Cleared for Takeoff

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    This is an older film but worth the time to see it:

     
  21. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer En-Route

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    Only 94 gallons of flammable liquids in my hangar
     
  22. Greg Bockelman

    Greg Bockelman Touchdown! Greaser!

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    No kidding. What difference do a couple of cans make?
     
  23. RyanB

    RyanB Administrator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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    It has to do with the local fire codes and airport bylaws and whether or not they approve external storage of fuel. I agree, it doesn’t make much sense, but I can just about guarantee there will be a clause of some kind in your hangar agreement about it.
     
  24. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer En-Route

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    Zilch.
     
  25. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Administrator Management Council Member

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    I would think MoGas would break down over a short time period and that you'd want to transport "fresh" to the hangar, rather than store "stale" fuel. Particularly in a 30 gallon quantity. It's almost a nuisance amount to store. Half of a drum.

    A lot of the fire codes require storage of fuel a certain distance (50 feet? 250 feet?) from the nearest building. As such you might get away with buying a fuel trailer or tired fuel truck for personal use and ask a leaseholder or airport manager for an unused patch of dirt to park it at. Runs afoul of the "fresh vs stale" gas thing of course, but if you're flying enough, hard to beat an old 500 gallon refueller for cheap storage. I've seen them go for a few grand on TAP, and a few hundred at auctions.

    If you go refueler, you can tag it "offroad/non-op" for peanuts and ask your DMV for a one-day op permit to run down to the fuel station every 20-odd tanks. :D I'd rather see the DMV every 20 fills than drag a container out of a hangar and back every other fill -- your DMV may vary. :D

    $0.02
     
  26. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Hasn't been an issue for me.
     
  27. wanttaja

    wanttaja En-Route

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    I run mostly mogas in the Fly Baby through the summer, and switch back to 100LL in ~November due to stability issues.

    However, in the same hangar, I've got an '84 Nissan pickup truck that drives maybe ~100 miles a year. Literally goes years between fills....been that way for ~20 years. Starts right up, runs pretty normally.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  28. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

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    I can't store gas in the hangar which means I have to dump the tanks on the ground every time I put the airplane in it... :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  29. Sinistar

    Sinistar En-Route

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    Definitely funny when you think about it.

    Its okay to store 80gal in our 48yr old plane but we are only allowed one 5 gal can, that incredibly POS hard to use can. They check every month in the rentals. But owned hangars rarely get checked and that is mainly for compliance that there is a plane inside.

    No matter how much fuel...wise to never leave plugged in extension cords laying on the ground!
     
  30. Cap'n Jack

    Cap'n Jack Final Approach

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    I find Stabil or a similar products keeps snowblowers and lawnmowers from getting their carburetors gunked up during the off season.
     
  31. Skip Miller

    Skip Miller Final Approach

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    Odds are that your Aluminum Ladder has rubber feet, and you don't rest the ladder on the wing. The task at hand is to ground the tank to the airframe.

    -Skip
     
  32. Stewartb

    Stewartb Final Approach

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    Bond. Grounding has nothing to do with it. But again, you can't bond plastic jugs. Manage fumes by keeping them inside the tanks where the mixture is too rich to ignite. Most of your cars have filler flappers that do it for you. Airplanes are behind the times.

    I just cracked a plastic 55 gallon drum of gas at my cabin that's at least 10 years old. Not the oldest drum I've ever used. The gas is perfect.
     
  33. Dana

    Dana Pattern Altitude

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    I use avgas in my snowblower and lawnmower.
     
  34. Utah-Jay

    Utah-Jay Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Rotax engines are designed for MoGas, but can use 100LL if that is all that is available.
     
  35. pigpenracing

    pigpenracing En-Route

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    Using jugs sucks!
    I keep 3 55 gallon drums in my hangar on roll around drum dollies. Easier fueling in the hangar that taxing to the pump!
    Sometimes I fill them with 100LL and sometimes non-ethanol super. We have a fuel distributor local that delivers drums of fuel when needed.
    I also keep one in the garage for motorcycles. I use these pumps. I won't hassle with the stupid 5 gallon race fuel jugs. I know a local that does and his wing as all dented and scuffed from resting up there and holding that 30 pound jug up
    https://gpi.net/product/m-1115s-mu/
     
  36. Cap'n Jack

    Cap'n Jack Final Approach

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    That's nice if you can get avgas easily. I full the jugs for yard equipment once or twice a year (at most), and I'll take them when I'm already filling up the car.
     
  37. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Keeping large quantities of gasoline (of any sort) around in hangars/garages is foolish from a safety standpoint. It's second only to defueling a car or plane inside a hangar. I've had two friends who have lost planes in hangar fires due to defueling incidents (one was his own plane, one was in for maintenance when someone defueling another plane in the shop started a fire). I've also seen the same thing happen to my neighbor with his car.

    Does not pay to be cavalier with gasoline.
     
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  38. Matthew Rogers

    Matthew Rogers Cleared for Takeoff

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    And you are spraying more lead around your house and other neighborhood kids. Real smart. It’s bad enough that industry and aging government official can’t get a replacement for 100LL. And by that I mean they don’t care or someone will lose profits at the expense of lead in kinds brains. And yes, I schlep cans of MoGas to my plane for 99% of my flying.

    By the way, I have one of the 30 gallon metal gas caddies and the pump that came with it is crap and leaks everywhere. Currently looking to replace it. The container is great and the pickup tube is 1-2” off the bottom so I don’t have to worry about water or sediment in the fuel and I placed a few strong neodymium magnets on the bottom to catch any steel particles. There is a fine mesh filter for all the gas the goes into it.
     
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  39. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 En-Route

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    Speaking from both the airport side of things and as a firefighter, we have to draw a line somewhere. There are applicable fire codes so that's usually a start. Obviously common sense has to prevail at some point, so the fuel in the airplane has to be allowable. Stored fuels don't have to be there though. Not to mention, there are so many variables in the types of storage one might use, the dangers are there and are real. I've seen a lot of people's "solutions" over the years. While some understand the risk and do a decent job mitigating it with safe containers and housekeeping, I've also seen others who ignore what should even be common sense (just think open flame LP space heater near an open barrel of gasoline. :mad2: )

    T-hangars are especially an issue, because a fire will damage numerous owners property, as well as the one storing it. The airport has a duty to protect its property and that of other tenants. Sorry...
     
  40. EdFred

    EdFred Taxi to Parking

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    Most of my hangers are solid and don't have the ability to store anything in them. Also, I use them for hanging clothes, so I'm not sure I want automotive fuel smell on the clothes the hangers are supporting.