LVK to MRY

[vkhosid]

Hey guys...just a few quick question. Though, the title pretty much says it all.
I'm planning a short flight from livermore to monterrey in a week or two with my dad and uncle. Neither of them have been in the plane with me, and I just wanted to make sure there are as little surprises (for me) as possible. I've made the flight to SNS a number of times and have never really had any issues. Monterrey, I imagine, (since I've never actually landed there before) should be just as simple and easy.

Anything out of the ordinary that I should consider? I know the summers tend to bring in a marine layer. But that, as I understand it, is usually in the mornings. We wont be departing Livermore until about noon or so anyway. Would that be enough time for the layer to burn off? The plan is to land, have lunch, and then head back home. So I cant imagine we'll be there for very long. I've called both FBOs, and they both seem to have the same fee structure: $45 or 15 gallon minimum fuel purchase. They both say that they have crew cars available on a first come-first served basis.

Also (not that it matters much), I've never landed at a class C. So, like I said, anything that I haven't though of ye? Suggestions for which FBO, route, etc., would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[coloradobluesky]

There is a mountain to the south and to the west is the ocean and yes, fog can be there. Have an alternate that is out of the ocean fog environment. Don't push the weather. Monitor it daily between now and than and see when it is burning off. Good luck! It's a neat airport with terrific views.

 

[vkhosid]

There is a mountain to the south and to the west is the ocean and yes, fog can be there. Have an alternate that is out of the ocean fog environment. Don't push the weather. Monitor it daily between now and than and see when it is burning off. Good luck! It's a neat airport with terrific views.

Thanks! I was already planning contingencies if MRY is no bueno.

I figure if the weather is ****ty that day (and I know about it before we leave livermore) we'll head to 3O8. If it is bad when we arrive, I'll just head back up the coast to LVK (via the scenic route) and/or stop by in KSNS or something.

 

[danhagan]

I've called both FBOs, and they both seem to have the same fee structure: $45 or 15 gallon minimum fuel purchase. They both say that they have crew cars available on a first come-first served basis.

I'd find out how popular the courtesy car(s) is/are ... I took my son to Albuquerque to see the zoo and was told there'd be no problem ... on arrival, I got the "oops" they're all out and ended up renting a car for a 2 hour zoo visit

 

[Sac Arrow]

Watch out for the BFT in the hills north of MRY.

 

[vkhosid]

I'd find out how popular the courtesy car(s) is/are ... I took my son to Albuquerque to see the zoo and was told there'd be no problem ... on arrival, I got the "oops" they're all out and ended up renting a car for a 2 hour zoo visit

Already thought of that...lol. When I called and asked, they said I should call a day or two ahead of time, but that they don't "reserve" and that its first come-first served.

 

[Palmpilot]

Last time I checked, the FBOs there had a ramp fee. I think it was $45, which is waived if you buy 15 gallons of fuel.

 

[vkhosid]

Watch out for the BFT in the hills north of MRY.

Are you talking about the towers just north of SNS?

 

[Sac Arrow]

Are you talking about the towers just north of SNS?

No, it's a single tower just north of WVI.

 

[vkhosid]

No, it's a single tower just north of WVI.

Ohh, gotcha. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. I usually avoid it by staying east of 101 til I reach South County. Then I turn west and head for SNS...or in this case, MRY.

 

[MAKG1]

No, it's a single tower just north of WVI.

Yup, it's charted, and it's an enormous tower, a factor even at 4000 MSL.

Monterey is nearly trivial. Make sure you know the pattern altitude -- it's high. And fly a further pattern because of that. But ATC is really laid back, and traffic is pretty light, less than Salinas aside from the occasional MD80. One thing they will yell at you for is skipping noise abatement on takeoff -- and it will be in your clearance. No turns before crossing Hwy 1. They mean it.

Del Monte will waive the ramp fee for 15 gal or a top off. You probably won't use 15 gal coming from Livermore. It's expensive fuel.

 

[vkhosid]

Yup, it's charted, and it's an enormous tower, a factor even at 4000 MSL.

Monterey is nearly trivial. Make sure you know the pattern altitude -- it's high. And fly a further pattern because of that. But ATC is really laid back, and traffic is pretty light, less than Salinas aside from the occasional MD80. One thing they will yell at you for is skipping noise abatement on takeoff -- and it will be in your clearance. No turns before crossing Hwy 1. They mean it.

Del Monte will waive the ramp fee for 15 gal or a top off. You probably won't use 15 gal coming from Livermore. It's expensive fuel.

Can you expound on the "further pattern" comment a bit more? Also, regarding the fuel, I'll hopefully remember to ask my rental place to keep the fuel in the plan at somewhere around where I'll need to buy gas at MRY. I checked fuel prices, and they're a hair cheaper at MRY for full serve than they are at LVK for full serve. And since I'm renting wet, everyone will be happy. Except those selling gas at LVK...

 

[MAKG1]

You'll need more space to descend 1500 feet than you would have from 800 or 1000.

 

[Rykymus]

I fly from SCK to MRY at least twice a month. The layer does usually burn off by noon, but it can sometimes hang on. Usually, you can sneak in under the layer by coming up through Prunedale over Hwy 101, or by going out over the bay, dropping down, and sliding in under. Often, I've found while Salinas, Marina, and Watsonville are all MVFR or IFR, there's a big hole of blue over MRY. (It's weird that way.) Of all the times I've flown there, I've only had to turn around one time because the forecast OVC had no holes. Likely, though, from Livermore, you can probably stay under an OVC layer right down the valley and over Prunedale.

Beware, as the layer can roll back in before sundown.

I always use Del Monte Aviation. I've never had a problem getting a crew car, then again, I'm usually going there on a week day. They also have rental cars at a low rate of $40 for the day. (Through Enterprise.)

Overall, it's a pretty cool airport to fly in and out of.

 

[vkhosid]

You'll need more space to descend 1500 feet than you would have from 800 or 1000.

Totally didn't even see it that way. I thought you meant fly a wider pattern. Makes sense, though. Thanks

I fly from SCK to MRY at least twice a month. The layer does usually burn off by noon, but it can sometimes hang on. Usually, you can sneak in under the layer by coming up through Prunedale over Hwy 101, or by going out over the bay, dropping down, and sliding in under. Often, I've found while Salinas, Marina, and Watsonville are all MVFR or IFR, there's a big hole of blue over MRY. (It's weird that way.) Of all the times I've flown there, I've only had to turn around one time because the forecast OVC had no holes. Likely, though, from Livermore, you can probably stay under an OVC layer right down the valley and over Prunedale.

Beware, as the layer can roll back in before sundown.

I always use Del Monte Aviation. I've never had a problem getting a crew car, then again, I'm usually going there on a week day. They also have rental cars at a low rate of $40 for the day. (Through Enterprise.)

Overall, it's a pretty cool airport to fly in and out of.

The trip is planned for July 9th. We get the plane at noon, and should (want to) be back by about 4:30

 

[Kevin16587]

We flew into MRY a couple of weeks ago. It was my first time there. Pattern altitude on the south side is around 2,000 msl and it caught me off guard a bit. I should have extend downwind more to lose the additional altitude but I made it just fine with an aggressive slip. I rolled the dice and used del monte aviation. It was a nice facility and we got a nice crew car to use and it was a pretty busy weekend.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Shawn]

I am at WVI just up from MRY and June Gloom is in full swing. The marine layer in that area can burn off late and push in early this time of year so watch out for it.

If you are heading down to E16 then over, watch out for traffic over hwy 129 and the rock quarry heading over to the coast...it is a hotpsot with a lot of low level traffic zipping back and forth between the valley and coastline.

As far as a class C...it is about as low key of a class C that there is and NorCal in our area is about as friendly and accommodating as they come.

 

[ircphoenix]

At some point in the next couple months I'd like to haul my girlfriend up there, so I'm intensely focusing on this thread.

I love POA.... because even if I don't ask something, someone else probably will I'm short order, and there's tons of lurkers and google searchers that benefit from all of this.

 

[Shawn]

I usually avoid it by staying east of 101 til I reach South County. Then I turn west and head for SNS...or in this case, MRY.

On a route suggestion note...if you are taking folks for a scenic tour as well, get on Flight Following and you can cut across SJC midfield then follow Highway 880/17 over to Santa Cruz then down the coast to MRY...MUCH better view than the valley in the South Bay!

The new restaurant at WVI is also pretty good if MRY is socked in. Free transient day parking on the ramp right outside the restaurant.

 

[MAKG1]

If you need to divert, SNS is often clearer than both MRY and WVI, and while Hwy 68 sucks donkeys, it's a whole lot better than Hwy 1 on a tourist day, getting to Monterey.

Route will likely be determined by clouds. They hang out late over the Santa Cruz summit, but can sometimes be dodged south.

I tried out Ella's the other day. Food was decent, service was terrible.

 

[coma24]

A Class C arrival is a non-event if you already have flight following enroute (which you should). If you forgo FF, just be sure to establish contact with Norcal on the published frequency (based on direction of arrival, see the sectional legend here: https://skyvector.com/?ll=36.34844772028823,-125.1251926121822&chart=16&zoom=2, it'll be 127.15 or 133.0) prior to entering the Class C. Once you're talking to 'em, you're all set. You'll get a handoff to tower, after which it'll be just like landing at LVK.

Another source for the approach freqs: http://airnav.com/airport/kmry, and of course, the AFD.

 

[vkhosid]

I use FF all the time, especially when going up and down to the east of 101 in that area. At least once per flight, norcal gives me a particular heading to stick to for at least a few minutes because of either the arrivals to SJC or other traffic that I haven't spotted yet. So, I'm very comfortable communicating with ATC (and yes, they're very friendly).

Ideally, THISSSSSS is the route I'd like to take. Any comments? Suggestions? Anecdotes?

 

[Palmpilot]

It's a good idea to have an alternate route in mind, in case the class B portion is not available.

 

[MAKG1]

If Monterey is your first Class C, you'll wonder what all the fuss was about. It seems silly to me that it isn't Class D. Honestly, Marina and Watsonville are more difficult due to the jumper dumpers (and instrument traffic at WVI is usually against VFR traffic).

Maybe try a landing at Oakland. It's almost as easy, though it's quite a bit busier. San Jose is a PITA if there are any purple 737s around (you'll have to wait).

For your route of flight, don't follow the coast up to Watsonville, as you'll fly through two drop zones. Either inland or over the Bay. Also avoid the DER of WVI rwy 27. Direct to Santa Cruz from MRY is not a bad flight, and maybe you'll see a whale or two.

 

[Palmpilot]

...San Jose is a PITA if there are any purple 737s around (you'll have to wait)...

It's a pity they closed Rwy 29. There was never a wait for that one.

 

[vkhosid]

If Monterey is your first Class C, you'll wonder what all the fuss was about. It seems silly to me that it isn't Class D. Honestly, Marina and Watsonville are more difficult due to the jumper dumpers (and instrument traffic at WVI is usually against VFR traffic).

Maybe try a landing at Oakland. It's almost as easy, though it's quite a bit busier. San Jose is a PITA if there are any purple 737s around (you'll have to wait).

For your route of flight, don't follow the coast up to Watsonville, as you'll fly through two drop zones. Either inland or over the Bay. Also avoid the DER of WVI rwy 27. Direct to Santa Cruz from MRY is not a bad flight, and maybe you'll see a whale or two.

I don't have a concern landing at a Class C airport because its a class C, really. My main reasoning for asking these questions is because I've never been to MRY before and didn't know what to expect. Thanks for the suggestion about taking the flight over the water to Santa Cruz. Any particular height you'd recommend?

 

[MAKG1]

I don't have a concern landing at a Class C airport because its a class C, really. My main reasoning for asking these questions is because I've never been to MRY before and didn't know what to expect. Thanks for the suggestion about taking the flight over the water to Santa Cruz. Any particular height you'd recommend?

High enough to be within gliding distance of shore. That water is cold. 1000 feet for each 1.5 miles, at least. A couple of miles offshore is plenty for the meat bombs.

 

[Shawn]

For your route of flight, don't follow the coast up to Watsonville, as you'll fly through two drop zones. Either inland or over the Bay..

Actually the exact opposite. Looking at your flight plan I was gonna suggest flying the coastline up to Santa Cruz TO avoid the drop zones. You are well clear on the shoreline vs inland. A few feet offshore provides for some great views of the shoreline and keeps you clear of worrying about any jump activity. KWVI meat rockets drop just north of the field right in your flight path.

Flying up an seeing Capitola, Santa Cruz Pier and the lighthouse is pretty cool before heading up the peninsula.

If you have not done the Peninsula route before for the Bay Tour, expect to remain north and west of 280 at 3500' for the Bravo Transition.

 

[vkhosid]

If you have not done the Peninsula route before for the Bay Tour, expect to remain north and west of 280 at 3500' for the Bravo Transition.

The handful of times I've flown a bay tour, its always been coming from LVK north of OAK, dropping down below the B shelf, and putzing around alcatraz, GGB, etc, before returning back to LVK the same route I came in. So, the B transition by SFO will be new to me. To clarify, do you mean North and West of 101, and not 280? Would you mind showing a snippit from the skyvector site of your guesstimate of the route?

Thanks!

 

[Shawn]

Nope, remain south and west (correction...not north) of 280 is what I get most of time. There other variations for transitions over SFO but outta WVI that is what I get most of the time for Bay Tour requests up the peninsula.

https://skyvector.com/?ll=37.49200342650343,-122.25842284801521&chart=301&zoom=2&fpl= KLVK KRHV E16 KSNS KMRY 3650N12149W 3658N12154W 3658N12156W 3657N12159W 3658N12200W 3656N12202W 3716N12158W 3724N12212W 3731N12222W 3742N12231W 3749N12230W 3757N12214W KLVK

Although there is a Parachute symbol on the sectional by Aptos on the coast, they are not permitted to drop there on the beach any longer so that Drop Zone is not a factor.

 

[Palmpilot]

There are two common transition routes past SFO:

1. Southwest of Highway 101, usually at 1500 to 2000 MSL; and

2. In the vicinity of Interstate 280, around 3,500 MSL or so.

 

[MAKG1]

It's either south and west of 101 (not 280) at 1500 or 3500, or west of the mountains at 4500. The former is much more common. Note that if you transition the B at 1500, you will need to talk to SFO Tower, not NorCal. They will hand you off, unless they tell you to remain clear.

Not a big deal, but have a plan in case NorCal says "remain clear of Class B." It happens on nice VFR weekends sometimes. If there isn't any marine layer, you can duck under, offshore, at 1400. If there is marine layer, you might have some luck with NorCal with "unable," or you may have to go around Oakland.

What instructions you get is a big function of where you are when you ask for it.

My experience has been that NorCal doesn't like me transitioning around 280 much, even if allowed by the clearance. I tend to get traffic vectors closer to SFO to make room for departing traffic.

 

[vkhosid]

Nope, remain north and west of 280 is what I get most of time. There other variations for transitions over SFO but outta WVI that is what I get most of the time for Bay Tour requests up the peninsula.

https://skyvector.com/?ll=37.49200342650343,-122.25842284801521&chart=301&zoom=2&fpl= KLVK KRHV E16 KSNS KMRY 3650N12149W 3658N12154W 3658N12156W 3657N12159W 3658N12200W 3656N12202W 3716N12158W 3724N12212W 3731N12222W 3742N12231W 3749N12230W 3757N12214W KLVK

Although there is a Parachute symbol on the sectional by Aptos on the coast, they are not permitted to drop there on the beach any longer so that Drop Zone is not a factor.

Though I've never experienced it myself. I've heard that Tower will allow you to fly right up to SFO, as long as you stay west of 101 (not 280): Allowing a better/cooler view of SFO.

 

[Shawn]

It's either south and west of 101 (not 280) at 1500 or 3500, or west of the mountains at 4500.

Wow, you have NEVER gotten SW of 280 @3500'?...must not get through there much...as I mentioned there are other routes...that is just been my instructions 9 times outta 10....along with 3500' west of the mountains when heading up past HAF

Point being there is no hard and fast rule...but I guess that since others never experienced it...it must not exist.

 

[MAKG1]

Though I've never experienced it myself. I've heard that Tower will allow you to fly right up to SFO, as long as you stay west of 101 (not 280): Allowing a better/cooler view of SFO.

I've experienced it many times.

Approach the Class B from near 101 at 1500. Make sure you take all the handoffs -- there will be a ton of them. SJC, NUQ, PAO, SQL, then SFO Tower. If SFO Tower says no, climb to 3500 and see what you get from NorCal.

 

[MAKG1]

Wow, you have NEVER gotten SW of 280 @3500'?...must not get through there much...as I mentioned there are other routes...that is just been my instructions 9 times outta 10....along with 3500' west of the mountains when heading up past HAF

Point being there is no hard and fast rule...but I guess that since others never experienced it...it must not exist.

No, I've never gotten that. In fact, I've had NorCal vector me AWAY from 280 several times due to departing airliners. No, I don't do it much from Watsonville.

 

[vkhosid]

I've experienced it many times.

Approach the Class B from near 101 at 1500. Make sure you take all the handoffs -- there will be a ton of them. SJC, NUQ, PAO, SQL, then SFO Tower. If SFO Tower says no, climb to 3500 and see what you get from NorCal.

The space is fairly tight over there? Would I have enough time/room to climb from 1500 to 3500 between SQL and SFO if SFO Tower says, go away?

 

[MAKG1]

The space is fairly tight over there? Would I have enough time/room to climb from 1500 to 3500 between SQL and SFO if SFO Tower says, go away?

Well, you don't have to fly in a straight line (at least not VFR), so yes. One lazy 360 ought to do it. Tell SQL Tower you're doing it if you're in their airspace.

 

[vkhosid]

Well, you don't have to fly in a straight line (at least not VFR), so yes. One lazy 360 ought to do it. Tell SQL Tower you're doing it if you're in their airspace.

Makes sense.

 

[Palmpilot]

When you're approaching through SQL's airspace, SQL Tower will tell you if SFO Tower is not accepting transitions. However, as a backup, never cross Highway 92 before hearing "cleared into class bravo."