Kind of a Sad Commentary About our Young People

[wsuffa]

I generally agree on principle. We're in a situation now though where a college degree is assumed, and without one you dramatically disadvantage yourself unfortunately. I remember at college fairs I would attend there seemed to be an equal number of academic booths as there were financing booths. I thought it was odd that people were racing to give you $100K.. but obviously they're in it to make to money and those returns they get keep them in business. The college doesn't care how expensive it is, because they know the student will get financing for it. Crazy

At the same time, many colleges rely on (and compete for) foreign students. Some of them are feeling the effects of our war on immigration.

 

[RJM62]

Touching on the ASVAB...I just graduated high school, took the test as a junior. I made a 90, I'm not saying that to brag, its a pretty easy test. 95% of the content is common knowledge IMO. Friends of mine that also took it ranged in scores of 80-95. Passing depends on the branch but somewhere in the area of a 50%(or lower!) is considered passing by most branches of the military. Now I'm not going into the military for a variety of reasons, but myself & friends included have gotten a TON of calls from recruiters due to our ASVAB scores.

I found out a while later there were a few students I know in my testing room that didn't do so well(as in failed completely). Well those students finished the tests in about 30% of the time that I did. (Sidenote, these were students that were enrolled in ROTC and seriously wanted to go into the military.) That's not near enough time to read the questions let alone give a reasonable answer. I don't think those kids took it seriously at all, and just Christmas tree'd the answer sheet.

I bring this up b/c I wonder if the large portion of kids not passing is due to not taking the test seriously. Kids in programs like ROTC may be led to believe by their instructors that the tests are very easy, and therefore don't try on the test.

When I took the ASVAB, it was divided into several sections, the most amusing of which involved picking out the letter "C" from a row of "O"s. The whole section was questions like:

1. OOOCO
2. OOCOO
3. OOOCO
4. OCOOO

with the correct answer being the letter corresponding to the place that contained a "C" instead of an "O." So the answer to OOOCO would be D, for example. As goofy as it seems, that was one of the most important tests. They called it "Attention to Detail," and all the better ratings required high scores on that section.

Most students in my school did extremely well on the ASVAB, probably due both to the school's specialized vocational nature, and to the fact that at least half the shop teachers were WWII and Korean War veterans or retirees. I think they subconsciously designed their tests a lot like the tests they'd taken while in the military. I know the ASVAB seemed very familiar when I took it.

Rich

 

[Sam D]

The concept of "everyone needs to go to college" is absolutely ridiculous and one of the biggest scams in modern history, perhaps the biggest scam. Yes, everyone should have the ability to go to college, but it's not an experience that everyone needs or that everyone benefits from. In my case, the cost was well worth it. For many, it's not even close.

I think that's because most people don't understand the difference between correlation and causation.

 

[Tantalum]

At the same time, many colleges rely on (and compete for) foreign students. Some of them are feeling the effects of our war on immigration.

Which the surface little question to that is "why don't we compete to educate our own" and the deeper layer is "if the foreign students are more qualified and thus colleges compete for them more, then why are our own citizens under qualified?" <- not my questions per se.. but from what I read from both sides that tends to be the core premises

..thought provoking stuff

I totally took RJM's thread off the rails here, but this gave me a laugh

 

[SkyDog58]

Which has been bastardized by some small business owners to mean "I'm getting paid, even if I don't pay any other bills".

Large business owners as well as small ones do this. They even pay themselves large salaries while the company goes bankrupt and although they build some great personnel wealth, they leave bankrupt companies behind them. Unfortunately, they also cause damage to other companies such as contractors and vendors. But they always manage to keep their own wealth intact while they ruin that of others.

 

[tspear]

*the housing costs are insane. Rents in any legitimate urban environment are through the roof, meaning people can't save for that house. If you do somehow happen to save for a house then thanks to Barnie Frank and unstable market there are ridiculous hoops to jump through, even if you have a strong six figure income, 800 credit, etc.

Actually, a lot of this can be blamed on baby boomers. Baby boomers are the generation that largely pushed for and created zoning requirements starting in the late 70s and early 80s. It is the zoning requirements that have done more to constrain available housing supply than almost any other initiative. There are obvious exceptions, such is in NYC. But for most metro areas, this holds true.

*typical healthcare costs have increased 8 fold since 1980.. in all reality you basically can't go to the doctor unless you mooch off your parents, pay some exorbitant amount for COBRA, or are lucky enough to have a job that offers benefits. My job has a very healthy insurance program, but many of our friends do not.. the state run panels are not accepted by many practitioners and a simple filling (or root canal) can cost several hundred, if not run into the thousands without coverage. Even with good coverage be prepared to spend a ton of money on your "patient responsibility"

Actually most healthcare money is spent on the elderly, they just want young people to pay for it. As much as people complain about ACA, it really screwed the younger generation by forcing them to pay a greater portion of the healthcare costs in the country.

The Navy doesn't have sergeants.

Yeah, you are right! Now I wonder why they called him Sarge, and which branch he was in; I made the assumption of Navy because he talked about visiting ports....

Two words: "Common" and "Core".

You're welcome.

Oh, and don't forget that the push now is "free college for everyone". You get what you pay for.

How about a ribbon that says "ninth place"? :O

I say learn more and skip platitudes, especially when they are largely incorrect.
Common Core is getting blamed for showing our education sucks in the vast majority of the country and is not setup to meet current economic requirements. Common Core is simply an education standard, for decades Universities, Colleges and business leaders have asked that a high school diploma from every school in the country meant the students met a common standard. The goal being to eliminate placement testing. Common Core was the first attempt to harmonize the K-12 education standards in the USA; and it was led by the states. And what has largely killed it is politics, generally in states where they went with prescriptive answers to meeting the standard or they failed to meet the standard.

Free college is a political response to shift the cost burden by those who trying to afford it now. When I went to college in the early 90s, my part time income making minimum wage was enough to pay my tuition; it was not enough to live. But I could at least afford school. Now, my oldest kids just finished school, full time minimum wage does not even come close to paying for just the tuition for part time classes for an in state school. My parents are retired college professors, and I have had an in-law on the board of trustees for a community college. Guess what is the largest three drivers for cost increases they saw for colleges? 1. Retirement costs for previous years were unfunded (this is changing at the college/university level, from what I can see) 2. Medical expenses, think health insurance. 3. Technology, constant updates.

Tim

 

[SkyDog58]

I recall the ASVAB being a battery of tests with an individual score for each test in the battery. I believe that is what the B in ASVAB stands for. You did not just get one score. If you scored well on one test but low on another test, that did not disqualify you from the military rather it steered you towards jobs in which your high score subjects were relevant and away from ones where your low score subjects were relevant. Now if you scored low on every test, that usually meant you would be a grunt, truck driver, cook, etc. High scores in everything would get steered towards aviation and other technical fields and military intelligence (yeah, I know, an oxymoron).

 

[denverpilot]

Because military service places one in situations in which even momentary lapses of attention can have very undesirable consequences for one's self, comrades, and country.

Rich

If that’s the standard can we disqualify every politician who sends kids to war who has ANY hint of mental illness?

Large business owners as well as small ones do this. They even pay themselves large salaries while the company goes bankrupt and although they build some great personnel wealth, they leave bankrupt companies behind them. Unfortunately, they also cause damage to other companies such as contractors and vendors. But they always manage to keep their own wealth intact while they ruin that of others.

I’ve always wanted a job with a Golden Parachute. I would so screw that job up royally while looking like I was “trying really hard”. LOL. Just enough to tick off all of my Board Member buddies from my frat days at [insert wherever here] so they’d have to fire me and I could still cash the checks. Hahaha.

 

[Lachlan]

I love the student loan whining. No one compares averages WAGES “back then” to current starting wages for college grads. Kids these days are making what would have amounted to a king’s ransom in the old days. Ok, they have more expensive schooling. They earn more. It takes money to make money.

 

[TCABM]

It would be interesting to see how much of that student loan money is actually for tuition and fees.

When our kids were in college (grads in 2016, no loans) the racket was student housing and meal plans.

Go off campus and living becomes much easier when you’re not paying $1000+ per month per person to have a bed and roommate as well as another $2500/semester for a meal plan that doesn’t provide 3 meals/day 7 days/week.

Let’s call it 4 months per semester and that’s $6500 for a bed and food. 15 hrs at the TAMU average of $300/credit hour is only $4500.

Then, realize some will take out the max loan available while only needing a portion of it.

College doesn’t have to be as expensive as most make it, especially with the amount of dual credit programs and partner/transfer community college programs today.

The funny part is that college is a block checker for the most part. Most jobs don’t actually require a college education to do the job. Companies and the federal government put that requirement in there to weed out candidates.

How we prepare youth to be successful in America today is not what colleges are in the business of.

 

[CC268]

Lol meal plans are such a rip off. The university made you buy one if you were in the dorms (which I was freshman year)

 

[wsuffa]

I say learn more and skip platitudes, especially when they are largely incorrect.
Common Core is getting blamed for showing our education sucks in the vast majority of the country and is not setup to meet current economic requirements. Common Core is simply an education standard, for decades Universities, Colleges and business leaders have asked that a high school diploma from every school in the country meant the students met a common standard. The goal being to eliminate placement testing. Common Core was the first attempt to harmonize the K-12 education standards in the USA; and it was led by the states. And what has largely killed it is politics, generally in states where they went with prescriptive answers to meeting the standard or they failed to meet the standard.

Free college is a political response to shift the cost burden by those who trying to afford it now. When I went to college in the early 90s, my part time income making minimum wage was enough to pay my tuition; it was not enough to live. But I could at least afford school. Now, my oldest kids just finished school, full time minimum wage does not even come close to paying for just the tuition for part time classes for an in state school. My parents are retired college professors, and I have had an in-law on the board of trustees for a community college. Guess what is the largest three drivers for cost increases they saw for colleges? 1. Retirement costs for previous years were unfunded (this is changing at the college/university level, from what I can see) 2. Medical expenses, think health insurance. 3. Technology, constant updates.

Tim

I actually know more about it than you're willing to give me credit for. But I don't come in here to argue.

I know exactly what common core is - and how it's been abused by educators in a lot of places (including using it as a wedge to separate parents from what their kids learn).

Primary education has been a real problem for a long time. Early public education was established to ensure that employers would have a steady stream of folks educated to basic standards that would make them employable. That hasn't happened in decades. In one city, the employers say that less than 25% of the graduates have the skills necessary. So what's next? Well, we make people go to college for those skills. I will predict that exactly the same thing will happen: once this becomes publicly funded (and virtually mandatory), it will still leave students ill-prepared for the workplace. That's especially true as we push out the low-skill jobs through automation or offshoring.

"Free College" is indeed a political response, but only a small part is the cost burden issue. Part of it is about chest thumping that the US will have more college graduates than other countries, part of it is that the bachelor's degree is what the high school degree was a couple of generations ago, and part of it is about control & power. Like healthcare, it's about a lot of things that elected folks don't want to talk about.

A lot of folks that never belong in college are pushed to do so by the school systems and politicians. We need a robust education system that encompasses both college - for those who belong - and trades. The cost drivers include the things you mentioned (and they are not altogether different than government agencies face, so there won't be any savings by going fully-taxpayer-funded. In fact, it'll allow some of that to be hidden. And the cost drivers are vastly different between the "public" schools (state schools, where subsidies are being cut back) and private institutions.

One private institution close to me has adopted a pretty strong policy that each part of the university must turn a profit. (and they own massive real estate holdings to the point where they'd still make money even if the education part shut down). In the state-school arena, similar policies are being adopted as state subsidies are cut back, but the politicians (via the Board of Visitor appointments) still exercise control.

Bottom line: it's a mess, and just making it all "free" won't fix the problem. Just like nationalizing health care won't fix the underlying problems there.

 

[dmspilot]

I love the student loan whining. No one compares averages WAGES “back then” to current starting wages for college grads. Kids these days are making what would have amounted to a king’s ransom in the old days. Ok, they have more expensive schooling. They earn more. It takes money to make money.

 

[sarangan]

Which the surface little question to that is "why don't we compete to educate our own" and the deeper layer is "if the foreign students are more qualified and thus colleges compete for them more, then why are our own citizens under qualified?" <- not my questions per se.. but from what I read from both sides that tends to be the core premises

..thought provoking stuff

I totally took RJM's thread off the rails here, but this gave me a laugh

As a college professor, I can answer this. This has little to do with aptitude but more to do with the underlying motive for college. The easiest path to immigration to the U.S. is to get admission into a U.S. graduate college, which automatically comes with a 2 year work visa, and a clear path towards naturalization. American students don't have that motivation, so they are very harder to recruit. It is not a matter of who is more qualified, but rather a matter of who is more desperate.

 

[Velocity173]

I forget the format of the ASVAB. All I remember is, I needed to score at least a 110 GT to qualify for ATC / C-130 Navigator.

 

[tspear]

@wsuffa

Great summary. I agree with every point, except one. Public funding of colleges, like all government funded services eventually runs into budget problems.
At that point, issues are often addressed. This can be seen in many places in Europe, as the costs of universities rose in 80s, they started creating and pushing more tech schools. That is just one example....

I have always believed regardless if you are discussing public funded solutions, or free markets you need a forcing function to make things work.

Tim

 

[N3368K]

My wife is a 25+ year public elementary/middle school teacher who has certified and taught in three states and in DODDS in Germany. She is precluded from even implying to parents/guardians/etc that a kid might need treatment. She can tell the parents about behavior but cannot even recommend a kid be tested for ADD/ADHD.

As for military names, I had a Staff Sergeant General Ford. Yep. Ma and pa named him General. Once knew a Major with the last name Sargent.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Clip4]

I was talking to a recently-retired Navy guy today. He spent his last few years as a recruiter.

According to this fellow, more than 70 percent of prospective recruits are ineligible for military service at the time that they first apply, with the single biggest reason being obesity. Also in the top ten were inability to pass the ASVAB test, dirty urine screens, childhood ADHD diagnoses, and various bodily mutilations kids do to themselves these days.

He also said that he'd regularly been yelled at by applicants' parents, and sometimes had had complaints filed against him, for "fat shaming" applicants. Apparently that's what they call it now when you inform an applicant that they need to lose some weight to qualify for enlistment. Fat shaming.

The fact that kids are failing the ASVAB is also disappointing to me because it's really not that difficult a test. It's usually taken by Juniors in High School if they have any interest in the military. Apparently it used to be that scoring so low on the ASVAB that you didn't qualify for any military service at all was almost unheard of. But nowadays it's the second most-common reason for rejection. That's a poor commentary on our education system.

Another 10 percent of applicants qualify, but are considered marginal cases. The military will take them if they have to in order to meet their recruitment goals, but they'd rather not if they don't have to.

So in the end, only about 20 percent of initial applicants for military service are fully-qualified at the time of first application. That's pretty sad.

Rich

The economy is good, so qualified candidates can make a whole lot more outside military service.

 

[denverpilot]

Lol meal plans are such a rip off. The university made you buy one if you were in the dorms (which I was freshman year)

Right? WTF is wrong with ramen and beer? LOL.

 

[SkyDog58]

My wife is a 25+ year public elementary/middle school teacher who has certified and taught in three states and in DODDS in Germany. She is precluded from even implying to parents/guardians/etc that a kid might need treatment. She can tell the parents about behavior but cannot even recommend a kid be tested for ADD/ADHD.

As for military names, I had a Staff Sergeant General Ford. Yep. Ma and pa named him General. Once knew a Major with the last name Sargent.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Parents can be real stupid or at least silly when it comes to naming their kids. It seems up be more and more the case these days.

 

[tspear]

@Lachlan

Median income is skewed, especially now with an aging workforce due to baby bombers. If you want to use median income, find it for those aged 18-26, those are effectively the college years.
Without that data, minimum wage is likely a closer proximate value since that is what college students mostly earn.

Tim

 

[Omalley1537]

Personally, I've never known, nor known of, a kid taking meds for ADHD in which case it didn't start with their school "suggesting" it, or in many cases, even providing a contract shrink to write the script. I also know of at least two occasions when the school threatened the parents with being reported to Social Services for neglect if they didn't comply.

Most parents want their kids to be perfect. I doubt too many want to put them on speed just for ****s and giggles. Most times, I strongly suspect, the school makes the initial suggestion.

Rich

There’s another avenue: parents with zero accountability and/or desire to work with their kids on improving. They doctor-shop until one “diagnoses” their little angel with ABCD disorder and hands them meds. Now when their kid acts up, all they have to do is say that Jane/Johnnie has “ABCD disorder” and it’s not his/her fault. No accountability for the kid or parent.

 

[weilke]

Some years back I spent pretty much every afternoon in a local Starbucks to study for an exam. The store was also the conference room for the army recruiter that covers the local community college. I had the opportunity to over-hear the hard work involved in getting the early 20s kids ready for enlistment. Hook them up with a lawyer to get their drug record sealed, manage their weight loss/PE program, process the different medical waivers etc. Probably an artifact of the crowd he had to work with. Those were not the high-schoolers who already knew where they wanted to go for boot-camp, studied for the test etc. This was the '5 years at the community college while working in retail and now its time to get started with life' clientele.

 

[denverpilot]

Some years back I spent pretty much every afternoon in a local Starbucks to study for an exam.

I tried that exactly once during CFI prep. I have no idea how people study in places like that. I think many of them want to go there so they can take a selfie and pretend to study on social media. Hahaha.

 

[weilke]

I tried that exactly once during CFI prep. I have no idea how people study in places like that. I think many of them want to go there so they can take a selfie and pretend to study on social media. Hahaha.

No selfies here. Starbucks has taken a lot of my money over the course of my different board and re-certification exams. Just works better with people around and without the distractions of my home.

 

[Lachlan]

@Lachlan

Median income is skewed, especially now with an aging workforce due to baby bombers. If you want to use median income, find it for those aged 18-26, those are effectively the college years.
Without that data, minimum wage is likely a closer proximate value since that is what college students mostly earn.

Tim

Irrelevant. Students do not typically pay back loans. Graduates and dropouts, different stories. Median income of college graduates? Probably more than it was in 1985 and probably more than minimum wage.

I live the *adjusted for inflation numbers, too. You can’t go back in time with today’s dollars and buy stuff, nor could you defer yesteryear’s costs until the values increase. Some things get more expensive more quickly than others. That’s life. The altetnative is “well, don’t go to college if you don’t want the debt.” Spend more on education, earn more in life.

 

[Everskyward]

There’s another avenue: parents with zero accountability and/or desire to work with their kids on improving. They doctor-shop until one “diagnoses” their little angel with ABCD disorder and hands them meds. Now when their kid acts up, all they have to do is say that Jane/Johnnie has “ABCD disorder” and it’s not his/her fault. No accountability for the kid or parent.

Plus many parents, and grandparents, use meds to "feel better". So it would make sense that they wouldn't protest if someone suggested it for the kids.

 

[bnt83]

I would probably be alarmed to know what percentage of the population is on meds.

 

[denverpilot]

No selfies here. Starbucks has taken a lot of my money over the course of my different board and re-certification exams. Just works better with people around and without the distractions of my home.

Hat tip to you then. I can’t do it. I end up looking at all the people trying to figure out why they’re buying $8 coffee drinks. LOL.

 

[denverpilot]

I would probably be alarmed to know what percentage of the population is on meds.

Legal and illegal. You would.

Working at company that runs a call center that specializes in giving people the bad news that they didn’t pass their drug tests for their employment, allows them to “defend” themselves with prescriptions, and watching it grow significantly in 4 years, got me over it.

Half the country is perennially high on something. Which pretty much explains most of social media.

And those that aren’t high, are drunk regularly. If not daily.

 

[CC268]

Right? WTF is wrong with ramen and beer? LOL.

Only thing I had freshman year was chipotle, Panda Express and coors light. Yea buddyyyy!

 

[hindsight2020]

I love the student loan whining. No one compares averages WAGES “back then” to current starting wages for college grads. Kids these days are making what would have amounted to a king’s ransom in the old days. Ok, they have more expensive schooling. They earn more. It takes money to make money.

Bull. Adjusted for inflation we make less today. Check your "facts".

 

[CC268]

You old fellas are worrying too much. Us millennials will change this world for the better, one tequila shot at a time. Might even move out of the parents basement at some point!

 

[denverpilot]

Only thing I had freshman year was chipotle, Panda Express and coors light. Yea buddyyyy!

And Taco Bell for those special Friday night occasions...

 

[denverpilot]

You old fellas are worrying too much. Us millennials will change this world for the better, one tequila shot at a time. Might even move out of the parents basement at some point!

“The headlines read, these are the worst of times. I do believe it’s true.” - Styx, Best of Times, Paradise Theater, 1981.

 

[denverpilot]

“I have to have things my own way, to keep me in my youth.” - Supertramp, Goodbye Stranger, Breakfast In America, 1979.

 

[Lachlan]

Bull. Adjusted for inflation we make less today. Check your "facts".

It would be hard to argue that. Adjusted for quality of life, though, how do those same "we" fair? Nearly everything is better, improved, or brand new tech that didn't even exist 30 years (or less!) ago. Modernization comes with a price. Nothing is ever going to get less expensive; everything will, however, continue to get cheaper. I don't envy kids these days. Just like our parents didn't envy us, and before that, and before that. In reality life is progressing in an overall positive direction. We haven't moved back to the dark ages. We've surged into the future. It comes at a cost.

 

[CC268]

Two years he walks the earth. No phone, no pool, no pets, no cigarettes. Ultimate freedom. An extremist. An aesthetic voyager whose home is the road. Escaped from Atlanta. Thou shalt not return, 'cause "the West is the best." And now after two rambling years comes the final and greatest adventure. The climactic battle to kill the false being within and victoriously conclude the spiritual pilgrimage. Ten days and nights of freight trains and hitchhiking bring him to the Great White North. No longer to be poisoned by civilization he flees, and walks alone upon the land to become lost in the wild.

--Alexander Supertramp, May 1992

 

[denverpilot]

Two years he walks the earth. No phone, no pool, no pets, no cigarettes. Ultimate freedom. An extremist. An aesthetic voyager whose home is the road. Escaped from Atlanta. Thou shalt not return, 'cause "the West is the best." And now after two rambling years comes the final and greatest adventure. The climactic battle to kill the false being within and victoriously conclude the spiritual pilgrimage. Ten days and nights of freight trains and hitchhiking bring him to the Great White North. No longer to be poisoned by civilization he flees, and walks alone upon the land to become lost in the wild.

--Alexander Supertramp, May 1992

Sounds like a PC version of Kerouac, who probably didn’t shoot his girlfriend in the head while drunk in Mexico.

 

[FormerHangie]

Pretty sure it wasn’t kids saying put me on ADHD meds, but their parents demanding pediatricians to do it without a proper diagnosis. I witnessed a pretty good argument between a husband and wife in my daughter’s doctor’s office waiting room. Pretty sad.

Most of the time it is a teacher that starts the diagnosis, and refers it to the school counselor, who brings in the parents. The parent is expected to make an appointment with the child's pediatrician, assuming the child has one. The pediatrician or other physician is the one to make the ultimate diagnosis. I've never yet found an M. D. who had a problem refusing a parent's request if he or she thought it inappropriate.

Personally, I've never known, nor known of, a kid taking meds for ADHD in which case it didn't start with their school "suggesting" it, or in many cases, even providing a contract shrink to write the script. I also know of at least two occasions when the school threatened the parents with being reported to Social Services for neglect if they didn't comply.

Most parents want their kids to be perfect. I doubt too many want to put them on speed just for ****s and giggles. Most times, I strongly suspect, the school makes the initial suggestion.

Rich

The reason that the school usually starts the process is that the primary symptom is that the child starts failing a class he or she was previously doing well in.

Schools and parents/families on medicaid (welfare) do receive more money for special needs children, (anyone diagnosed with add,adhd,addiction etc.) there might be an incentive for some. In my area of the state some 40%+ are on medicaid. I am in the medical profession and have seen a dramatic rise over the years in add, adhd, etc. and meds dispensed.
I know we haven’t genetically changed that much in a generation or two.......

No, humans haven't changed but the expectations for them have. Back when I started working, there was no such thing as computer skills among the general public. Most people had never touched a computer keyboard. Now, middle schoolers have a good familiarity with Word and Powerpoint, and some of them know Excel. Everyone is expected to get at least some familiarity with abstract math, and if you have hopes of getting into one of the upper third of the universities in this country you'll need four years of math in high school and biology, chemistry, and physics. There are a lot of people for whom these subjects don't come naturally and require a high level of focus. If you're prone to ADHD it's nearly impossible to maintain the needed focus.

Because military service places one in situations in which even momentary lapses of attention can have very undesirable consequences for one's self, comrades, and country.

Rich

I think you and the military have the wrong idea of what people with ADHD are like. I have two daughters, one deals with ADHD, the other does not. If you dealt with them on a daily basis you'd never figure out which one was dealing with ADHD. She's slightly more forgetful than her sister, but she's also more energetic, and for anything that interests her, she's extremely focused. What she struggles with is having to learn material that she's not particularly interested in or does not have a great amount of aptitude for.

Here's an article on what types of jobs that adults who are dealing with ADHD are well suited: https://www.healthline.com/health/adhd/best-jobs. The author lists six job attributes of professions where adults with ADHD will thrive:

1. Interest
2. Urgency
3. Structure
4. Fast pace
5. Hands-on and creative
6. Entrepreneurial
   

I have to think the Army could find something within their ranks that ADHD soldiers would do well. I worked with a guy who is an adult who was diagnosed with ADHD. He built our data mart from scratch. He was also an ex-Marine, where he worked in intelligence.