iPad and foreflight?

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by LoLPilot, Jan 4, 2019.

  1. LoLPilot

    LoLPilot Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2018
    Messages:
    435
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    LoLPilot
    Hey guys and gals. I’m toying with taking advantage of the Best Buy after Christmas sales and getting an ipad to run foreflight. I’m just wondering if it’s worth it.

    Please consider this before replying:

    I am a doctoral student. Cost is of the utmost importance right now. I work a couple different jobs and I am not going to the airlines - this is all just for fun for me and I’d like to instruct one day.

    I’m working on my IR and my instructor told me I might want to get an iPad and foreflight for the approach charts. The iPad would be $350 at my local BB and FF would run me $100 for the basic subscription. Right now I’m not flying for any reason other than to continue my work towards my instrument rating, so I only need to buy St. Louis area plate books. The places I’m going to fly for my training could be covered in two books. That’s $20 on Sportys.

    I can buy a lot of approach plate book editions for $450 and that gets me almost three lessons. I don’t mind using paper charts and nav logs, much to the joy of some of the Safety pilots I’ve flown with who find my old-school approach to be greatly amusing.

    Worth it? Or put the money towards cockpit time?
     
  2. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 29, 2007
    Messages:
    8,202
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    PaulS
    I think it depends on what you are flying. A 172 with 2 vors or even a 430 then probably worth it. But a Cirrus with perspective, or a later model garmin with charts and adsb, might be better to wait til you start making more money. I have an ipad pro 10.5 with FF and love it, for flight planning. I use it in the cockpit of a Cirrus with perspective mostly for back up. YMMV
     
  3. LoLPilot

    LoLPilot Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2018
    Messages:
    435
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    LoLPilot
    At my school I’m flying 172N and P models with 430W’s, dual VORs, and ADSB. Not glass cockpit but I like the steam gauges. I use skyvector to get basic headings, distances, and times, then do paper nav logs.
     
  4. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2010
    Messages:
    16,637
    Location:
    Denton, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
    Nothing wrong with learning and flying OG Slant A. Represent!
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  5. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 29, 2007
    Messages:
    8,202
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    PaulS
    Honestly, to get the most functionality out of FF you need the IPAD model with the internal GPS (cellular model, although you can use it without paying for a data plan for it). That will give you a moving map in the cockpit, or you can buy a stratux or stratux knockoff for a few hundred and use that gps, the stratux will give you an AHRS plus adsb traffic, which is nice, but you start paying more for FF to use some of the stuff. You are flying pretty capable airplanes that can get you anywhere you want to go. Paper charts, although a pain in the butt, are probably all you need.

    I would do some research starting on the FF website, look at the different plans and what you need out of them, then FF is pretty good at defining which model IPAD will work for you. At the end of the day it depends on your budget, I would not give up flying hours for FF if I were in that situation myself.

    I like my FF though, it's great for IFR flight planning and briefing, works well for VFR too.
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  6. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2015
    Messages:
    2,407
    Location:
    KLAF
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    455 Bravo Uniform
    Do you use an iPhone? You could skip the iPad for now and get it later if you wanted. Plus it has the GPS chip built in. And if you liked it, then you could add an iPad later, as you are allowed to run one copy on each device.

    You could also try FltPlanGo for free on your phone.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2019
    LoLPilot likes this.
  7. LoLPilot

    LoLPilot Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2018
    Messages:
    435
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    LoLPilot
    Thanks for the input! I decided to stick with paper. Battery life is better.
     
    GRG55 likes this.
  8. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,277
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    Could also go with a cheaper Android based tablet and one of the numerous free apps out there. I was running a $199 Samsung tablet with FltPlanGo app for years until I started doing some 135 work that required use of Foreflight.
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  9. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages:
    4,068
    Location:
    A Rubber Room
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Cli4ord
    For what you are doing you do not need FF, but a basic EFB would be nice. I would buy an IPAD and run SkyCharts. It’s nothing but the charts with ownship on both the IAPs and enroute. $4 a month. http://www.skycharts.net/
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  10. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2015
    Messages:
    12,690
    Location:
    My own special place.
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Canis Non Grata
    I personally consider my iPad with FF to be one of the best aviation gear purchases that I have made.
     
  11. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2015
    Messages:
    2,407
    Location:
    KLAF
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    455 Bravo Uniform
    Yeah, it’s definately worth it. I keep renewing the stupid thing...
     
  12. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2005
    Messages:
    22,343
    Location:
    Michigan
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Ed Frederick
    Android +Avare is more than adequate, and it free. Well the Avare part anyway.
     
  13. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages:
    4,068
    Location:
    A Rubber Room
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Cli4ord
    Except FF is not gear purchase, it is a software service agreement.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2019
  14. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages:
    4,068
    Location:
    A Rubber Room
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Cli4ord
    LolPilot, also all these chart apps allow 30 trial for free. You can easily get 6-7 months of charts free and decide which you like best, which is what I would do a cash strapped college student.
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  15. pigpenracing

    pigpenracing Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2012
    Messages:
    2,208
    Location:
    Brenham Tx
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    pigpen
    Ipad 10.5 PRO and Wing X. Best combo in my opinion. The Mini 4 is second choice.
    I love my Ram EZ Roller cradles for my ipads and iphone.
    Ram does not and will not make a snap in cradle for the newer PRO 11 or 12.9 which is a killer for me.
    I bought a new 12.9 pro for the house and just returned it and bought another PRO 10.5
    The PRO and the mini 4 have a antiglare screen. The others do not and you can't read them in the sun.
    I am a long time Wing X user and it has features the others don't. Last mont I again tried the free trial on all the apps and I picked Wing X once again. I thought I liked Fly Q but no......
     
  16. Pascal Forget

    Pascal Forget Pre-Flight

    Joined:
    May 24, 2016
    Messages:
    96
    Location:
    Montreal, QC
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Pascal
    I would not fly without FF at this point. Diverting to an alternate? Piece of cake.

    What's the mea along my new route? Ff calculates it on the fly.

    Always having the information up to date is priceless. And clicking in an airport rather than having to flip through reams of paper to get the approach plate is very convenient. I spend less time with my head down and more time looking outside and flying the airplane.
     
  17. Challenged

    Challenged Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,654
    Location:
    Louisiana
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Challenged
    You could get a refurb 2013 Nexus 7 for $99 and Avare for free.
     
    RyanShort1 and LoLPilot like this.
  18. BillTIZ

    BillTIZ Final Approach

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Messages:
    5,186
    Location:
    0L7, VGT
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    BTIZ
    I use the IPad Air2 w/ForeFlight, much bigger is not best in most cockpits. If I had younger eyes, the Mini 4 would be great. I would prefer if Apple would make an updated Mini and stop thinking bigger is better.
     
  19. Jim_CAK

    Jim_CAK Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2008
    Messages:
    454
    Location:
    Akron, Ohio
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Jim_CAK
    I have the same setup. I don’t want anything bigger in the cockpit either. I would like to semi-retire the Air 2 for casual browsing and buy a new unit but I don’t want a bigger iPad. If they would update the mini footprint like they have the iPhones so it is almost entirely screen with no bezel - the screen size would be almost as big as the Air 2.
     
  20. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    5,785
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74

    Dude.... do you realize that there are so many people now who have never put their hands on a paper chart? Like, never had to opening it up, rip the **** outa it trying to turn it over and then try and folding it back up all while still flying and not spilling the coffee?

    Not only that, but those same folks will never know what an ADF was or have to fly one! What has the flying world come to? Slant A? Sheesh man....... that’s like asking a kid to go a day w/o their iPhone; a sure recipe for spontaneous combustion!
     
    BillTIZ likes this.
  21. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 29, 2007
    Messages:
    8,202
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    PaulS
    I don't miss paper charts, at all.
     
    Jim_CAK likes this.
  22. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    5,785
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    I sorta do..... Same as my JepCharts. I loved luggin it all around. Tell ya what. I once lost my EFB on an Xc and had a moment of panic set it. I was seriously like, ohhh shhhoooooooot! What do I do now?

    I squawked 7700 and punched the ELT, then landed at the closest airport with an on field restaurant and cheap gas.
     
  23. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages:
    4,068
    Location:
    A Rubber Room
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Cli4ord
    Yea, but I never had my paper charts overheat, the battery go dead, or have to be repaired other than some tape.
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  24. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    5,785
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    Or figure out what the name of fix was because it had been erased over more than a few times. iPads don't make very good sunshades either.
     
  25. frfly172

    frfly172 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2008
    Messages:
    13,282
    Location:
    mass fla
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    ron keating
    I’m sticking with my I Pad ,foreflight,for IFR and approach plates. When flying up and down the coast,carting all the charts are to heavy for my little plane.
     
  26. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2015
    Messages:
    2,407
    Location:
    KLAF
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    455 Bravo Uniform
    I love laying charts out on the kitchen table and imagining flying to places. Seriously love it.
     
    LoLPilot, benyflyguy and X3 Skier like this.
  27. sarangan

    sarangan Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2008
    Messages:
    538
    Location:
    Dayton, OH
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Andrew Sarangan, CFII
    Why not get a free software like avare and check it out? Costs nothing if you already have a phone.
     
    LoLPilot likes this.
  28. Pugs

    Pugs Pre-Flight

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    68
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Pugs
    A false economy. As an IFR student myself, having the iPad mini on a yoke mount in front of me is the best money I have spent on aviation. Paper Charts and plates are fine. I flew with them in the Navy for 20 years but when it comes to having the world of information in front of you and actually seeing on the approach plate where you are I cannot underestimate the SA that it brings.

    I get the expenses of education but an iPad and FF is an investment no different than any other in your education.
     
    flyingcheesehead and CC268 like this.
  29. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2010
    Messages:
    16,637
    Location:
    Denton, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
    Pilots are funny folk.... we spend tens of thousands of dollars on an aircraft to own, thousands of dollars to keep it in good condition, tens of thousands of dollars again to upgrade it, thousands of dollars to train to fly it.... all without worry, complaints, or overthinking and complaining about others complaining

    But when it comes to a physical item and a subscription to an app that both have a high utility value, we pilots morph into some major cheep azz bastards....
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
  30. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,277
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    Cheapest thing in any airplane is the pilot/owner.
     
    CMagnus and flyingcheesehead like this.
  31. asicer

    asicer En-Route

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2015
    Messages:
    3,664
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    asicer
    2013 Nexus is a bit old. You can also get something a little more recent like a Asus ZenPad or Lenovo Tab. Or you can also hit up your friends to see if they have an old Android phone they're not using, hopefully something in a phablet size.
     
  32. benyflyguy

    benyflyguy Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2018
    Messages:
    1,641
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    benyflyguy
    I like laying them out. Highlighting the route, then getting it folded just right so I can look at most of the route of flight.
    That being said. I carry the paper and the iPad to the plane. I am relatively early in my aviation and am still finding the path. I find myself only using the iPad to look up a frequency so far or calculate ETA. I’m Not near using the capability as I have it set up with FF and stratus 3. In our club plane we have a 430w and 496 with XM weather. So the iPad is really more of a backup but nice to hand to the wife to watch progress or one of the kids. For now I’m tempting not to rely on it too heavily as some others can do.
    I use it mostly on ground, at home or work to look up weather forecasts, look at maps, make soft flight plans, look of TAFs or METARs. When a friend goes up i flight plan his destination in my plane and review how I would do it weather wise. Lol I go on probably 10 flights a week in my mind. For me on the ground it gets a lot more use
     
  33. LoLPilot

    LoLPilot Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2018
    Messages:
    435
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    LoLPilot
    That’s very true if you are trying to make flying a career. Far from it for me. It’s a hobby that o accidentally found out I love and I’d like to hold a commercial certificate and CFI one day so I can teach part time while flying for fun. My dream plane is an EAB Decathlon, if I could will something into existence, so right now it is hardly a false economy for me.

    Reading this thread I am thinking of going the Avare route during my training.
     
  34. tdturbo

    tdturbo Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2016
    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Lansing, IL
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Tim
    FF is worth every penny. Combined with a Status 2 and ipad air it does everything an IFR pilot could ask for.
     
  35. LoLPilot

    LoLPilot Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2018
    Messages:
    435
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    LoLPilot
    Y'all are jerks for talking me into this. I went and bought an iPad today because the sale ends tomorrow. I'm going to run FltPlnGo because it's free, but I decided that $20 a month for plates would pay for it in a decent amount of time...
     
    Jim_CAK likes this.