Internet over power lines?

Discussion in 'Technical Corner' started by Rushie, Dec 12, 2017.

  1. Rushie

    Rushie Cleared for Takeoff

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    Is anyone using this and if so what gadget do you have? We used it in the old house with a Trendnet thingie but now I can't find but one of them, so naturally, if I order a whole new system, the lost one will show up.

    We just need it for one room where it's problematic to run a cat 5 cable and we don't want to use WiFi.
     
  2. Salty

    Salty Cleared for Takeoff

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    Why don’t you just want to use WiFi?
     
  3. Salty

    Salty Cleared for Takeoff

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    If it’s security reasons, you’ll have the same problem with using power lines.
     
  4. Rushie

    Rushie Cleared for Takeoff

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    Good question. I'm not sure I don't. I seem to remember way back in the past trying to get this particular machine to work with a Wifi adapter and having a problem. I've got a Wifi adapter card in the closet. I'd have to install it in the case but they make USB ones now, right? Maybe I should do that instead.

    PS Edit: I remember! It wasn't that machine it was another and it was a USB doohickey (but I've no idea where it is now) it did work but it was too slow for my contract job. So I tried the power line thing for that too and it also was too slow or something, so I ended up running a dang cat 5 cable across the hall and down the staircase and over the doorframe so I could work. It was just for three months until we moved, not worth installing a jack.

    But that was a while back, maybe they've gotten better with these things.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2017
  5. Salty

    Salty Cleared for Takeoff

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    Yeah you can do WiFi over usb
     
  6. Skyrys62

    Skyrys62 Cleared for Takeoff

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  7. Rushie

    Rushie Cleared for Takeoff

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    Well dang! I had not one but TWO Belkin Dual-Band WiFi USB adapters in my closet, unused, in the box, and fairly new.

    The machine is connected up, ready to go.

    I can't believe I wasted two days looking for that other stupid Trendnet thing.
     
  8. Rushie

    Rushie Cleared for Takeoff

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  9. sferguson524

    sferguson524 Cleared for Takeoff

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    you could go moca.. if there's coax in there
     
  10. wanttaja

    wanttaja Pattern Altitude

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    I've got three "TP-Link" brand powerline adaptors. They've worked flawlessly for the ~6 months I've had them.

    There was a couple of points in the house with bad Wifi strength, and some devices that didn't seem too friendly with the wifi adaptors I was using. Bandwidth was definitely low. That all cleared up with the TP-Link adaptors. Especially noticeable when streaming a movie from a remote box.

    The models I buy (AV1200) include three Internet jacks, so they can serve multiple items without a separate router.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  11. Rushie

    Rushie Cleared for Takeoff

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    Thanks I will keep this in mind if he streams video or something and finds it too slow.
     
  12. Rushie

    Rushie Cleared for Takeoff

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    No there's nothing in there. The room is on the part of the house very difficult to access although not impossible. When our house flooded this summer and the walls were all torn out I wanted to bring a cat 5 jack back there but hubby nixed it. He didn't want to do it and the contractor might have charged a lot for what he'd have to do to get it there but IMO that's what we should have done. Oh well.
     
  13. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    I've got a couple of CISCO ethernet over power line things. They worked well enough at the time, but I just put in real cat 5 wiring and six ubiquity APs and use wifi now.
     
  14. RJM62

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    Power line Ethernet is flaky. Performance ranges from not at all to excellent depending mainly on the house wiring (and, of course, the quality of the equipment).

    I've had power line Ethernet work not at all in one outlet in a room, but splendidly in another outlet on the same circuit. Sometimes I could diagnose and correct the problem (usually reversed polarity, or a bad ground at the problem outlet with the newer devices); but other times everything checked out fine. It just didn't work.

    MoCA tends to be a bit less flaky and more reliable if there's coax available, but it doesn't get along well with satellite and some cable systems. It also gets unreliable if someone daisy-chained a bunch of splitters into the cable lines. But all in all, it's a bit less flaky than power line. If coax is available, I've found that it's usually the more reliable choice.

    Personally, I just run Ethernet if it's an option.

    Rich
     
  15. wanttaja

    wanttaja Pattern Altitude

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    One thing on the power-line Ethernet: The units cannot be plugged into power strips with surge protection, and it's harder and harder to find power strips without it.

    The units I bought include a power outlet as well as the Ethernet jacks, so you can plug them directly into the wall and then the outlet strip into them.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2017
  16. John221us

    John221us En-Route PoA Supporter

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    It won’t cross phases, so, if one side of the house is on one phase and the on another, it just won’t work.
     
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  17. FORANE

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    We have run POE power over ethernet to access points in distant locations poorly served by existing devices with good results.
     
  18. Ghery

    Ghery Final Approach

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    You are going to really annoy any short wave listeners in the area with PLT devices. They notch the ham bands, but everywhere else they scream. I ran tests on old HomePlug 1.0 devices a number of years ago with the following results:

    The HomePlug 1.0 devices use the HF spectrum from 7 MHz to 22 MHz. Ham bands in that range notched.

    I tested the signals from these devices in the EMC lab where I worked at the time. In the ham bands the signals were about CISPR 22 Class B, the same as the limits for your PC. Outside the ham bands the emissions were 25 to 30 dB over the Class B limits.

    OK, what does this mean in the real world outside the lab? I took the devices home. Hooked one up in my office/ham shack and the other somewhere else in the house. My HF station runs a random length end fed wire antenna with the feed point about 10 feet from the corner of the office/ham shack. If anyone was going to suffer interference, it would be me. In the ham bands I couldn't tell it was operating, telling me that the CISPR 22 limits were fine. Outside the ham bands there was no question it was operating. It obliterated everything. Forget listening to anything between 7 MHz and 22 MHz outside the ham bands.

    Best of luck running data over power lines. Oh, and it mattered that the two devices were on the same leg of the incoming power line. If they were on opposite legs you had no communications between them.
     
  19. EppyGA

    EppyGA Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Doubtful you have phases in your home. Two 110 legs, likely. It will indeed have trouble across legs since the signal has to go back to the transformer to do so unless you had a frequency appropriate bridge installed at the panel.
     
  20. Palmpilot

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    I thought about nitpicking that, but I eventually concluded that zero degrees and 180 degrees are phases just as much as zero, 120, and 240 degrees are.
     
  21. John221us

    John221us En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Perhaps split phase is the correct terminology. Correct, it won’t cross the transformer.
     
  22. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Eh? The powerline boxes I have (Linksys/Cisco) work just fine on surge protectors. What they won't work is plugged into UPSs.
    The statement about the two legs is true, same as for X.10.
     
  23. EppyGA

    EppyGA Touchdown! Greaser!

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    X10 sold a nice device that you could plug into a dryer outlet so the signals could easily cross legs. I don't know what frequency the powerline e-net adapters generally use but if the X10 device were just a high pass filter it might also work for the these adapters.
     
  24. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Yep, had two different ones of those.

    Anyway, anybody want the linksys POE boxes I have? I have finally gotten the CAT5 wiring cleaned up in my house and I now have six ubiquiti access points (including two outside ones) hooked up, so I'm done with those kludges. I have two different incarnations of them (they don't interoperate with each other).
     
  25. wsuffa

    wsuffa Touchdown! Greaser!

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    IME, X10 sucked even when it was on the same leg. But YMMV.
     
  26. EppyGA

    EppyGA Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Mine always worked well. It's been replaced by a Samsung Smart Hub and several Z-Wave devices.
     
  27. wsuffa

    wsuffa Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I had an X10-based pool controller in San Antonio that never worked right. And a system in a house at one point. Never worked reliably.

    Glad yours worked well.

    I worked on carrier-current systems for a while... it became obvious why X10 would be a problem...