How to get killed an emergency

DavidWhite

DavidWhite

Final Approach
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How to get killed in an emergency


So instead of looking for places to land all the time, when you lose your engine you should do a 180 and bleed off precious energy to find a spot to land. Got it.

This guy also flies a Cirrus. He seems to fit the stereotype nicely.
 
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Re: How to get killed in an emergency

There's so many things wrong with this. It scares me the FAA let's him teach people to fly.
 
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I didn't understand what he was doing looking for an airport on the GPS. It sounded like he found the nearest one on the GPS, thought it was too far, and found two just looking out the window during a turn that weren't in the database?
 
No sense in teaching folks to have a little situational awareness and know what the closest airport is at all times...it really isn't that difficult to follow the MLOD and see what's nearby.
 
Cap'n Jack said:
I didn't understand what he was doing looking for an airport on the GPS. It sounded like he found the nearest one on the GPS, thought it was too far, and found two just looking out the window during a turn that weren't in the database?
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That's the first thing I thought, too. He has all that gear, and the closest airport it shows is one he can't make, not the couple that are right underneath him, or that big honkin' airport he just flew past.

Where is his situational awareness?

--

My CFI was always asking - where would you land now? And constantly pulling the power to simulate an engine out. That made me be constantly on the lookout for landing spots. Of course, I don't fly over cities, or large bodies of water - the whole state of KS is one large landing strip, with power-lines.
 
and even though he is flying over the stinkin' desert with a million places to land, he still says he will pull the chute. I guess thats cause' Cirri dont typically catch fire after a caps landing.
 
Step 1: Screw with the panel
Step 2: Smile for the camera
Step 3: Pull the chute.
 
So wait, if he can't land on a 5000 ft, PAVED runway, he's gonna pull the chute and totally take his fate out of his own hands? screw THAT. I'm not saying the chute isn't a good option, or isn't good to have, but a country road with no powerlines is almost always a better option, as is an alfalfa field, as is an airport with a 3000 ft runway, or a 2000ft grass runway.....what a maroon....
 
I was taught to trim for best glide and put the airplane in a slow 360 since the best spot may be right behind me.

Worked perfectly on my check ride. DPE pulled power, asked me where I'm going. I trimmed it up and started my turn. I started pointing out possibilities as we were out in the country with lots of nice roads as possibilities. As I continued the turn Road Atlanta came into view and it has two nice long straight-aways so I said that was where I was going.

This guy was doing the video in a Cirrus, but consider that you need to teach as if they're in a school 172, no GPS, etc.

His GPS probably didn't show the airports behind him because he has it set not to show certain airports, private, short or non hard surface runways.
 
Hmmm. I would so like to put him in a few of my favorite emergency landing scenarios...

Ryan
 
I had to delete that asshat from my FB account. I can't freaking stand his posts. Every time I see him post in the third person I want to punch him. MossY flew a Cirrus today... Who gives a crap!
 
Re: How to get killed in an emergency

DavidWhite said:
This guy also flies a Cirrus. He seems to fit the stereotype nicely.
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I just don't understand the meanness of this comment.

So I rented a Cirrus once. Does that make me bad? Or am I better when I rent a Piper? How about the old Cessna I rent sometimes, does that make me a better person?
 
Cirrus pilots have a stereotype about them. I have friends that fly them that are incredible pilots. I have met quite a few that I wouldn't trust to hold my coffee.
 
Re: How to get killed in an emergency

NoHeat said:
I just don't understand the meanness of this comment.

So I rented a Cirrus once. Does that make me bad? Or am I better when I rent a Piper? How about the old Cessna I rent sometimes, does that make me a better person?
Click to expand...

The answer to all your questions is, YES! Well yes if you want to be a good American.

Now if you get in an RV and do an overhead break.....:mad:

This guy is clearly a commie

 
Re: How to get killed in an emergency

NoHeat said:
So I rented a Cirrus once. Does that make me bad?
Click to expand...

Not at all. I flew in a Cirrus with a family friend a couple weeks ago.

I think most folks on this board know how I feel about Cirri.
 
I dislike this guy. How did he get permission to teach?

Plane Path People? Why deviate from "Aviate Nagivate Communicate"? Thats so easy to remember....


Why is he heads down looking in the cockpit when his engine quits? I'd be looking outside for a field first I think.... but perhaps I'm used to flying too low to be concerned about 'nearest airport'...
 
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RyanShort1 said:
Hmmm. I would so like to put him in a few of my favorite emergency landing scenarios...

Ryan
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One of my favorites is to start screaming "OMG, the radio is on fire" and simulate passing out from electrical smoke fumes. I had one guy on a flight review pull out the checklist and start very slowly going through each item for an electrical fire while cruising straight and level. When I told him that my shoes melted onto my feet, he still didn't get it...
 
ajstoner21 said:
I dislike this guy. How did he get permission to teach?

Plane Path People? Why deviate from "Aviate Nagivate Communicate"? Thats so easy to remember....


Why is he heads down looking in the cockpit when his engine quits? I'd be looking outside for a field first I think.... but perhaps I'm used to flying too low to be concerned about 'nearest airport'...
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Because PFD/MFD displays are pretty.
 
gtmule said:
So wait, if he can't land on a 5000 ft, PAVED runway, he's gonna pull the chute and totally take his fate out of his own hands? screw THAT. I'm not saying the chute isn't a good option, or isn't good to have, but a country road with no powerlines is almost always a better option, as is an alfalfa field, as is an airport with a 3000 ft runway, or a 2000ft grass runway.....what a maroon....
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Never flown a Cirrus, but I once ran out of honey roasted peanuts on a long X-C in a 150. I kinda wished I had a chute....
 
Here is my Twitter stream as of a couple minutes ago.

The MossY guy pounces on any pilot who says they've passed a checkride or whatever and points them to where they can purchase his G1000 course.

So helpful.

Brad Koehn (the guy he pounced on here) is a member of the "In The Pattern" Podcast.

It'd be funny if I could get those guys to watch some of these videos and rant about them on the podcast.

Heck, maybe I now have material to get the MHF crew ranting.

Right now we can't seem to align our free time schedules to record anything. Mike and I have some time, but Zyola is doing the single-mom-going-to-college thing for her Aeronautical Engineering degree and Doug is seriously busy at work and home.

It'd be soooo much fun to put out a good round-table rant on this stuff though.

a6fa0a18-864e-23b1.jpg
 
I did not watch the video, I don't want to waste the bandwidth on a 5GBcap, however, from what's been said with regards to his situational awareness, what was inadequate for the conditions? Did he not analyze the situation and take a course of action immediately? Did he not observe the reaction, analyze the path, decide it insufficient, re aim, re analyze, decide sufficient and conclude the task?

If so I think he carried all the situational awareness that was required for the situation regardless of hardware. When you're over non threatening territory where you have multiple good choices in every direction and you've got a 7-10 minute glide, the whole 'Find a place to stick it' becomes something to do out of boredom and just sight seeing. I may easily be busy with something else though and then I won't look for a place to land until I need one. So, if I were he, since I have a G-1000/Avidyne I would first look to see what's closest on my display as I'm pitching for speed and get myself lined out for it first thing and then I focus on my TDZ in the windshield and look for vertical drift. If I'm holding a spot/spot lowering in windshield, I'm golden if I'm on or above best glide speed. If the spot starts sliding up in my window at best glide, now I know I can't make it and need to find somewhere else. Since I'm in an SR-22 with small wheels I had my declutter preferences set to only show paved runways 4500' and greater, but I don't need that for real real, it just would be nice and more likely to have service. Now I look around on the ground for a smaller runway and spot what I can find. Now I aim for my new spot and repeat analysis as above. If that was what was displayed on the video, I'm good with it as a realistic scenario based video for someone comfortable in their airplane because that is how it will be.
 
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I can't believe you guys are giving a CFI such a hard time when all he's saying to do is use all the resources at your disposal, including the stuff in the panel, crew, passengers, ATC, and even the dreaded chute. If the guy thinks he can't make a good landing without a giant strip, let him pull the chute. Better for everyone if he winds up with a busted airplane and live passengers. Believe me, his insurance company will be really happy to buy him another airplane. Makes damn good sense, actually.
 
This thread is especially funny in the light of the couple weeks worth of deaths one after another when they glided perfectly to a smash. Not one was a Cirrus, and a half would stand to use a chute instead of taking chances (half was immediate engine failure after takeoff, so not sure about altitude; also discounting a very unfortunate F8F accident).
 
ajstoner21 said:
Plane Path People? Why deviate from "Aviate Nagivate Communicate"? Thats so easy to remember...
Click to expand...

Because it's important to remember to use all of your resources, like the rest of the people on the flight deck and you cabin attendants.

I find it particularly helpful to include the cabin attendants in any emergency decisions that I have to make in my LSA.
 
ajstoner21 said:
I dislike this guy. How did he get permission to teach?

Plane Path People? Why deviate from "Aviate Nagivate Communicate"? Thats so easy to remember....

Why is he heads down looking in the cockpit when his engine quits? I'd be looking outside for a field first I think.... but perhaps I'm used to flying too low to be concerned about 'nearest airport'...
Click to expand...

It's not a deviation, it's the next step in thought to Aviate, Navigate, and Communicate. You don't stop thinking after you finish your mnemonic.
 
I don't know this guy's background, and I really don't know his audience. If he's gearing his training videos towards the pilot who will be tooling around at 2500AGL, VFR, in a 150/172, Warrior, or some other small single without GPS or MFD then he might be missing his audience. If he's teaching students who are gunning for an airline job through an academy of some sort, then that's a different story.
 
Cap'n Jack said:
I didn't understand what he was doing looking for an airport on the GPS. It sounded like he found the nearest one on the GPS, thought it was too far, and found two just looking out the window during a turn that weren't in the database?
Click to expand...

Yes, that was weird. I wanted to give him the benefit and and figure that by "look outside for an airport", he meant just find a place to put it down. Not that making that turn makes sense if the engine is still making power. Head straight for the nearest airport and don't fly over terrain you would not want to set down in would make sense to me, i.e. follow a road rather than overfly a forest.

But then later he says that if he does not have 5000' of paved runway, he is going to pull the 'chute!!1! WTF? So he would rather come crashing down on someone's house than set it down in a field or a road?

On my YT channel, you can see my 11-year-old son flying the CTLS which has a BRS. In my brief, I tell him, like I tell every passenger, "Here is how you operate the parachute. If I become incapacitated, DO NOT use it unless the airplane is out of control or you are not able to talk to someone to help you." Then I tell them how to contact someone on the radio. I also have the Checkmate card on what to do in such a case and have them look at it or at least know where it is on my kneeboard.
 
I also don't get needing 5000ft

Are we doing something wrong operating a pair of Cirus from a 3500ft strip 135?
 
ajstoner21 said:
I dislike this guy. How did he get permission to teach?

Plane Path People? Why deviate from "Aviate Nagivate Communicate"? Thats so easy to remember....


Why is he heads down looking in the cockpit when his engine quits? I'd be looking outside for a field first I think.... but perhaps I'm used to flying too low to be concerned about 'nearest airport'...
Click to expand...

Personally, I am fine with A-N-C but P-P-P is pretty much the same thing and covers the same bases. Is it change for changes sake? IDK but I don't really see any harm in it.

He set best glide then looked on the GPS for nearest. Yes, he should have already known but assuming he was napping then nothing wrong so far, IMO.
 
I guess 5k' is his minimum for gliding it in. If that's his personal minimum, then that's it. I've never flown a Cirrus - is it prone to floating more than most?

But - if he turned around, and there magically appeared a "big honkin' airport" with a 5k' paved rwy, just how does he have his GPS programmed to search when he looked for nearest and it didn't show? Should it have also been on his MFD? Sectional?

I know, this was just an exercise, so the scenario wasn't exactly perfect. Didn't he also simulate the mayday call by telling ATC he was "landing at an airport with an R on it"? I thought that was kind of funny, I think I would at least have attempted to give them the actual name.
 
steingar said:
I can't believe you guys are giving a CFI such a hard time when all he's saying to do is use all the resources at your disposal, including the stuff in the panel, crew, passengers, ATC, and even the dreaded chute. If the guy thinks he can't make a good landing without a giant strip, let him pull the chute. Better for everyone if he winds up with a busted airplane and live passengers. Believe me, his insurance company will be really happy to buy him another airplane. Makes damn good sense, actually.
Click to expand...


There are a couple problems with this scenario, foremost is that everyone in America is a millionaire or is an embarrassed millionaire who is short of money. When they see someone using equipment they cannot afford, they become defensive and block further thought and since they do not have this equipment, they rationalize all these reasons that the new expensive equipment is inferior and/or unnecessary and will destroy GA so they waste all their energy railing against improvement rather than figuring out how they to can acquire the improvement and learning how to make use of it once they manage to get it. The reason is because it's easier to hate than work harder and people are lazy. If there is no way they can possibly ever manage it makes it worse because then they have to face that they are not 'keeping up with the Joneses' and it means their track to becoming a millionaire is failing which means they think they must be a failure. Since our culture places the value of a man primarily on the number of 0s in his bank account, we have set up a culture where human nature will cause 90% of our population to feel inadequate to some degree. Since people are vain above most all else, this leads only to conflict and stagnation of the species.

The reason some people resist things like SVT and BRS is because of ego issues, not technical logic. The rest resist it because they are stupid and Darwin is just proving himself again.

My favorites are the people who wouldn't dream of flying without insurance, but wont buy any technology because they don't need it.:rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
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if the options were landing out in the desert or pulling the chute i think i'd be tempted to pull the chute. touchdown speed is high, wheels are small, airplane likes to fracture and go boom. the desert is not just a hard packed flat piece of dirt that goes for miles and miles.
 
Henning is just laughing because his engine failure checklist is
"Identify, Verify, Feather"

:rofl:
 
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