How long does a paint job last outside?

AlleyCat67

AlleyCat67

Pre-takeoff checklist
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AleyCat67
Unfortunately I have no access to a hangar, so my plane is tied down outside. The paint job wasn't beautiful when I bought the plane in 2017, and it looks significantly more oxidized now, although I keep it touched up to prevent corrosion.

Part of me says to wait to repaint until I foresee wanting to sell it, so that it sells easier. But I'd also like to have a nice shiny plane to fly myself. So my question is - if you properly polish and seal the exterior every year, how long does a paint job look new and shiny if the plane is tied down outside? If I thought the plane would maintain its finish for 5-6 years then it might be worth splurging on a new paint job.
 
A friend has his Mooney tied up outside. They just got a paint job after 20 years.
 
If properly maintained and flown regularly I would expect a quality paint job to last 10+ years. Most cars spend their life outside and still look good that long especially if cleaned and waxed. You might see some rust on screws sooner but those are easy to replace.
 
I don’t have any hard data, but I’d suspect it depends where the airplane is living. Paint in the hot desert sun naturally isn’t going to last as long as paint in the northeast will. Even so, I’d bet a fresh paint job would last at least a decade or more out in the elements in most places if it’s taken care of decently well.
 
Like everything else, it depends on what the previous paint shop used (and whether they did it properly...there are lot of 'sand and squirt' jobs out there that will look nice for 3 or 4 years).

Using the old standard Imron, you could, if you took care of the finish (regular washing and waxing, with the occasional light buff out with finishing compound, not the 'remove all vestiges of paint" compound...) expect to get 10-15 years out of the finish, all things considered (ie is the plane tied down on a coastal aerodrome or in PHX?). A strip and finish job by a competent shop is running, right now (I just checked because I do need my wings redone...and asked for a full refinish quote too...) is in the 20K range for a 172. And that is at a decent, well-regarded shop in PA, not the boutique high-end at, say, Robbinsville NJ. Yikes. You can tie down for a long time outside for that price...or, in NJ, that amount pays for a little over 3.5 years of a T hangar.

Some of the newer coatings coming out of Axalta (the former DuPont paint company) specifically for aircraft are a lot better (from all accounts..time marches on) than the 1970s urethane coatings, even with the strangulation regulations around VOCs, state 'oversight', and just the craft in general.

All in all though, there is a certain amount of pride in having a nicely presented ride on the ramp when you land somewhere.
 
All good information. It's a Grumman, so I'm mentally adding $5K on top of whatever it would cost to paint a 172, due to the bonded construction. I'm tied down in the Hudson Valley - less UV from the sun, but lots of snow/ice in the winter.
 
We repainted our Grumman in July 2019 for a little under $13,000. Ormond Beach, Florida.
 

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Picture taken last Sunday.
 
My 180 parked out in Alaska weather 24/7 for 20+ years after the last paint job. It still looks as good as new, literally. UV is the enemy and AK isn't high on the UV scale. Where you live is the key factor assuming it's a quality paint job.
 
Circle W outside of York, PA, does Grummans. They did my Sundowner, which is also bonded for a significant portion of the wing.
 
RyanB said:
Paint in the hot desert sun naturally isn’t going to last as long as paint in the northeast will.
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Is this true? I know sun and UV will bleach paint but I've always been told that the dry climates are the best for planes, hence all these graveyards are in the desert.. I would imagine daily moisture and freezing temps would do more to damage paint

I could be wrong..

Just about all of our club planes are stored outside. The ones that have attentive owners look great even with super old paint, it's amazing what an occasional wax and polish will do. Many of the waxes have polymers that help with sun UV protection. The ones that have absent owners look like the paint is 50 years old after just 5 years..
 
Tantalum said:
Is this true? I know sun and UV will bleach paint but I've always been told that the dry climates are the best for planes, hence all these graveyards are in the desert.. I would imagine daily moisture and freezing temps would do more to damage paint
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Yes. UV is the number one cause for faded paint, as it breaks it down and causes it to oxidize. The dry climates are good for reducing corrosion risk, but that’s about it.
 
Red and maroon seem to be the worst colors outside.

Red fades and maroon turns gray or brown.
 
That was true 25 years ago for sure. My old paint chalked and the red was the worst. My 21 year old Imron still looks like it did the day it was rolled out. Red is definitely more expensive. That hasn't changed.
 
Magman said:
Red and maroon seem to be the worst colors outside.

Red fades and maroon turns gray or brown.
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Red is also the most expensive as mentioned, something like $1000/gallon.

Other things that effect paint job prices:
Number of colors
Metallic vs plain
Complexity of paint scheme
Airplane models, some are more difficult (composite surfaces vs aluminum for example).
And of course the quality of the job.
 
AlleyCat67 said:
if you properly polish and seal the exterior every year, how long does a paint job look new and shiny if the plane is tied down outside?
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Too many variables to answer. But the route I always recommend is determine what type paint was applied or if unknown remove a sample panel/cowl from the aircraft and take it too a reputable auto paint store for review and recommendations. There are a number of specialty chemicals and finishers out there that will rejuvenate old paints and add to their service life. Another option that has success is to clean/wax the aircraft with AeroGloss then apply Rejex to the surface. Repeat the Rejex as needed to keep surface slick and protected.
 
You're probably not gonna get the cost of paint back when you decide to resell. Buy some covers for now and wash and buff it when that time comes
 
AlleyCat67 said:
Unfortunately I have no access to a hangar, so my plane is tied down outside. The paint job wasn't beautiful when I bought the plane in 2017, and it looks significantly more oxidized now, although I keep it touched up to prevent corrosion.

Part of me says to wait to repaint until I foresee wanting to sell it, so that it sells easier. But I'd also like to have a nice shiny plane to fly myself. So my question is - if you properly polish and seal the exterior every year, how long does a paint job look new and shiny if the plane is tied down outside? If I thought the plane would maintain its finish for 5-6 years then it might be worth splurging on a new paint job.
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I agree with what everyone has said above.

Too many variables to give a definite answer.

You should hope your plane has Imron on it.

No way I would have it painted just to sell it!

I would polish it regularly and have it professionally sealed just about every year if it sit's outside.
 
If I was on a tiedown, I wouldn’t repaint until I get a hangar and I also wanted fresh paint. When it comes time to sell, most buyers will leap for that fresh paint vs a potentially nicer aircraft. Us guys like shiny stuff. Like glitter on a stripper…or a bass boat.
 
If you repaint you would likely trim per your likes.

That may not be what potential buyers like.

Have you considered a more extensive touch-up?

On high wing aircraft the upper surface is not easily seen.

The lower surface seldom deteriorates.

Leading Edges of wings, stab, struts, cowling are what suffers the most.

It can be addressed right at your tie-down.

If you don’t like it; step back a few feet.
 
The big issue in getting a decent paint job is will they properly strip the old paint off the aircraft. If you get a cheap quote they are probably going to sand the current paint to rough it up and paint over it. Paint is heavy and a sand and spray job will look crappy fast. Pay to have the aircraft properly stripped and repainted.
 
Jeff767 said:
The big issue in getting a decent paint job is will they properly strip the old paint off the aircraft. If you get a cheap quote they are probably going to sand the current paint to rough it up and paint over it. Paint is heavy and a sand and spray job will look crappy fast. Pay to have the aircraft properly stripped and repainted.
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I agree^^^^^

FWIW a hangar neighbor wrecked his 172 hitting some trees at the beginning of the runway during engine out practice with his son. Williams repaired his wing and it came back bare fresh aluminum.

So he decided to strip the rest of the plane since it was in really bad shape. He did it in his hangar with the airport manager looking the other way. They spent many hours with a gasoline pressure washer and paint stripper.

He told me he would have it done in a week, I laughed to myself.

Him and his 2 sons worked on it for a month and it still was not done. They started flying it again with some of the paint still on it. I'd say 2 months later they finally got all the paint off and proceeded to polish the whole plane instead of paint. They have been working on polishing for over a year now. It probably would have been quicker and cheaper to paint the plane.

In other words it is a huge job to strip the paint off a 172.
 
8 years if you want it to look nice. 20 years if you don’t give a damn how it looks.
 
If you can’t access a hangar, I believe you.
Paint is the least of your worries tied down outside.
Water intrusion. Musty interior. Interior corrosion of airframe. Interior corrosion of engine. Insect nests. Bird nests.
Where do you work on your bird? Lighting, 110v for lighting, tools?
How do you preheat?
Your avionics bake in the sun, freeze in the winter, as does trim, rugs and upholstery.
I’m concerned that you may feel insulted, but it is just what I see. I was EXTREMELY LUCKY to find my situation in a 60 foot hangar with an elderly owner, heat, dehumidifiers, water. I can work in the winter in a t shirt. I bought my 65 year old Cessna in annual 5 years ago, and I feel there is NO WAY I would have been able to keep up with the work tied down outside.
Decades ago, lotsa guys owned aircraft tied down outside of course. I remember seeing the outdoor toolchest/ lockers. Nowadays, in my area, that just is not the culture anymore. The only aircraft seen tied down are transient or derelict.
Best to you and good luck with the Grumman. I suppose I would caution new owners, really think about a hangar.
 
Sondavid said:
If you can’t access a hangar, I believe you.
Paint is the least of your worries tied down outside.
Water intrusion. Musty interior. Interior corrosion of airframe. Interior corrosion of engine. Insect nests. Bird nests.
Where do you work on your bird? Lighting, 110v for lighting, tools?
How do you preheat?
Your avionics bake in the sun, freeze in the winter, as does trim, rugs and upholstery.
I’m concerned that you may feel insulted, but it is just what I see. I was EXTREMELY LUCKY to find my situation in a 60 foot hangar with an elderly owner, heat, dehumidifiers, water. I can work in the winter in a t shirt. I bought my 65 year old Cessna in annual 5 years ago, and I feel there is NO WAY I would have been able to keep up with the work tied down outside.
Decades ago, lotsa guys owned aircraft tied down outside of course. I remember seeing the outdoor toolchest/ lockers. Nowadays, in my area, that just is not the culture anymore. The only aircraft seen tied down are transient or derelict.
Best to you and good luck with the Grumman. I suppose I would caution new owners, really think about a hangar.
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I don't feel insulted, and I've certainly heard the opinion before that if you can't get a hangar, then you shouldn't own a plane. FWIW, I have the plane inspected for corrosion regularly and have never had any problems that could be attributable to water intrusion. And as you say, in the olden days most planes were tied outside. Somehow they survived without falling from the skies, so I'm happy to take my chances for now.
 
Grum.Man said:
If properly maintained and flown regularly I would expect a quality paint job to last 10+ years. Most cars spend their life outside and still look good that long especially if cleaned and waxed. You might see some rust on screws sooner but those are easy to replace.
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How exactly does flying a plane make a paint job last longer than just sitting? :confused:
 
Grum.Man said:
If properly maintained and flown regularly I would expect a quality paint job to last 10+ years. Most cars spend their life outside and still look good that long especially if cleaned and waxed. You might see some rust on screws sooner but those are easy to replace.
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Airplanes done use the base/clear coats cars do.

The paint on a car is protected by a UV and physical barrier a few hundred thou thick.

Airplanes dont have that protection. I dont know if there are any approved base/clear paint systems for AC.
 
pfarber said:
Airplanes done use the base/clear coats cars do.

The paint on a car is protected by a UV and physical barrier a few hundred thou thick.

Airplanes dont have that protection. I dont know if there are any approved base/clear paint systems for AC.
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Dad has been in the business most of his career, I can tell you that you’re totally wrong.
 
pfarber said:
Airplanes done use the base/clear coats cars do.

The paint on a car is protected by a UV and physical barrier a few hundred thou thick.

Airplanes dont have that protection. I dont know if there are any approved base/clear paint systems for AC.
Click to expand...

There must be some approved or.... I have seen some planes that have clear coat peeling off. It might not have been a real BC/CC system though. Worse than fading or oxidizing, IMO.

I would be surprised and PO'd if a paint job didn't last 8-10 years before showing any bad signs- wash and wax, even a spray wax 4-5 times a year. Lighter is better except for silver for some reason. All white with small numbers is so stark its stunning to me.
Plus paying for a paint job is like getting a free hangar for a month or so:)
 
farangutan said:
We repainted our Grumman in July 2019 for a little under $13,000. Ormond Beach, Florida.
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Was that a complete strip job with control surfaces removed?

I wouldn't be afraid of a scuff and shoot under the right circumstances. If the old paint is adhering well and its properly prepared so the new stuff sticks to it its a viable option. How much does paint weigh, ~15lbs a gallon?
 
Frankly I'm surprised nobody has brought up the whole what can an owner legally paint topic up
Sondavid said:
If you can’t access a hangar, I believe you.
Paint is the least of your worries tied down outside.
Water intrusion. Musty interior. Interior corrosion of airframe. Interior corrosion of engine. Insect nests. Bird nests.
Where do you work on your bird? Lighting, 110v for lighting, tools?
How do you preheat?
Your avionics bake in the sun, freeze in the winter, as does trim, rugs and upholstery.
I’m concerned that you may feel insulted, but it is just what I see. I was EXTREMELY LUCKY to find my situation in a 60 foot hangar with an elderly owner, heat, dehumidifiers, water. I can work in the winter in a t shirt. I bought my 65 year old Cessna in annual 5 years ago, and I feel there is NO WAY I would have been able to keep up with the work tied down outside.
Decades ago, lotsa guys owned aircraft tied down outside of course. I remember seeing the outdoor toolchest/ lockers. Nowadays, in my area, that just is not the culture anymore. The only aircraft seen tied down are transient or derelict.
Best to you and good luck with the Grumman. I suppose I would caution new owners, really think about a hangar.
Click to expand...
Most people that don't have a hangar aren't outside by choice. Some places there's years long waiting lists. So they're not supposed to fly just cuz its not inside? Invest in some covers and do more thorough pre flight and go fly
 
Magman said:
Red and maroon seem to be the worst colors outside.

Red fades and maroon turns gray or brown.
Click to expand...

No wonder my plane looks like ****.
 
Racerx said:
...... Most people that don't have a hangar aren't outside by choice. Some places there's years long waiting lists. So they're not supposed to fly just cuz its not inside? Invest in some covers and do more thorough pre flight and go fly
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+ don't buy the fabric covered Champ or whatever that you really want!

Some places, such as KSGJ the last time I checked, don't even have realistic long term outdoor tie down options available!

Flying really can be an exclusive club.
 
In my picture, avatar, is a 1978 grumman tiger with original paint. It has been hangered all its life. I'm the second owner, the paint itself is pretty good minus all the chips and scratches.
 
pfarber said:
Airplanes dont have that protection. I dont know if there are any approved base/clear paint systems for AC.
Click to expand...
Care to share your reference on aircraft “approved” paint?

And yes, aircraft paint formulas do provide that protection. Just review the PPG paint website and select whatever UV resistant or base/clear coat system you want. There’s plenty.

Maybe one day you’ll get it right.:rolleyes:
 
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