How do you determine airworthiness?

JAWS

Cleared for Takeoff
Joined
Oct 7, 2016
Messages
1,251
Display Name

Display name:
JAWS
The corrosion thread in the mx section got me to thinking.

How do you detetmine if the aircraft you are wanting to fly is airworthy? Is a rental any different from a personal aircraft? How far do you go? How far areyou supposed to go?

I am a professional maintainer and I have my own take on "technical dispatch ". I am looking to see what others do, especially the newer pilots out there.

Just wondering out loud. ☺
 
AROW ready to go.

Seriously, other than obvious stuff that gets caught in a thorough pre-flight, most things will come up on an annual, or a 100 hour if it's a rental. I presume you're asking specifically about private pilot's and GA, not commercial.
 
Is it safe to operate....and conforms to the type certificate?

If yes and yes....its airworthy.....roll on bro. :D
 
what is a "professional maintainer"?

Someone who has spent a lot of time and effort to learn how to maintain aircraft. And then does it 40+ hours per week. :)
 
Airworthiness is simply determined by the size of the oil puddle on the ground before the flight, right?
 
I preflight rentals very thourghly. If I'm going to be flying IFR I verify the IFR cert is up to date. I suppose I should do the whole ARROW thang but honestly the only time I remember doing that is for BFR's. I've never verified the Annual/100hr's. disclaimer: this is all a lie if anyone from FSDO is cruisin POA lookin for some action.
 
With helicopters, we say "If it will hover it will fly." ;)
 
AS a part 91 pilot of an aircraft you are not required to determine airworthiness.

91.7 Civil aircraft airworthiness.
(a) No person may operate a civil aircraft unless it is in an airworthy condition.

(b) The pilot in command of a civil aircraft is responsible for determining whether that aircraft is in condition for safe flight. The pilot in command shall discontinue the flight when unairworthy mechanical, electrical, or structural conditions occur.

When you must determine airworthiness you simply comply with 91.400 and FAR 43 and 39
 
Bottom line, a gut check - do I find any reason to believe the airplane will not accomplish the flight and get me back home again? If I find none then I make an assumption that it is airworthy. There are a lot of thing that feed into that - my history with the airplane, other pilots that fly it, squawks, recent maintenance records if I know them, pre flight inspection and pre-takeoff procedures.

I would say the biggest are the preflight inspection, pre-takeoff procedures and squawks, in that order.
 
AS a part 91 pilot of an aircraft you are not required to determine airworthiness.

91.7 Civil aircraft airworthiness.
(a) No person may operate a civil aircraft unless it is in an airworthy condition.

(b) The pilot in command of a civil aircraft is responsible for determining whether that aircraft is in condition for safe flight. The pilot in command shall discontinue the flight when unairworthy mechanical, electrical, or structural conditions occur.

When you must determine airworthiness you simply comply with 91.400 and FAR 43 and 39

OK. By the letter of the law, I can't go anywhere unless the plane is in an airworthy condition - paragraph a above. As a pilot, how do I know that it is?

The condition of the plane for safe flight is pretty straight forward (half of the definition of airworthy).

And then, what would constitute an "unairworthy mechanical, electrical or structural condition"?

http://www.faa-aircraft-certification.com/definition-of-airworthy.html
 
Dude, just pre-flight it. . .if you miss the tanks being empty, or all the fasteners being open on the cowl, or a control lock still installed, you'll probably have to answer to the FAA (if you survive) - if you miss a crack in the crank, or spar corrosion, they'll probably give you a pass.

Pre-flight and run-up should reveal the things you have access to - other than that, it's in the hands of a supernatural power. . .
 
JAWS said:
How do you detetmine if the aircraft you are wanting to fly is airworthy? Is a rental any different from a personal aircraft? How far do you go? How far are you supposed to go?
This is a GREAT question. At first glance, it appears to be amenable to a very simple ‘technical’ answer – 1. The aircraft must conform to its type design (TC); 2. The aircraft must be in a condition for safe operation.

Yet, at the same time it incredibly challenging to answer, at least for me. In fact, some of the responses posted thus far may appear to be a bit flippant, but I suspect that reflects the perceived difficulty in providing a satisfying and objective answer.

I fly with a 375 member Club that maintains 13 airplanes in its fleet. I began my original training with the Club, starting 22 years ago, and have continued to train and fly with the organization, so I do have history. The planes are all owned by the Club, or by individual / groups of Club members who lease them to the Club. But, they are all maintained by the Club’s A&I. I regularly fly multiple Club aircraft, and honestly, I haven’t looked at aircraft logs in years to verify that inspections have been done, that routine maintenance has been properly performed, and in a timely manner, etc.. I do check documents as part of the pre-flight; and we maintain a squawk book which I (as do all Club pilots) check before every flight. But, essentially, I TRUST our A&I, I TRUST our maintenance program. Maybe I should be more cautious. But, for me airworthiness is a combination of a) whether the Club aircraft is on the schedule – i.e. the A&I has signed off that it is available for scheduling, in which case I will consider it airworthy - AND b) the results of my pre-flight inspection and my Before Take-off checklist assessment (flight controls, instrument check, run-up results, etc.).

So, in thinking about the question, I realize that my assessment of airworthiness reflects a combination of subjective and objective data. To quote another poster:
bflynn said:
Bottom line, a gut check - do I find any reason to believe the airplane will not accomplish the flight and get me back home again? If I find none then I make an assumption that it is airworthy. There are a lot of thing that feed into that - my history with the airplane, other pilots that fly it, squawks, recent maintenance records if I know them, pre flight inspection and pre-takeoff procedures.
Well said! I agree.
 
In fact, some of the responses posted thus far may appear to be a bit flippant, but I suspect that reflects the perceived difficulty in providing a satisfying and objective answer.
The simple fact is that it doesn't really matter. That may sound flippant, but it's a fact. If your AI is happy, there isn't any other person in the whole world who will ever care enough to check to see that you have the right part number stamped into the battery box, or that the light bulb was properly sourced. And, in many cases, even the "experts" don't seem to agree. Why waste time and energy over how many angels can or can not dance on the head of a pin?

If stuff ain't broke or wore out, then I'm going for a ride.
 
OK. By the letter of the law, I can't go anywhere unless the plane is in an airworthy condition - paragraph a above. As a pilot, how do I know that it is?

The condition of the plane for safe flight is pretty straight forward (half of the definition of airworthy).

And then, what would constitute an "unairworthy mechanical, electrical or structural condition"?

http://www.faa-aircraft-certification.com/definition-of-airworthy.html
A legitimate question that worries many pilots. To make it simple, if it has had an annual, and its ADs complied with, And you as the pilot can find nothing wrong (discrepancies) It will be in an airworthy condition. Based upon the FAR that tells us the owner must repair discrepancies between annual.

You as the pilot should have access to the maintenance records showing the annual/100 hour times and repairs made and recorded as required by FAR 43.
 
"Wasn't like that when I took off" ;)
 
Back
Top