Help: I fear I have beome a "with you" snob

I

Immelman

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Immelman
Yesterday I did a couple of short flights (not work, where we typically climb up to a higher altitude controller quickly, but in my own plane) across California and back. There was a good amount of GA traffic transiting the San Joaquin valley.

Now, I have never been one to really care about non-standard phraseology to the point of getting annoyed... but for some reason the whole "with you" thing just hit me like a ton of bricks for the first time in 15+ years of flying. Cessna's were saying it. Thick-sounding-Asian accents training near Castle were saying it. Experimentals, Mooneys, and other types were saying it. Saying what? Saying this: "Norcal approach, Cessna 12345... WITH YOU at 4 point 5.."

It was one of those looking-glass moments when I suddenly started paying attention to checkins and realized that every GA pilot in that space and time said it.

Now, I did not start a thread to complain about 'with you'. I apologize if it seems that way I'll bet that that topic has been discussed here before. The thing is, I need help. It started to drive me nuts. I'll admit it, I have a problem: It made me a "with you" snob. How do I go back to my free and easy ways of just not giving a rat's a$$ what people say? :D
 
Would you provide the correct phraseology please?
 
My calls are "NorCal approach, Skylane 123AB, 12 miles south, landing Reno with Hotel"
 
Perhaps if you got onto a ctaf and asked for any traffic in the area please advise it would make you feel better about it :)
 
I was taught to only use "with you" if they were expecting you. Like a flight following frequency change.
 
Immelman said:
Yesterday I did a couple of short flights (not work, where we typically climb up to a higher altitude controller quickly, but in my own plane) across California and back. There was a good amount of GA traffic transiting the San Joaquin valley.

Now, I have never been one to really care about non-standard phraseology to the point of getting annoyed... but for some reason the whole "with you" thing just hit me like a ton of bricks for the first time in 15+ years of flying. Cessna's were saying it. Thick-sounding-Asian accents training near Castle were saying it. Experimentals, Mooneys, and other types were saying it. Saying what? Saying this: "Norcal approach, Cessna 12345... WITH YOU at 4 point 5.."

It was one of those looking-glass moments when I suddenly started paying attention to checkins and realized that every GA pilot in that space and time said it.

Now, I did not start a thread to complain about 'with you'. I apologize if it seems that way I'll bet that that topic has been discussed here before. The thing is, I need help. It started to drive me nuts. I'll admit it, I have a problem: It made me a "with you" snob. How do I go back to my free and easy ways of just not giving a rat's a$$ what people say? :D
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Get off the Internet, it's the only place people give a rat's ass.
 
If I am doing a frequency change (IFR or VFR) I just say "Approach 22128 4,500" or similar.
 
Henning said:
Get off the Internet, it's the only place people give a rat's ass.
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So true. I've never heard a controller have a come apart over this. Nor have I ever heard some fat ass in the FBO office have a hissy fit over ATITPPA.

:)
 
I don't think any controller currently working the scopes cares.

I know I don't care. Give your call sign, altitude information, and any other info you deem important (I.e. On a vector, deviations, or requests).

Now, if you say "Go Pack" or "go Redwings" on a Chicago frequency, you may get a tour. :-)
 
Immelman said:
Yesterday I did a couple of short flights (not work, where we typically climb up to a higher altitude controller quickly, but in my own plane) across California and back. There was a good amount of GA traffic transiting the San Joaquin valley.

Now, I have never been one to really care about non-standard phraseology to the point of getting annoyed... but for some reason the whole "with you" thing just hit me like a ton of bricks for the first time in 15+ years of flying. Cessna's were saying it. Thick-sounding-Asian accents training near Castle were saying it. Experimentals, Mooneys, and other types were saying it. Saying what? Saying this: "Norcal approach, Cessna 12345... WITH YOU at 4 point 5.."

It was one of those looking-glass moments when I suddenly started paying attention to checkins and realized that every GA pilot in that space and time said it.

Now, I did not start a thread to complain about 'with you'. I apologize if it seems that way I'll bet that that topic has been discussed here before. The thing is, I need help. It started to drive me nuts. I'll admit it, I have a problem: It made me a "with you" snob. How do I go back to my free and easy ways of just not giving a rat's a$$ what people say? :D
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I'm totally 'with you'.
 
Immelman said:
Simple, just omit "with you" all together. The first two things in a transmission (who you're talking to, who you are) cover that.
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How do you feel about "Good day xxxx approach, 9SA with you descending out of 7 thousand two for three five." Would that cause you an aneurism? Because that's what I say (unless the freq is busy, then I minimize everything), and I say it faster than the typical "aahhhhh,xxxx approach ahhhhhh, 5NN ahhhhh five point two ahhhhhhhh for three point five ahhhhh"
 
Old Geek said:
I was taught to only use "with you" if they were expecting you. Like a flight following frequency change.
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+1....

"with you" is quick and easy and doesn't tie up the freq...:yes:

And....... I am too old to change...;)
 
Old Geek said:
I was taught to only use "with you" if they were expecting you. Like a flight following frequency change.
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You were taught wrong. It never adds anything to the exchange and it's not listed in any official publication.

Your N number and the altitude is all you need.

Still it's one of those things that it's not worth getting real worked up about. It's nowhere near as obnoxious as ATITPPA or the thing that has popped up of late around here is pilots making "CULPEPER TRAFFIC CESSNA 4YF LAST CALL."
I'm always torn between saying "You promise?" or ordering a drink.
 
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N801BH said:
+1....

"with you" is quick and easy and doesn't tie up the freq...:yes:

And....... I am too old to change...;)
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It's completely inconsequential as far as 'tying up the frequency' goes. The only time I dispense with pleasantries is when I'm breaking in on a frequency where the controller has been consistently machine gunning instructions and clearance amendments, and even then I say 'thanks' when they hand me off. I never get attitude from controllers and typically with a few syllables of pleasantry I get a cheerful response and excellent service. These are humans and every human likes to feel appreciated.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
No kidding. Anyone who has an issue with this really needs to get a life.
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Well help me get a life then!

ChitDisturber said:
BA ha ha ha

You're talking about the "Eista" Asians!

http://www.ifta.aero/training.html
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I think there are two of those places.. IFA in BFL and then Sierra out of Castle. I guess part of me gets a kick out of the guys who can barely speak enough English to do radio work to pick up on useless slang. Think they'll import "with you" to Asia?

Henning said:
I never get attitude from controllers and typically with a few syllables of pleasantry I get a cheerful response and excellent service. These are humans and every human likes to feel appreciated.
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See, I say the pleasantries when I sign off. I used to work for a certain operator with a distinctive sign off that you'd always TRY to get the controllers to say back. Admittedly it was just as useless as saying 'with you' on the call up.
 
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Immelman said:
Well help me get a life then!
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Just don't read people's rants about radio technique. The internet can be valuable for some things but I think it gives people a skewed perception of real life, and not just on the subject of aviation.
 
Immelman said:
See, I say the pleasantries when I sign off. I used to work for a certain operator with a distinctive sign off that you'd always TRY to get the controllers to say back. Admittedly it was just as useless as saying 'with you' on the call up.
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How will a pleasantry at sign off help with the controller's handling of you?:dunno: I open with some cheer, I also get VFR transitions through O'Hare...coincidence?:dunno:
 
Henning said:
How will a pleasantry at sign off help with the controller's handling of you?:dunno: I open with some cheer, I also get VFR transitions through O'Hare...coincidence?:dunno:
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See I doubt I would have the same reaction to some cheery greeting. I get a kick out of SWA pilots, they are often good examples of spreading some good cheer on the call up... The sign-off thing was just a silly tradition, but made work more fun. Besides the words I think I think that intonation and expression can carry cheer in themselves and that is just as important. I have never really had any problems getting what I want out of ATC either. They are really very accommodating the vast majority of the time.
 
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Then why worry about 'with you' when everyone, including airline pilots, say it? As I said, this is an Internet forum only issue.
 
"with you" does sound a lil, well, "white". Imma start to mix it up and say:
"Cherokee 12345, is IN DA HOUSE at 4,500"
or maybe
"Cherokee 12345, represent'n at 4,500"
 
eman1200 said:
"with you" does sound a lil, well, "white". Imma start to mix it up and say:
"Cherokee 12345, is IN DA HOUSE at 4,500"
or maybe
"Cherokee 12345, represent'n at 4,500"
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Ebonics has NO place in aviation lingo..:no::nonod::(
 
eman1200 said:
"with you" does sound a lil, well, "white". Imma start to mix it up and say:
"Cherokee 12345, is IN DA HOUSE at 4,500"
or maybe
"Cherokee 12345, represent'n at 4,500"
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"Cherokee 12345, you leaving my crib, report to the MAN at 125.25"
 
Sac Arrow said:
(actually, that's how I address Oakland Center...)
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story time: A few years ago I went on a tour of NorCal Tracon, which is near Sacramento. I got to plug in and listen to the guy working my 'home' sector who I had talked to for many years. This guy always had great intonation, and professional demeanor. He was a white guy but was dressed a bit like a dude who liked to hang out and play basketball in 'da hood. The controller next to him was African American. They were having a heated argument about lunch or something using a lot of slang and some "brotha-ish" language, but when it came time to key the mic they'd instantly go ultra professional. The moment the finger came off the transmit button it was back to the argument. The multitasking ability really impressed me.
 
I broke myself of the with you habit by saving something else . . .

"G'Morning SoCal, Comanche 9490P level 6000" or "With Zulu" or some such relevant fact to satsify that part of the brain which just can't check in with call sign - wanting to be 'nicer/
 
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