Finding a hangar

kujo806

Pre-takeoff checklist
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kujo806
I am curious...

I am considering buying my first plane. The airport I would want to hangar at is full and has a waiting list. I was thinking if I find a plane and jump on it, what do I do with it until a hangar becomes available? I guess the options are:
  • get a hangar at a more expensive airport (double the price and 12 month lease)
  • Find an airport further away with availability and deal with the commute for a while
  • Tie it down and hope something opens up quickly
Curious what others have done in this situation. I previously lived in Iowa and the airport also had a waiting list, so I think this situation is not uncommon.
 
Pilots are sometimes goofy about the whole cart before horse thing. If it is a foregone conclusion that you are going to buy a plane, get on the waiting list now at the airport you want to be at. If you get a hangar, sublet month to month until you get a plane. If the plane thing falls through after you get a DUI and lose your medical (just kidding), bail on the hangar.
 
Demand usually exceeds supply, so having a waiting list is pretty common.

I’d go with
  • Find an airport further away with availability and deal with the commute for a while
  • Tie it down and hope something opens up quickly

Neither of which are that bad either...
 
I put my name on a waiting list for a hangar at the airports near me. It took almost 2 years to get a hangar at the airport I'm at now (preferred), and I've still not heard back from KSNA on available hangars almost 4 years later. (Honestly, I think they forgot about me, but that's OK as I prefer the quieter airport a little farther away.)

Best to put you name on the list now. You can always decline if you don't have a plane yet and it'll go to the next in line.
 
I am curious...

I am considering buying my first plane. The airport I would want to hangar at is full and has a waiting list. I was thinking if I find a plane and jump on it, what do I do with it until a hangar becomes available? I guess the options are:
  • get a hangar at a more expensive airport (double the price and 12 month lease)
  • Find an airport further away with availability and deal with the commute for a while
  • Tie it down and hope something opens up quickly
Curious what others have done in this situation. I previously lived in Iowa and the airport also had a waiting list, so I think this situation is not uncommon.
I'm guessing you're trying to get into DKB or ARR? Used to be easy to get in there until DPA jacked up their rates and everyone scattered and left a bunch of empty hangars.

At my current location, the closest airport (30 min away) had a long waiting list so I got a hangar about an hour away. Few years later, I got the call that I was at the top of the list. Went and looked at the hangar and decided to stay where I was. Larger hangar, no TSA to deal with and less than half the price. Fortunately, it's now only 45 minutes away. So a longer drive isn't a deal breaker for me. But I do miss a long runway and IAP's.

The answer is in the details. Can you afford the higher rent? Is the commute to the other field so much that you would fly less? I had my 182RG on a tie-down at DPA for a while. It wasn't too bad but I hated calling for pre-heats. And the maintenance you can do will be impacted (you do NOT want to do an oil change at a tie-down in Feb!).
 
Look for a good deal on a plane that needs a paint job and tie it down. It wont' take long for the money you saved on the purchase and the hangar to pay for a paint job (once you get a hangar). But get a good "Bruces" cover, or similar) in the meantime. You will still use it, as I do, when you take overnight cross country trips.
 
I am curious...

I am considering buying my first plane. The airport I would want to hangar at is full and has a waiting list. I was thinking if I find a plane and jump on it, what do I do with it until a hangar becomes available? I guess the options are:
  • get a hangar at a more expensive airport (double the price and 12 month lease)
  • Find an airport further away with availability and deal with the commute for a while
  • Tie it down and hope something opens up quickly
Curious what others have done in this situation. I previously lived in Iowa and the airport also had a waiting list, so I think this situation is not uncommon.
Are there airplanes tied down outside at you local airports? Talk to some of those guys about it. I parked outdoors in Alaska for 25 years. If not for falling into a hangar home deal I'd still be doing it.
 
Knowing what TYPE of aircraft you're buying and where would be an important factor. I was tied down for a number of years, but it was an all metal airframe in an area not usually prone to violent storms or hail. A light, fabric, plane (piper cub), I'd think twice about putting in the sun. Midwest where hail is a weekly occurrence, I'd think twice.

Most airplanes are just fine being tied down. Most C172s NEVER see the inside of a hangar unless they're in maintenance. The whole "Always Hanagared" thing when selling is just a way to garner attention. You don't hangar the plane when you travel, do you? Same concerns there.
 
Knowing what TYPE of aircraft you're buying and where would be an important factor. I was tied down for a number of years, but it was an all metal airframe in an area not usually prone to violent storms or hail. A light, fabric, plane (piper cub), I'd think twice about putting in the sun. Midwest where hail is a weekly occurrence, I'd think twice.

Most airplanes are just fine being tied down. Most C172s NEVER see the inside of a hangar unless they're in maintenance. The whole "Always Hanagared" thing when selling is just a way to garner attention. You don't hangar the plane when you travel, do you? Same concerns there.
My plane has always been hangared and it shows. The mediocre paint job from 25 years ago still looks as mediocre as it did 25 years ago, which means it looks better than your average 25 year old paint job. Not a spot of corrosion anywhere.

And yes, whenever available, I hangar my plane when I travel. I'd say it's under cover 80% of the time I'm away from home.
 
I lucked up and killed two birds with one stone a while back, I bought a plane from someone and was able to just take over the hangar he had it in; I'm still in the same one 8 years later. I'm not sure if that's normal in the world of hangar waiting lists though.
 
Somewhere in this picture of the no longer in operation Big Beaver Airport (Troy, MI) from 1973 should be the old man's Cessna 120.
BigBeaver_MI_73.jpg

Everything there, including the fabric covered flight school Champs, lived outside on a tiedown. That's just the way it was done.

As far as the risk of hail is concerned, I would rather face it with fabric (which is a normal wear item) than aluminum which will suffer permanent damage.
 
Somewhere in this picture of the no longer in operation Big Beaver Airport (Troy, MI) from 1973 should be the old man's Cessna 120.
BigBeaver_MI_73.jpg

Everything there, including the fabric covered flight school Champs, lived outside on a tiedown. That's just the way it was done.

As far as the risk of hail is concerned, I would rather face it with fabric (which is a normal wear item) than aluminum which will suffer permanent damage.
I hear ya, but back then a new plane didn't cost 1/2 million dollars, and they were still making 120's if you wanted to replace or repair it.
 
As far as the risk of hail is concerned, I would rather face it with fabric (which is a normal wear item) than aluminum which will suffer permanent damage.

Agreed. My comment was more to the point that an aluminum airplane is more susceptible to damage from hail, but a fabric airplane is more susceptible to damage from sunlight.
 
I was in a similar situation-I put my name on several waiting lists via email and online forms and heard nothing. I started cold-calling the management and/or hangar owners, and had one within a week. Being on a phone with the owner and able to commit right here, right now (as opposed to being someone on a list that he/she has to RE-contact and go through the process of “still interested? No? Ok, thanks”) seemed to pay dividends.

ironically, not one of the others even contacted me, and we are going on 6 years later...
 
they were still making 120's
Ummm. No. That airplane was even older than I was at the time. In fact, it still is!!!!
(The 120/140s went out of production in 1951, so ALL of them are older than me, but not by much)

Agreed. My comment was more to the point that an aluminum airplane is more susceptible to damage from hail, but a fabric airplane is more susceptible to damage from sunlight.

Just a data point... Some years ago I was talking to a guy restoring a glider that had been stored under a lean to in Texas for a long time - he gave me a couple swatches of fabric, cotton from the tail, dacron from somewhere else. The cotton would just break apart if you bent it, the dacron still seemed solid even though the paint had pretty much been burned off by the sun over the years.
 
Ummm. No. That airplane was even older than I was at the time. In fact, it still is!!!!
(The 120/140s went out of production in 1951, so ALL of them are older than me, but not by much)



Just a data point... Some years ago I was talking to a guy restoring a glider that had been stored under a lean to in Texas for a long time - he gave me a couple swatches of fabric, cotton from the tail, dacron from somewhere else. The cotton would just break apart if you bent it, the dacron still seemed solid even though the paint had pretty much been burned off by the sun over the years.
I didn't notice your date of 1973. We'd had color film for a long time by then. ;)
 
Its kind of a chicken and egg scenario, which we see play out quite a bit here. We are far enough north that winter weather makes tie downs extremely undesirable. Our airport has a little leniency and allows a reasonable amount of time to find an airplane once you lease the hangar.
 
There's no more harm in putting a fabric airplane in the sun that a metal one. UV index is a factor in the outdoor decision. We don't have a high UV index in Alaska but we have other things to make up for it. I watched my Cessna ride out 117kt sustained winds quartering from the tail. Now THAT's where I don't want a fabric plane!
 
Pilots are sometimes goofy about the whole cart before horse thing. If it is a foregone conclusion that you are going to buy a plane, get on the waiting list now at the airport you want to be at. If you get a hangar, sublet month to month until you get a plane. If the plane thing falls through after you get a DUI and lose your medical (just kidding), bail on the hangar.


Many airports don't do month to month. You sign a contract and pay for a year. Up front.
 
Thank you for some really good inputs. It is true that I was targeting KDKB. I live pretty equidistant between KDKB and KDPA. KDPA hangars are double KDKB, but there is availability. There are also several planes tied down there. I think I have narrowed the list of planes down to turnkey 182s, 33 Bonanazas, and 114 Commanders. I would be concerned about hail and wind on tie downs. There is a flying club that lost two planes some years back that were tied down but one blew on top of the other.

It sounds like calling around and getting on a few lists sooner rather than later makes sense. If I had to hangar at DPA, it wouldn't be the end of the world. It would just be another $3K a year compared to DKB. I'd rather spend that on the plane, but it probably isn't a deal breaker.
 
I was in a similar situation-I put my name on several waiting lists via email and online forms and heard nothing. I started cold-calling the management and/or hangar owners, and had one within a week. Being on a phone with the owner and able to commit right here, right now (as opposed to being someone on a list that he/she has to RE-contact and go through the process of “still interested? No? Ok, thanks”) seemed to pay dividends.

ironically, not one of the others even contacted me, and we are going on 6 years later...

in my time of ownership and moving residences, I’ve found this also to be true.
I think, in many cases, “waiting lists” are nebulous entities. Have been told more than once that the “wait” would be 2yrs (a conveniently random time IMHO) only to get a hangar within a couple of months.
 
Having just went through this 1.5 months ago-

ARR has one hangar for rent at skyhaven. Its a great gated little community with a nice pilots lounge. No space at community hangars. The guy renting wanted 525 a month plus you pay heat.
DPA is a huge airport and there is no community feeling. Unheated hangar with 2 receptacles for electric is 453 a month and they are going fast supposedly. They do month to month leases, just need 30 day notice to leave.
Dekalb- I couldnt get an answer back from them to get on a list. They are cheaper but I have no idea how long the wait is. No space at community hangars or supposedly at any private hangar.
Clow- zero availability, No space at community hangars

I didnt check Schaumburg or any other places as they are too long of a commute to make it worth while.
 
I waited 15 years for a hangar, and only got one because they built some new ones. Was told I was at the top of the "still walking" list. I have the feeling I know what that means, but really didn't feel like asking.
 
@kujo806 - if the plane you are buying is at an airport "nearby" you can ask the seller to rent from them. Some rentals get squirrelly about the plane in the unit having the same registration name as the hangar renter. But they'll look around it for 6 months or so in many cases. I've noticed this is the number 1 way people get around the lists. We waited it out like most do but if you're buying locally it might get you some time.
 
Another option is going to the EAA meetings and putting out the word you'd like to rent and if they know any private hangar owners that you could talk to as well.
 
I lucked up and killed two birds with one stone a while back, I bought a plane from someone and was able to just take over the hangar he had it in; I'm still in the same one 8 years later. I'm not sure if that's normal in the world of hangar waiting lists though.
Very common.
 
Having just went through this 1.5 months ago-

ARR has one hangar for rent at skyhaven. Its a great gated little community with a nice pilots lounge. No space at community hangars. The guy renting wanted 525 a month plus you pay heat.
DPA is a huge airport and there is no community feeling. Unheated hangar with 2 receptacles for electric is 453 a month and they are going fast supposedly. They do month to month leases, just need 30 day notice to leave.
Dekalb- I couldnt get an answer back from them to get on a list. They are cheaper but I have no idea how long the wait is. No space at community hangars or supposedly at any private hangar.
Clow- zero availability, No space at community hangars

I didnt check Schaumburg or any other places as they are too long of a commute to make it worth while.

So what did you end up doing? Did you find something at ARR for rent when you searched? You are not instilling confidence for me :(.
 
I got lucky , there was a "T" hangar on the local field with the CFI . Rented it the day my Airplane was delivered. $40 a month , one month free if paid by year . Includes electricity . :)
But then it's 40 miles away in the county seat and the only public airport in the county .
 
I got lucky , there was a "T" hangar on the local field with the CFI . Rented it the day my Airplane was delivered. $40 a month , one month free if paid by year . Includes electricity . :)
But then it's 40 miles away in the county seat and the only public airport in the county .
$40/month?? With electricity?? Plus a prepay discount?? My T hanger is 30 miles away and $500/month - and I feel very lucky to have gotten it.

Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk
 
I hear Schaumburg has a long waiting list but prices are better than KDPA. KDPA also has a few aircraft mgmt companies on the field that might be a stop gap option while waiting on the hangar.

I am myself starting the own vs partnership vs club debate. Very useful advice here I haven’t considered.
 
I am at DPA for now. Frustration got to me and I hate moving, so I am gonna stay there over the winter and see how bad an unheated hangar really is. I am the end hangar so one side isnt insulated with other hangars. This way I can see how cold it really does get.
 
I got lucky , there was a "T" hangar on the local field with the CFI . Rented it the day my Airplane was delivered. $40 a month , one month free if paid by year . Includes electricity . :)
But then it's 40 miles away in the county seat and the only public airport in the county .
Heck, I'd prepay 20 years at that price.
 
Ugh. What a topic. This should be as easy as putting your name on a hangar list and wait till one becomes open..and when one does, provide your NNumber and insurance and call it a day.

I’ve lived in Southern California , NorCal, chicago, Boston...etc.

I’ve had hangars at places like Camarillo and Oxnard. Camarillo is “great enough” - Santa Paula like - they promote general aviation, refuse to allow commercial subleasing, they listen to the pilot community...there are always issues, but...places like that are minimal by comparison.

Then cities or counties get lazy or someone’s palm gets greased, and now you have an FBO or business with a long term lease “managing” tie downs and hangars. The truth is that there is no reduction in staffing from before to after as a general rule. I’ve read way too many proposals from “management companies” touting a reduction in liability, headcount, promotion of the airport/marketing, and improving rents. End result? Car washing and detailing businesses move in, things that have nothing to do with aviation, furniture building, wealthy classic car resellers that don’t own airplanes, every imaginable non aviation person looking for a commercial, non flying business moves in, cost for pilots goes up, availability goes down. Look at El Monte or other similar things in Los Angeles County. American Airports employees certainly and frequently complain they don’t get a state pension, and Joe Pilot gets substandard services at a higher cost while the “management company” effectively privatizes a public asset.

“Airport management firms” should be fought or boycotted at all costs in my opinion. They only benefit the company and not the county or city pilots/residents.

This becomes infinitely more egregious at dilapidated communities like Hawthorne. The retired seniors went door to door to keep the airport open; our group did, but through some manipulations by a couple of individuals, one who got his wife working at the city, and long term leases and fuel concessions become exclusive, before the ENTIRE airport closest to downtown LA is rented for a paltry $475k a year. The gentlemen that kept it open? Evicted from their hangars, forced to pay triple rent, and the AOPA community rep is financially in on the action, and several shell companies control the airline at the airport, tiedowns and hangars, the charter business, pretty much all. Prices have skyrocketed, and where once there was a community of 40-50 avid GA fliers have now made way for three hangars: Harrison Ford, Elon Musk, and a helicopter startup. Was there a single headcount saved at Hawthorne? No, not on your life. Levi, Pat Kerry, Chris at Security all benefit at great expense to the local airport community, touting their “investment” in the airport or showcasing how rents are appropriate for the area. Hogwash. Their investment is necessary for them to simply attract greater sums of money from fewer people while screwing GA as a whole.

Santa Monica’s demise was public but not really. Snapchat thought it would be *awesome* to get some really cool aviation office space, so they invested in quite a bit of lobbying to get the airport shirt down...all those “fuel particles” and all. We all know what happened. What few know is the end result was long term leases for Snapchat at the airport pushing out aviation businesses effectively resulting in the eventual closing of the airport. Worse, they had a downturn and couldn’t honor their lease obligations. Disgusting.

Airports should thrive as a community. Hangar construction, noise abatement, pilot services, community outreach should all be part of a healthy aviation community. John Wayne and many other places where the City or County gets lazy and outsources “management” of the airport always results in slower hangar construction, far higher costs, and often “airport managers” who create far more nuisance for the pilot and renter /owner than anything else.

I guess I have some passionate feelings about this. Ok
 
I rented the hangar first. It’s an insulated T-hangar with electric for $300 per month. Ended up buying the plane a year later. Even though I paid for the year with no plane, I was still able to use it to store some things.
 
I found a hangar before I bought my first plane. I personally would never buy a nice plane and tie it down outside. If you have so many ants in your pants that you MUST buy a plane before finding a hangar, buy a plane without fresh paint, interior and panel to rot outside. There are many here that insist that it hurts nothing to keep an airplane outside. IMHO they are fooling themselves.
 
The first and possibly most important thing to know about finding a hangar is that waiting lists are lists of people who would like to have a hangar. The manager of the hangars has no obligation to select from the top of the list and rarely does. They select based on a recommendation of another tenant they trust (or to whom they owe a favor) and the objective to have zero hassles with the tenant. In others words, its who you are and who you know, not how long you wait.

One way to get a hangar and the required recommendation is to buy a plane that already has a hangar, motivating the owner to put in a good word for you. It generally works. Then once you have the hangar never give it up unless there is a very good reason to do so.
 
I am curious...

I am considering buying my first plane. The airport I would want to hangar at is full and has a waiting list. I was thinking if I find a plane and jump on it, what do I do with it until a hangar becomes available? I guess the options are:
  • get a hangar at a more expensive airport (double the price and 12 month lease)
  • Find an airport further away with availability and deal with the commute for a while
  • Tie it down and hope something opens up quickly
Curious what others have done in this situation. I previously lived in Iowa and the airport also had a waiting list, so I think this situation is not uncommon.

Introduce yourself to local area pilot groups. Start networking and ask around, you might find out that there are hangars available for sublet, or private hangar owners, who don't advertise and don't want the hassle of maintaining a list, who just happen to have a hangar to rent, or a large hangar who'd like to rent space to someone.

In your area, I'd look for an EAA chapter, and introduce yourself on the FATMCS (flights above the mid-central states) facebook page.
 
The first and possibly most important thing to know about finding a hangar is that waiting lists are lists of people who would like to have a hangar. The manager of the hangars has no obligation to select from the top of the list and rarely does. They select based on a recommendation of another tenant they trust (or to whom they owe a favor) and the objective to have zero hassles with the tenant. In others words, its who you are and who you know, not how long you wait.

One way to get a hangar and the required recommendation is to buy a plane that already has a hangar, motivating the owner to put in a good word for you. It generally works. Then once you have the hangar never give it up unless there is a very good reason to do so.

The manager has no legal obligation, but it is a matter of ethics and honor to issue hangars first come first serve. The problem in today’s world is that there are too many people who fall short of being ethical and honorable.
 
People who control hangars don’t see the ‘ethical’ angle - they do know they can give the hangar to anybody they want. If for example a business that leases a large amount of hangar space needs a T-hangar on short notice, they get it in preference to anybody else. Being in competition is the real world in which you maneuver when finding a hangar. Therefore it’s often good to make friends with the right people and come across as the kind of person with whom they’d like to do business. No different than any other in-demand rental property.

The other day I was leaving my hangar, the one I’ve held onto while paying rent on time every month for 16 years. A guy stopped his car and called me from across the airport fence. He told me he has an Aztec, is looking for a hangar but that he wasn’t made of money, thought the going rate was a rip-off, was annoyed at the last guy that rented to him. I wished him luck while coming to the conclusion that he will never find a hangar.
 
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