FAA: No Discernible Progress On Approving G100UL Avgas

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by Daleandee, Jul 16, 2022.

  1. Daleandee

    Daleandee En-Route

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  2. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 En-Route

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  3. Daleandee

    Daleandee En-Route

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    Not to be political but the current administration is heading in that direction. But they told us they would do this if elected so it must have been what the majority desired ...
     
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  4. TCABM

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    You left out unicorn farts
     
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  5. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    This is very political....;)
     
  6. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Actually, if you listen to Braly's many discussions on the topic, you get a picture of a systemic problem, Other groups invested in and lobbying for more testing at the expense of approval in order to make more money for themselves. Anyone who thinks that's reflective of any specific administration or political leaning is imagining things.
     
  7. Bob Noel

    Bob Noel Touchdown! Greaser!

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    For the people responsible for approving things that are critical to safety, the toughest thing to do is actually approve it.

    The easiest thing is to say more testing is required.
     
  8. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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  9. X3 Skier

    X3 Skier En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Nothing will happen on anything major until there’s a confirmed administrator. Nobody “Acting” is going to do anything significant and the new person will “need time to get up to speed” which means no progress on GAMA, MOSAIC, Medical, etc etc etc etc until two years into the next administration, whoever is President then.

    Cheers
     
  10. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    That ain’t quite gonna cut it....

    upload_2022-7-17_9-42-53.gif
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2022
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  11. X3 Skier

    X3 Skier En-Route PoA Supporter

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  12. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    It really is time for Braly to reach out to media besides the aviation press. Start getting some stories on popular news sites and TV news shows, play up the environmental stuff, maybe get the EPA quoted, get some video of tree-huggers singing Kumbaya and holding hands at an airport, etc. A story or two about CA airports banning lead and the FAA opposing the ban would help.

    Braly needs to shine some light into the darkened rooms of the FAA. He’s done it their way for years and they’re screwing him over.
     
  13. SCCutler

    SCCutler Administrator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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    I remain resolutely confident that the true intent is to effectively kill non-jet general aviation, except to the limited extent required to provide pilots for jets. The nascent (but growing) trend to banning 100LL was expected to do the job, and the availability of a viable and readily-produced 100UL substitute is... inconvenient... to the effort to eviscerate GA. So, it is being ignored, stonewalled.

    For those who believe this is only a problem for GAMI (or, for that matter, for the people who rely upon and require 100LL or equivalent, which represents the majority of the non-jet fuel used in GA), you're missing the bigger picture. GAMI met every requirement under the law for the approval of this fuel, even after extra steps were thrown in; the FAA people in charge of certifying the fuel (Wichita ACO) and "auditing" the results (Atlanta ACO - and this was an unprecedented requirement, thrown up in the face of the effort), have approved the STC without reservation. Notwithstanding all this, the FAA simply declines to approve without comment. So, the big picture: an utterly unaccountable administrative state is inventing new and secret rules.

    Is this a representative government?
     
  14. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    Nothing will come out of that goat rope. Remember, not only do they have to invent a new fuel, but now they have to do it without violating Braly’s pateants.
     
  15. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    Nope. So is it time for pilots to start calling Congress critters?
     
  16. Walboy

    Walboy Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Didn't the Supreme Court recently issue an opinion which will begin to rein in the administrative state?
     
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  17. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    These people want nothing short of a carbon neutral solution….we aren’t there…not even close. When FAA executives make bone headed comments regarding converting current GA to all electric….these are PhD types…I’ve lost all faith in our leadership.
     
  18. Kenny Phillips

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    Long ago. Mine hates me.
     
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  19. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    Slightly. But it’s a very high bar, will not do much for many years, and might not effect this anyway.
     
  20. SCCutler

    SCCutler Administrator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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    It's the Hunger Games (without the child-killing death battles); all things are intended to support the power and lifestyles of the "Important Ones, at the expense (both pecuniary and lifestyle) of the Less Important Ones in the districts.

    Personal transportation is disfavored (unless you're an Important One).

    Single-family homes are disfavored.

    If you live outside of a major metropolitan area, you're disfavored (except, you know, Martha's Vineyard, Telluride, Aspen, etc.).

    If you live where air conditioning is needed to make summertime living comfortable, you're disfavored.
     
  21. Clip4

    Clip4 Final Approach

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    No worries, we will switch to clean coal.
     
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  22. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    No.
     
  23. luvflyin

    luvflyin Touchdown! Greaser!

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  24. luvflyin

    luvflyin Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Hey. I started it out with "not to be" so therefore it is not.
     
  25. luvflyin

    luvflyin Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I just checked the home page. There are no Admins online right now. Let er rip.
     
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  26. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    He's thinking of West Virginia v. EPA and the major questions doctrine. From Wikipedia,

    The major questions doctrine is a rough analogue to the nondelegation doctrine, where the Supreme Court has held in recent years that in order for them to do so, Congress must have clearly authorized agencies to regulate issues the Court considers to be of vast significance.[14] When Congress fails to comply with this clear statement rule, the courts may infer that Congress did not intend to empower the agency. For example the Supreme Court ruled in June 2022 that the Environmental Protection Agency's (EPA) Clean Power Plan that would require energy producers to shift from fossil fuels to renewable sources was not part of the mandate to the EPA by the Clean Air Act, as the Court believed it fell under its major questions doctrine.[15]

    It's not likely to have much if any effect on any government agency.
     
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  27. NoHeat

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    Bad luck on the timing, maybe. The FAA Administrator resigned 3/31/22, and since then there’s only an acting Administrator.

     
  28. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    There’s a rumor that he was forced out because he was planning to approve the G100UL STC.
     
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  29. Walboy

    Walboy Pre-takeoff checklist

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    @Half Fast summarized what I was thinking
     
  30. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Wrong gummint agency....the EPA regulates it....and the FAA enforces the aviation portion of it. 14 CFR 36 & 34 are the responsibility of other agencies.

     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2022
  31. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

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    People reflexively go to the partisan stuff. I truly believe this is just the executive cabinet doing what they've always done: run the clock offense on the aggrieved. The DoD services do the same thing with us (their indentured labor).

    The ultimate effect here is to mothball piston GA; it's an airspace grab ultimately. But they have to mind the airlines pilot accessions interest, hence run the clock. This isn't about ecological policy on either side of the anthropogenic climate change mouth-foaming kerfuffle. This is about control and representation of the favored within the NAS, as @SCCutler highlights in post #20. Yes, it bones up GAMI on a personal business level, but this effort is motivated at constituencies bigger-pocketed than GAMI, in the eyes of the regulatory-captured agency.

    Personally I don't know why rec players would be pearl clutchy about this. Most of us aren't 'new' here. Plenty of examples of this behavior as early as 2013 (part 23 re-write implementation). Where FAA openly scoffed at Congress' directive to implement, a full 2 years late, and cut out most of the meaningful reforms for us "poors" who were never going to buy a new production airplane in the first place. Run the clock offense is old as the sport itself. Ever heard of justice delayed justice denied? We live this stuff every day in fac built land. They got suckers these days making rain dances to the sky over MOSAIC potato. lulz. The cavalry is coming boys! *muffled laughter*

    As to the US being a representative government in bona fide? Gentlemen, please. Adult bed time stories at this stage of our lives?
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2022
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  32. DaleB

    DaleB Final Approach

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  33. Daleandee

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    You learn fast ...
     
  34. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I'm familiar with the doctrine.

    That's why I said "No."
     
  35. Lindberg

    Lindberg Final Approach

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    Why are so many pilots looking forward to this? Isn't it just going to be even more expensive?
     
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  36. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    It will likely save more money in engine life than it will cost. Besides, I don’t particularly like getting leaded gas on my hands when fueling or sumping my tanks.
     
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  37. Daleandee

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    :yeahthat:

    OK ... that's a wrap!
     
  38. MountainDude

    MountainDude Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    This is another AOPA failure. They have a $50M yearly budget and have very little to show for it.
     
  39. Pi1otguy

    Pi1otguy Pattern Altitude

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    Without lead synthetic oils with double or triple the interval between oil changes become possible. Lower chance of fouling spark plugs. (BTDT, it sucks). Old warbirds can run near their rated power.
     
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  40. Daleandee

    Daleandee En-Route

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    This is only part of the reason AOPA and I parted ways earlier this year ...