Estate Planning For Pilots

Geico266

Geico266

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Something we don't discuss much, it's bad mojo to talk dying as a pilot, IMHO. We lost Tony S to cancer a couple of months ago. I just finalized my will after 10 years of deliberations, so the subject of estate planning has been on my mind for a while.

We have a complex situation involving lots of stuff, blended families, and tons of grandkids. The attorney recommended dual revocable trusts, and splitting my company with my wife. Seems reasonable and logical so we went with it. She controls her portion and I mine. I can leave my portion to who ever I want, and so can she. If I die she gets the income off of my portion until her death, but cannot sell any assets without 100% approval of all named in the will.

Do you'll have a will? Estate planning? If not why not?
 
We went the living trust/estate plamning route about 12-13 yrs ago. It's pretty thorough, but if you do that you always have to remember to keep things titled properly.

At the very least it gets spouses to have to talk with each other.
 
Have a will ,thanks for the reminder,time to update.
 
I also recommend to my clients that you sit down and do a quick review AT LEAST every five years. It's amazing how much can change in one's life in five years time. I send out reminders with some tips on things to think about. They don't even need to call me as long as they're satisfied nothing material has changed. But quite a few end up calling for changes.
 
Geico266 said:
as long as they are joint accounts right?
Click to expand...

Our guy pretty much wants every account owned by a trust. I don't think an IRA can be, though, and there are other exceptions.

Our guy changed his recommendation on titling cars into a trust after his daughter was injured by a hit and run driver a couple years ago - I think she was a pedestrian. I don't remember all the details now, but her car was titled in a trust and the car insurance covered medical for uninsured things like this where the other guy's ins.co. should have paid. Problem was, her car was titled in a trust - the trust wasn't injured, she was, and the ins. co. wouldn't pay. This guy is very, very good and spent a whole lot of his own money getting another attorney to work it out, but they couldn't. Again, I don't remember all the details, but from then on he recommends leaving cars titled to an individual with a transfer on death to a trust.
 
Geico266 said:
Something we don't discuss much, it's bad mojo to talk dying as a pilot, IMHO. We lost Tony S to cancer a couple of months ago. I just finalized my will after 10 years of deliberations, so the subject of estate planning has been on my mind for a while.
Click to expand...


Thanks for leaving me your airplane!! ;)

Haven't done Wills here, but no kids, and if we both go (at the same time - yikes) mom gets it all.

She's secretly planning to cut our brake line for Christmas I think. Will have to keep an eye on her. ;)

Not much need for a Trust other than convenience. Titles are dual with rights of survivorship and accounts have each other listed as joint or beneficiary.

Colorado Probate would have a judge assign the other as Personal Representative of the Estate and ask for an accounting. It's pretty simple.

A Trust would just make it faster and no need for the Judge to do anything other than say, "approved", is all.

The only reason we'd add a Trust would be for signs that someone is slipping mentally.

Hey Karen? Why am I signing this again? ;)

Or... If I were to purchase any NFA firearms. Those would go into a Trust. Far easier to remove someone from an approved Trust than to get a new approval. No plans to do so at this time.

The biggest problem would be if we both go, no one has a spare house key. I should probably put one in the safety deposit box and authorize someone else to get in it if we croak simultaneously.
 
I don't have a will but we often say "We really should get on that"
We have been having that conversation for about 15 years

Let me ask.
If we both die on our sleep tonight (I saw the thing about 9V batteries and steel wool so it is likely)

What happens to everything?

I would assume our parents would get to decide who gets what.
We have a lot of life insurance and a lot of equity in our house

where does that stuff go w/o a will?

Where do the kids go?

I for some reason assume my sister and our parents all get to decide that.


ugh the fact that I am asking these questions....
Ok, I will commit to having a will by qtr1 2015 but would still like the above answered.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I don't have a will but we often say "We really should get on that"
We have been having that conversation for about 15 years

Let me ask.
If we both die on our sleep tonight (I saw the thing about 9V batteries and steel wool so it is likely)

What happens to everything?

I would assume our parents would get to decide who gets what.
We have a lot of life insurance and a lot of equity in our house

where does that stuff go w/o a will?

Where do the kids go?

I for some reason assume my sister and our parents all get to decide that.


ugh the fact that I am asking these questions....
Ok, I will commit to having a will by qtr1 2015 but would still like the above answered.
Click to expand...

Depends upon your state. Do you really want to have a judge decide where your kids go? Do you want to leave your assets up for grabs by the government? You can get it done this week.
 
paflyer said:
Depends upon your state. Do you really want to have a judge decide where your kids go? Do you want to leave your assets up for grabs by the government? You can get it done this week.
Click to expand...

How?
Can I just write out my wishes and get it notarized or mail it to myself or do I have to pay a guy?
 
Geico266 said:
Something we don't discuss much, it's bad mojo to talk dying as a pilot, IMHO. We lost Tony S to cancer a couple of months ago. I just finalized my will after 10 years of deliberations, so the subject of estate planning has been on my mind for a while.

We have a complex situation involving lots of stuff, blended families, and tons of grandkids. The attorney recommended dual revocable trusts, and splitting my company with my wife. Seems reasonable and logical so we went with it. She controls her portion and I mine. I can leave my portion to who ever I want, and so can she. If I die she gets the income off of my portion until her death, but cannot sell any assets without 100% approval of all named in the will.

Do you'll have a will? Estate planning? If not why not?
Click to expand...

I have nothing except half a ranch my ex wife is on and will have clear by a survivorship contract or vice versa. That takes care of my needs, toss my body in the back corner to be eaten.
 
Single guy now.... Some goes to a local family I trust 100%...

The rest is going the the EAA Young Eagles program and a scholarship for female pilots since gals only account for 9% of licensed pilots....

I want to change that, and a 7 figure gift will go far...:yes:....
 
N801BH said:
Single guy now.... Some goes to a local family I trust 100%...

The rest is going the the EAA Young Eagles program and a scholarship for female pilots since gals only account for 9% of licensed pilots....

I want to change that, and a 7 figure gift will go far...:yes:....
Click to expand...


And you left me your airplane too? LOL. You guys are too kind. ;)
 
Don't let it go through the courts, some scum bag lawyer will get a healthy chunk of your money, instead if your loved ones, and a judge will make decisions he has no business making.

Plan to make the transition as under the radar and seemless as possible. POD accounts, changing titles up, etc.
 
Make provisions to care for your plane and get it into caring hands as quickly as possible. I have seen planes deteriorate to the point of junk in the time it takes the courts and squabbling heirs to allow it to be sold or transferred.
 
A while back when we my mother-in-law was diagnosed with Alzheimers but while she was still competent we got all the stuff executed, not really out of concerns that the estate was going to amount to anything but we did get the powers of attorney and advance medical directives in place which certainly helped us in the long run.

A lawyer can usually in a nice little package set up the trusts, transfer or give instructions on what to transfer into the trusts, draft the advance medical directives, and POAs etc, write a pour over will for anything that is left. All you need to do is put the documents somewhere safe and let your successors know how to find them.
 
flyingron said:
A while back when we my mother-in-law was diagnosed with Alzheimers but while she was still competent we got all the stuff executed, not really out of concerns that the estate was going to amount to anything but we did get the powers of attorney and advance medical directives in place which certainly helped us in the long run.

A lawyer can usually in a nice little package set up the trusts, transfer or give instructions on what to transfer into the trusts, draft the advance medical directives, and POAs etc, write a pour over will for anything that is left. All you need to do is put the documents somewhere safe and let your successors know how to find them.
Click to expand...

That's a great point. Part of estate planning is getting all the other documents in order - powers of attorney, living wills, things like that.
 
N801BH said:
Single guy now.... Some goes to a local family I trust 100%...

The rest is going the the EAA Young Eagles program and a scholarship for female pilots since gals only account for 9% of licensed pilots....

I want to change that, and a 7 figure gift will go far...:yes:....
Click to expand...

Nice!

:yes:
 
flyingron said:
A while back when we my mother-in-law was diagnosed with Alzheimers but while she was still competent we got all the stuff executed, not really out of concerns that the estate was going to amount to anything but we did get the powers of attorney and advance medical directives in place which certainly helped us in the long run.

A lawyer can usually in a nice little package set up the trusts, transfer or give instructions on what to transfer into the trusts, draft the advance medical directives, and POAs etc, write a pour over will for anything that is left. All you need to do is put the documents somewhere safe and let your successors know how to find them.
Click to expand...

Matthew said:
That's a great point. Part of estate planning is getting all the other documents in order - powers of attorney, living wills, things like that.
Click to expand...


Exactly right. We have a business. We have named a local bank to act as a trustee for the business if we are both gone at the same time. Rents need to be collected and bills paid until the properties can be liquidated and the proceeds distributed to the heirs. We need immediate action from a trusted source to preserve assets. We chose a third party independant trustee.
 
Henning said:
I have nothing except half a ranch my ex wife is on and will have clear by a survivorship contract or vice versa. That takes care of my needs, toss my body in the back corner to be eaten.
Click to expand...

How about a sky burial? They're all the rage for philosopher types like yourself.
 
Kristin said:
Make provisions to care for your plane and get it into caring hands as quickly as possible. I have seen planes deteriorate to the point of junk in the time it takes the courts and squabbling heirs to allow it to be sold or transferred.
Click to expand...

Which reminds me, the plane is the only thing not titled jointly with my wife.

Advice from the attorney who just revised our wills, make sure everything not jointly owned (like life insurance policies and retirement accounts) has the correct chain of beneficiaries in the paperwork.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
How?
Can I just write out my wishes and get it notarized or mail it to myself or do I have to pay a guy?
Click to expand...

Completely depends - wishes may or may not be taken into consideration. Simply notarizing something in some states doesn't matter...talk to an estate planning attorney / CPA. $1,000 now could save a few hundred thousand in taxes and headaches for your heirs...
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
How?
Can I just write out my wishes and get it notarized or mail it to myself or do I have to pay a guy?
Click to expand...

Maybe, or Legal Zoom, but for a few hundred bucks to a live lawyer you get also good advice for your particular situation, and there might be less opportunity to for someone to contest it.
 
paflyer said:
Which reminds me, the plane is the only thing not titled jointly with my wife.

Advice from the attorney who just revised our wills, make sure everything not jointly owned (like life insurance policies and retirement accounts) has the correct chain of beneficiaries in the paperwork.
Click to expand...


that's because insurance policy supersede state law (same with 401ks and IRAs), the beneficiary on file gets it, not what the will says
 
paflyer said:
Maybe, or Legal Zoom, but for a few hundred bucks to a live lawyer you get also good advice for your particular situation, and there might be less opportunity to for someone to contest it.
Click to expand...

DO NOT, I repeat, DO Not use LegalZoom for a will (or for anything for that matter, their "advice" is far too generic). Most of those wills have not been tested and the courts in many states are refusing them for lack of proper form. They are "generic" wills, not considering state issues...
 
James331 said:
Don't let it go through the courts, some scum bag lawyer will get a healthy chunk of your money, instead if your loved ones, and a judge will make decisions he has no business making.

Plan to make the transition as under the radar and seemless as possible. POD accounts, changing titles up, etc.
Click to expand...

Issue there is certain people who didn't get what they think they are "entitled" to will challenge it...creates a whole bunch of headaches. My mother and her sister didn't speak for almost 10 years after their parents died because each didn't agree on the disbursement of the estate. Money rips families apart...have a plan that can be backed up by law.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I don't have a will but we often say "We really should get on that"
We have been having that conversation for about 15 years

Let me ask.
If we both die on our sleep tonight (I saw the thing about 9V batteries and steel wool so it is likely)

What happens to everything?

I would assume our parents would get to decide who gets what.
We have a lot of life insurance and a lot of equity in our house

where does that stuff go w/o a will?

Where do the kids go?

I for some reason assume my sister and our parents all get to decide that.


ugh the fact that I am asking these questions....
Ok, I will commit to having a will by qtr1 2015 but would still like the above answered.
Click to expand...
Getting these decisions made in advance means YOU get to choose. Otherwise the laws of your State and the probate court will decide, and it may not work out the way you hope.

Add up your IRAs, 401(k)s, life insurance policies, bank accounts, personal property, and home equity. You might be worth a lot more than you thought. How do you want that estate handled if you, or your wife, or both of you can't do it? Who looks out for the best interest of your kids? Are they going to get everything as a lump sum when they turn 18 or do you want to spread it out? It doesn't have to be death, either, it can be something as simple as somebody running a red light and leaving you unable to handle your own affairs.

You'll have to think about this. We got serious about it when we had kids. Everyone's situation is different.
 
Even a will has to go through probate so make sure it's set up correctly.

I went with a trust. And a good trust attorney. Everybody's situations are different. There's no substitute for good counsel from a qualified person who is familiar with your financial details. Death and taxes are serious stuff.
 
Stewartb said:
Even a will has to go through probate so make sure it's set up correctly.

I went with a trust. And a good trust attorney. Everybody's situations are different. There's no substitute for good counsel from a qualified person who is familiar with your financial details. Death and taxes are serious stuff.
Click to expand...
Yes. (I'm not a lawyer, but it's been explained to me...) Even with a trust, you'll still need a will for whatever is left over outside the trust, and a will goes through probate. But if you've done it right, that should be a simple process.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I don't have a will but we often say "We really should get on that"
We have been having that conversation for about 15 years

Let me ask.
If we both die on our sleep tonight (I saw the thing about 9V batteries and steel wool so it is likely)

What happens to everything?

I would assume our parents would get to decide who gets what.
We have a lot of life insurance and a lot of equity in our house

where does that stuff go w/o a will?

Where do the kids go?

I for some reason assume my sister and our parents all get to decide that.


ugh the fact that I am asking these questions....
Ok, I will commit to having a will by qtr1 2015 but would still like the above answered.
Click to expand...

Google is your friend: "texas die without will"


http://www.texaswillsandtrustslaw.com/2010/10/18/dying-without-a-will-the-texas-intestacy-statutes/
Intestate Distribution for Those Who Die Unmarried <Edit>or Spouse Dies Simultaneously</Edit> with Children

If you are single and have children, then all your property will pass to your descendants. If your descendants are of the same degree of relationship, (meaning, for example, that all are your children or all are your grandchildren), then the assets will be divided equally between them.

However, if your descendants are of different degrees of relationship, (meaning some of your children predecease you, leaving children or grandchildren of their own), then the younger generation would only be entitled only to the share the older generation would have received had he or she survived.
<snip>

Intestate Distribution for Those Who Die While Married

Many people may assume that if they are married and die without a will in Texas, their surviving spouse will inherit their entire estate. This is not always the case. How their property is divided depends on whether it is characterized as community property or separate property.

Community Property

All property acquired during a marriage is presumed to be community property. Under Texas laws, if you are married and are survived by a spouse and children, then:

Your surviving spouse will inherit all your community property if all your children are also the children of your surviving spouse;
Otherwise, all your one-half interest in the community estate will pass to your children, with your spouse keeping only his or her one-half interest.
If you do not have any children, then your surviving spouse will inherit all of your community property.

Separate Property

If your property is characterized as separate property, the distribution scheme is different:

If you are survived a spouse and children, your surviving spouse is entitled to one third of your separate personal property and only a life estate (the right to use the property until his or her death) in one-third of your separate real property. The rest would be inherited outright by the children of the deceased spouse.
If you are married but have no children or other descendants, your surviving spouse would be entitled to all the separate personal property. But if you have surviving parents and siblings, the surviving spouse would only be entitled to one-half of the separate real property with the other half passing to the parents, siblings or descendants of siblings in a manner set forth by the statutes.
If you want the freedom to decide how and to whom your property will be distributed when you die, you need a will.
Click to expand...

http://www.fordbergner.com/8-Dying-Without-a-Will-in-Texas-What-Happens

http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/intestate-succession-texas.html
If you die without a will in Texas, your assets will go to your closest relatives under state “intestate succession” laws. Here are some details about how intestate succession works in Texas.
Which Assets Pass by Intestate Succession
Only assets that would have passed through your will are affected by intestate succession laws. Usually, that includes only assets that you own alone, in your own name.
Many valuable assets don’t go through your will, and aren’t affected by intestate succession laws. Here are some examples:
property you’ve transferred to a living trust
life insurance proceeds
funds in an IRA, 401(k), or other retirement account
payable-on-death bank accounts, or
property you own with someone else in joint tenancy.
These assets will pass to the surviving co-owner or to the beneficiary you named, whether or not you have a will.
Click to expand...
 
You should also have something in mind in the case that you become incapacitated but not dead. This is especially true if you are single. After hearing a friend's story about his brother who had a stroke at age 50 and the problems the family went through trying to have a guardian appointed, I went to a lawyer and had something set up.
 
Everskyward said:
You should also have something in mind in the case that you become incapacitated but not dead. This is especially true if you are single. After hearing a friend's story about his brother who had a stroke at age 50 and the problems the family went through trying to have a guardian appointed, I went to a lawyer and had something set up.
Click to expand...

this is called a "living will"
 
mrkbbd said:
this is called a "living will"
Click to expand...
That's part of it. A living will sets up the type of medical care you want to receive if you can't speak for yourself. But you'll also need to appoint a power of attorney so someone can make medical decisions for you, and a power of attorney so someone can make financial decisions for you.

This is way less stressful on the family to do in advance.
 
My wife and I are into the process of finalizing advanced medical directives and setting up a trust now. We found a good attorney who does all of it for "reasonable" fixed-fee. Not cheap, but far cheaper than the cut the state and any hourly attorneys would have claimed if everything went into probate court. The nice thing about doing it on a fixed-fee basis is that you have an idea of what the hourly cost would otherwise have been, so you know at least how much of his time you've bought and you feel obligated to keep asking questions and having discussions until you've at least got your money's worth.
 
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