EAA Going After AOPA's Market

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by airdale, May 3, 2013.

  1. poadeleted21

    poadeleted21 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    A lot of people on this site have put their well being in other people on this site's hands. One picked me up the day after my fathers funeral, another helped me move to my current home....3000 miles across the country. I have been a guest at the homes of other members, I've offered my home and my vacation home for members of this site to use if they want. "Don't have to look in the eye" and "anonymity of the internet" is a big assumption.

    I'm heading over to the lake house this weekend, just down the road from Double Springs, AL airport. Beers on me.
     
  2. jhausch

    jhausch Cleared for Takeoff

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    Awesome link. I like it.
     
  3. jhausch

    jhausch Cleared for Takeoff

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    Wow - guess I should have read the whole thread before defending "The Atlantic". I still think it is not "the most liberal rag in the world...." I actually find lots of good information from all sort of sources - liberal and conservative.

    I love how the Wikipedia list calls the The Economist "Moderate/Neoliberal" That strikes me as someone calling it "no longer the right kind of conservative".... :). That magazine has so much content and so many distinct editorial voices that I'm not sure how to classify it.

    Anyhow, I find myself in, um, interesting company. Let's see if I now get painted by the same brush or if I will continue to be judged upon the merits of my contributions...
     
  4. poadeleted21

    poadeleted21 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I'll call you liberal if you want to post in the Spin Zone. :rofl:
     
  5. wabower

    wabower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Me too. Maybe I'll buy one and go back on the Red Board. Oh, wait, I can't do that now. Never mind.

     
  6. docmirror

    docmirror Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Cowboy - yeehah!
    This is so 2 hours ago. Give it a rest. Back to AOPAs decisive line-in-the-sand approach to supporting GA.

    Oops, they don't have one, unlike the NRA with weapons registration. :yes:

    <edited for clarity>
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  7. jhausch

    jhausch Cleared for Takeoff

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    Story of my life...
     
  8. docmirror

    docmirror Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Cowboy - yeehah!
    Me too. I get to the buffet, and all the giant shrimp are gone! I gotta suffer with the horse doovers. :)
     
  9. JeffDG

    JeffDG Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I retract my prior statement. He is the most thin-skinned person in the world. That's literally true, not an expression.

    Gotta be tough living in an echo chamber where "The Atlantic" is considered middle of the road, and coming out to the real world and seeing that other people actually think for themselves rather than regurgitating talking points.
     
  10. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    He once got offended by a question mark.
    He has Dr Phil on speed dial.

    He is the most thin-skinned person in the world.

    Stay whiny, my friends.
     
  11. retailguy

    retailguy Line Up and Wait

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    Well, I probably should start a new thread for this, now that this one has been trashed.

    I'm coming back to give a public THANKS to Tom, and to Gary. I saw this post on Sunday, and left my information via PM as Tom requested. Monday, before 11AM I had a response from Gary, explaining what he knew about both my situation, and what would be a likely path that I will have to follow. I got this email at about 5pm when I got home from work. I replied with a couple of questions, and got another reply at 8:30pm, along with an offer to help further when the time is right.

    I know some of you are so polluted with your prior experiences, I can't sway you, and that's OK. But, this pilot is grateful for the time both of these guys spent explaining and assisting me. What I needed when I called AOPA originally was information. What to do, how to do it, what's the impact if it goes sideways, what substantive info is the focus of the FAA, etc. I haven't been through this before, and really didn't understand what I needed to do. I have a much better understanding of that now.

    Where I'm at, I'm grateful for the opinions of folks who've done this before, and I thought it was important to point that out. If anyone is left reading this thread, thanks for listening.
     
  12. gprellwitz

    gprellwitz Touchdown! Greaser!

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    And thank you for the update. Had to skip past a lot of junk posts to get to this!
     
  13. docmirror

    docmirror Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Cowboy - yeehah!
    Do you think the exposure here on POA had anything to do with it? Your prev post was pretty gloomy. What has changed since then? Plenty of public exposure on AOPA from this board.

    I'm glad you're getting what you need.
     
  14. denverpilot

    denverpilot Tied Down

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    Ed's not anonymous, that I'm aware of. Any number of us know his real name if you care to ask. Is Tommy3 your real name? Why the complaint about anonymity? He'd probably tell you his real name if you had asked.

    (My username leads directly to easily finding my real name as well via tons of sources, if you're so inclined. Just to nip that complaint in the bud. It's Nate, by the way. What's yours?)

    What I'm noting here, is the only truly anonymous person in the conversation is complaining about the anonymity of the Internet. There is some tasty irony there.
     
  15. denverpilot

    denverpilot Tied Down

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    And agreed it's nice the OP is hopefully headed for a more positive outcome after this thread, even if it was turned into a train-wreck.
     
  16. retailguy

    retailguy Line Up and Wait

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    Good questions. I'd say it was more getting connected with the right person, as much as the exposure. But this forum provided that opportunity. That's one of the reasons I phrased my first post the way I did. This forum has the opportunity to communicate with someone that is normally a challenge to speak with directly. I got the short term benefit, which I'm very appreciative of, and I hope that we don't drive him off so someone else has access when they need it.

    To say that the only reason I got help was this "public" opportunity, implies that AOPA didn't really want to help me. After talking with Tom and Gary, I don't believe that's true at all. When you receive an email with answers to your questions at 8:30PM on a Monday night, if you're being honest, you have to believe that they care. Why else reply then? My questions certainly weren't time critical. I can only conclude that they were treated as important. That meant something to me.

    When I originally spoke with AOPA, there were no previous cases for my condition. That was disheartening. It still is. I hate blazing new trails. It is time consuming and expensive. It's also risky. I'm in my 40's. If I lose, it's a long time to go without flying. But if I don't try, it's a long time with just LSA, or better phrased, to go without that bonanza that I've been dreaming about for years.

    This illness could have killed me. I guess it still could. But I was and still am, unprepared for all the things it has taken from me or impacted even with me living. That's been a real roller coaster ride for me. I've been turned away by several qualified people because they don't know what to do, and they don't want to be the one who screws it up. Can't really argue with that, but, left to my own devices, I'll make a mess of it for sure. You know what I mean?
     
  17. N801BH

    N801BH Touchdown! Greaser! Gone West

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    ...

    Yeah.. But...... The employees stated are making 6 figure incomes at AOPA and are now getting damn worried about their jobs...:hairraise:...

    It is clear there is major dissatisfaction with AOPA and members are bailing in droves...... To cut the bleeding, the staff is in a full court press to try and stem the tide........
     
  18. ClimbnSink

    ClimbnSink Ejection Handle Pulled

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    I've been aopa ambivalent for years and am surprised at the number of people joining us cool kids. Give it a couple of years for everyone's autopay credit cards to expire and there won't be a single member left.
     
  19. docmirror

    docmirror Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Cowboy - yeehah!
    I think one of the reasons you 'got connected to the right person' is that there was plenty of exposure here on POA. You had the same illness, you are the same person, and you contacted the same AOPA the first time. Why didn't they get you to 'the right person' back then? I've found it's quite interesting how smoothly things go when the eyes of the public are on someone.

    Also, I didn't say it was the only reason, but I think there are forces at work in AOPA that grease squeaky wheels which you became after you posted right here.

    Well, I won't beat this horse anymore, glad you got what you needed from AOPA and are happy with the resolution, or continuing assistance.

    :thumbsup:
     
  20. wabower

    wabower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    What percentage of members have any notion that any of this tempest in a teapot is taking place?

     
  21. dell30rb

    dell30rb Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    Squeaky wheel always gets the grease. Its better than AOPA doing nothing.

    In a company which provides service, its difficult to detect unhappy customers if they don't complain.
     
  22. ClimbnSink

    ClimbnSink Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Dunno. What % tires of the 'ga would be dead without aopa' line?
     
  23. wabower

    wabower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Most are smart enough to handle all junk mail the same way.

     
  24. JeffDG

    JeffDG Touchdown! Greaser!

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  25. airdale

    airdale Pattern Altitude

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    I think you'd be very safe betting that it was a single digit number.

    I doubt it. They know full well who is in control at AOPA and it is not a few disgruntled members, no matter how vocal. In fact, it is not the members at all.

    It's not clear to me. Do you have some kind of data? I would like to know what the membership trend looks like. I am sure there is some negative trend and some mild concern but I'd be very surprised if it was more than a few percent per year and largely unchanged from past years. Maybe I'm wrong though.
     
  26. jbarrass

    jbarrass Line Up and Wait

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    2010: 414,224
    2012: 384,915

    a loss of 7% in two years
     
  27. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    Probably due to attrition more than anything else. The pilot population is getting pretty darned old.
     
  28. jbarrass

    jbarrass Line Up and Wait

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    I don't know, but that is a reasonable theory. I think that is why we need to open up and get more young folks into the air. We should be making it easier to start or we'll just fade away....
     
  29. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    No arguments here.
     
  30. JohnAJohnson

    JohnAJohnson Cleared for Takeoff

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    What's the Pilot decline in the same period?
     
  31. retailguy

    retailguy Line Up and Wait

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    I usually adopt the cynical viewpoint too, however, I don't believe that's what I experienced. I can usually spot CYA stuff a mile away. This is not what this was. Their interest and concern was genuine, and their answers were too quick and too helpful for them to have been insincere.

    Also, I'm not sure that focusing on the income levels is a really reasonable position to take around here. I would think that this forum would have a higher percentage of 6 figure earners than a typical forum. It kind of goes with our hobby, which isn't inexpensive by any measure.

    If there is a tide to stem, I guess I'm happy they figured that out and are here trying. What difference does their motivation really make? We need AOPA as much as they need us. Someone or something has to advocate for this hobby. All we have to do is remember what happened in the middle of the night in Chicago 10 years back. Could some other organization do it? Probably, but are they? And who are they? EAA?

    I understand your point. But it assumes that if I had merely PM'ed Tom instead of public posting that he wouldn't have had any interest in helping me. I don't think that would've been true. I actually thought about a private message first, but in the end I really didn't expect a response so I just posted what I thought. I think in this case, my impressions were wrong, and I believe I'd have been helped in the same way that I was with a PM.

    Also, I'm reluctant to overly criticize the assistance I received initially. Even in my initial post, I went easy on that part. The person I spoke with was very polite. She answered the questions that I asked, and offered to call the FAA on my behalf. She did that and called me right back with what they told her. It wasn't much info, and she told me that she usually was able to get more information.

    Please remember that I'm new at this, never been sick before, and only have basic information as to what I'm doing. In fact, when I went in for my medical before I learned to fly, I didn't even know what class I needed, and didn't know what to ask. I felt almost that stupid on the phone with her, and had I known more of what to ask, I might have received more information. So, I can own some of it, and like I said, I didn't expect any help, as I'd been turned away by my local AME, and another person in Arizona that I called for advice. Would I have hoped for more? Of course. But, it wasn't bad customer service either.

    I do appreciate your kind words. I'm hopeful that one day soon I'll actually have a medical back. But, we'll see.
     
  32. ron22

    ron22 Cleared for Takeoff

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    If you are still talking about Ed. I have only met Ed a couple of times and my impression of him is he is the type of guy will tell you to your face what he thinks. I could be wrong others know him a lot better then I. And I do not mean any disrespect to Ed for this comment.
     
  33. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Hey Ron,

    **** you and the horse you rode in on! :D


    PS - You gotta get up to the fly-in again.
     
  34. SkyHog

    SkyHog Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Everything Offends Me
    Ed's kind of a jerk. You get used to it.

    BTW - I STILL maintain that he would be the perfect leader of AOPA, if they wanted someone with youthful energy and a GA centric brain.

    I really, truthfully mean that.