Does Fracking lead to earthquakes

SCCutler said:
Reality is, if you're in an area with producible minerals underneath, odds are they're gonna get produced, unless you own the mineral rights and choose not to produce.
Click to expand...

And in the case of hydrocarbons (oil, gas), even if you choose not to produce the minerals will be produced and your neighbors will benefit in terms of royalties...the quote from the Pennsylvania judge who set precedent on the matter is classic - I'll have to see if I can dig it up
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
But w/o fracing, would there be injection wells?
Meaning I think most people call the entire process Frakin from soup to nuts
Click to expand...

Yes. They're orthogonal.

If it makes you feel better, earthquakes have been recorded in Texas fairly regularly for the past 150 years.
 
AuntPeggy said:
Right. It is the same as suggesting that selling almonds has nothing to do with growing trees.
Click to expand...
No, it's the same as suggesting that growing trees may have nothing to do with selling almonds. Almonds grow on trees, so do apples. There will be trees in orchards even if you outlaw almond sales. There will be injection wells even if you outlaw fracking (or even all oil production).
 
Owning mineral rights is meaningless.
In my last neighborhood I kept mine but once a % of the neighbors sold theirs out to the digging company, they were able to claim them all and proceed w/ the dig.

At one point they even said buying the rights is a courtsey because legally, they could just start the digging.

I forget the name of the company but they weren't even the diggers.
They were just buying the rights to sell to the actual digging company.
 
Lindberg said:
Yes. They're orthogonal.

If it makes you feel better, earthquakes have been recorded in Texas fairly regularly for the past 150 years.
Click to expand...

I don't care that much about the earthquakes.
I don't want them but I don't want any thing that goes along with the process. Wells, lights and noise, trucks coming and going, whatever is going to happen to the water table.

The first well should go in Greg Abbot's yard
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Owning mineral rights is meaningless.
In my last neighborhood I kept mine but once a % of the neighbors sold theirs out to the digging company, they were able to claim them all and proceed w/ the dig.

At one point they even said buying the rights is a courtsey because legally, they could just start the digging.

I forget the name of the company but they weren't even the diggers.
They were just buying the rights to sell to the actual digging company.
Click to expand...

That depends on the state. Basically you can't prevent your neighbors from enjoying their rights if that is what some state legislated percentage of them want to do. And yes, you can be a non-participating mineral interest owner in Texas. Doing so may be a good idea on an exploratory well but prolly not such a good idea on a development well cause you'll lose the opportunity for some cashflow.

As for the last part, that is certainly one way the business works. Promoters put together a "land" position and then sell it (at a slight mark-up) to somebody with deep enough pockets, staff, and other where-withall to drill.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I don't care that much about the earthquakes.
I don't want them but I don't want any thing that goes along with the process. Wells, lights and noise, trucks coming and going, whatever is going to happen to the water table.

The first well should go in Greg Abbot's yard
Click to expand...
I have a neighbor that feels the same way about airports and noisy airplanes.
 
JOhnH said:
I have a neighbor that feels the same way about airports and noisy airplanes.
Click to expand...

He should move to an area where they not only don't have an airport but also where they have a ban on building one.

That should work until Greg Abbot decides to overturn it.
 
Or you could live in the middle of a subdivision where the houses are close enough together that there is no room for the required setback. :idea:
 
Clark1961 said:
If you don't want drilling near you then read the title very carefully to see if you have any rights. These days most mineral rights are severed from surface rights which means that the surface rights owner has very little say in the exploitation of minerals.

Maybe I should start up a service to examine titles and advise folks on the likelihood of minerals exploitation in their area?
Click to expand...

This is very true! in most instances they can drill on your land and you have no recourse! Also check the law rammed thru by cheney while in office concerning the drillers responsibility concerning damage or cleanup. It's virtually none.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
This is very true! in most instances they can drill on your land and you have no recourse! Also check the law rammed thru by cheney while in office concerning the drillers responsibility concerning damage or cleanup. It's virtually none.
Click to expand...

Anything left on my property overnight becomes mine. And guess what's going to happen to it? It won't be there in the morning.
 
EdFred said:
Anything left on my property overnight becomes mine. And guess what's going to happen to it? It won't be there in the morning.
Click to expand...

That approach almost never ends well for the surface rights owner - the oil companies have legal staff and access to some very expensive legal talent.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
This is very true! in most instances they can drill on your land and you have no recourse! Also check the law rammed thru by cheney while in office concerning the drillers responsibility concerning damage or cleanup. It's virtually none.
Click to expand...


Really? Which law school did you go to, Jimmy?
 
Clark1961 said:
That approach almost never ends well for the surface rights owner - the oil companies have legal staff and access to some very expensive legal talent.
Click to expand...

I also know how to make homemade explosives. :)
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
He should move to an area where they not only don't have an airport but also where they have a ban on building one.

That should work until Greg Abbot decides to overturn it.
Click to expand...

You overestimate the governor's power.

If you want to guarantee no wells within 500' of your house, you can do that by buying a 25 acre spread somewhere and making sure you own the mineral rights.
 
It is not as if Governor Abbott created the law...
 
It is VERY popular in texas to hate republican governors for no good reason, except for the fact that they dared to get elected with the wrong voter ID.
 
Lindberg said:
You overestimate the governor's power.

If you want to guarantee no wells within 500' of your house, you can do that by buying a 25 acre spread somewhere and making sure you own the mineral rights.
Click to expand...

Even that strategy might not work in Texas. Some states it would, notably Wyoming. If you want protection from drilling operations the best thing to do would be to move to an area that has no attractive geologic strata.
 
Fracking causes earthquakes just like pencils cause misspellings, and spoons make you fat.
 
Last edited:
Clark1961 said:
Even that strategy might not work in Texas.
Click to expand...
Why not? A 25-acre plot should be about 1,000' on a side. Build your house in the middle, and as long as you own the mineral rights, there will never be a well within 500'. In fact, I was just out at my friend's 50-acre place not far from 6PC's part of the metromess. He'll never see wells unless he wants to.
 
Last edited:
Florida Cracker said:
Fracking causes earthquakes just like pencils cause misspellings, and spoons make you fat.
Click to expand...

SixPapaCharlie said:
You should take your findings from the studies you have done on the subject to the fine folks at SMU.
They are probably just making crap up from hearsay and the internet gossip. You need to set them straight with your testing results quickly.

http://www.smu.edu/News/2015/earthquakes-azle-report-21april2015
Click to expand...

Again, this study concluded that injection wells, and to a lesser extent production of brine, contributed to the earthquakes. Not fracking. But thanks for posting that. I know one of the authors from way back and had no idea that's what he's doing now.
 
Meh.

Assume (for the purpose of the discussion) that hydraulic fracturing is triggering the recent spate of tremors in north Texas: so what? An earthquake simply cannot occur without stored seismic energy (stress)- the hydraulic fracturing cannot create seismic energy, only trigger the release of some portion of it.

If ever there is the theoretical possibility of an actual, damaging earthquake, each of these teensy little jiggles reduces the stored energy, making the "big one" less likely and (should it occur), less damaging, less severe.

If you want to worry, be wary that there are roads running near your home- they are vastly more likely to damage you, your loved ones and your property.

It cannot work to say, "It's ok for this to be done away from me..." - unless you're eager to adapt to life with profoundly higher energy costs and a remarkably reduced standard of living.
 
Lindberg said:
Again, this study concluded that injection wells, and to a lesser extent production of brine, contributed to the earthquakes. Not fracking. But thanks for posting that. I know one of the authors from way back and had no idea that's what he's doing now.
Click to expand...

I don't think you were supposed to point that out, because the anti-profit crowd has decided that fracking is bad therefore anything said that is bad about fracking, no matter how off target is good, and anyone that dares to disagree wants children to starve and drink dirty water, you know.... :goofy:
 
Last edited:
Quite a few articles recently about cracking in Oaklahoma which state that current increase in fracking has led to a large increase in earth quakes of a mild but substantial nature. Good reading if you can pull yourself away from faux news.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Quite a few articles recently about cracking in Oaklahoma which state that current increase in fracking has led to a large increase in earth quakes of a mild but substantial nature. Good reading if you can pull yourself away from faux news.
Click to expand...

Please post a link when you take a break from watching MSDNC. :D
 
According to Stephen Holditch, from Texas A&M in an article from the August 2012 American Institute of Chemical Engineers Page45, shale gas fracture treatment "does cause small microseismic events. The amount of energy released is equivalent to that of a gallon of milk falling off a counter and hitting the floor. These micorseismci events cannot be felt at the surface. They can, however, be measured with extremely sensitive geophones....Some very minor earthquakes have been associated with long-term water injection, mainly for water disposal. These earthquakes do not happen often, but when one does, simply stopping the injection prevents further earthquakes. ... however, these rare and small earthquakes have not been associated with hydraulic fracturing operations." On page 44 he identifies the Hydraulic fracture fluids to be 90.6 % water, 8.96 % Proppant (most common is sand), other .44% (Acid, Breaker, Bactercide/Biocide, Clay Stabilizar/Controller, Corrosion Inhibitor, Crosslinker, Friction Reducer, Gelling Agent, Iron Control Agent, Scale Inhibitor, Surfactant, pH-Adjusting Agent.) Other than the Acid at .11% all others are less than .08%.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I am sure it is but for 38 years, my reality has involved things not shaking.
Tornadoes, lightning, flooding, drought. I can deal. This is going to take some getting used to.
Click to expand...

Earthquakes are more fun and less hazardous to your life than those others. I've been through 3 large quakes, Loma Prieta, Big Bear, and Northridge, and bunch more small ones. Volcanoes are way scarier than Earthquakes. I was passing a few miles off of Krakatoa when it decided to belch a batch of glowing magma boulders into the sky, some of them came close enough that I altered course.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Quite a few articles recently about cracking in Oaklahoma which state that current increase in fracking has led to a large increase in earth quakes of a mild but substantial nature. Good reading if you can pull yourself away from faux news.
Click to expand...
Why should we believe your un-named source any more than we believe FOX.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top