CPO : A Pilot in Training : This is my Journey

cipio said:
Well...just saved some money there, then. ;-)
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I have many terabytes of POV video, over several years now, with replay XD 1080 camera mounted to my headset. No funny jello-wobbling, good quality video, captures everything I need to be able to relive my heli and fixed wing flying.
One nice thing about this mount is that I can hop in and out of the aircraft while taking the video, do a preflight, or a postflight, all in one continuum.
I have an external battery that supports many hours of video, and a separate digital audio recorder (with many hours capacity) that I hook up for ATC comms (adding in the POV cam audio as "ambient" audio).
Perfect? nothing ever is. But certainly more than acceptable for my needs.
 
Henning said:
This is not commonly true in GA aircraft, it depends on if the tail has more reserve AOA than the wing. Basically as long as the wing stalls first, the nose will always drop, because when the wing stalls the center of lift transfers to the tail which is far behind the CG.
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And once it recovers, it stalls again. Dynamic stability is also an issue, which can prevent or delay stall recovery, initiate stalls with no pilot input, or make stalls a whole helluva lot worse.

What is the reason behind the aft CG limit? It's not there for fun.

The tail always has more reserve AoA, as tailplane stalls are A LOT more serious.
 
MAKG1 said:
And once it recovers, it stalls again. Dynamic stability is also an issue, which can prevent or delay stall recovery, initiate stalls with no pilot input, or make stalls a whole helluva lot worse.

What is the reason behind the aft CG limit? It's not there for fun.

The tail always has more reserve AoA, as tailplane stalls are A LOT more serious.
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Only if you don't recover. It is not an unrecoverable situation. Correct on the tail plane always having more reserve AoA. There's actually an old Bonanza marketing picture where they have a full grown man in the very back, and the tail is obviously producing upward force by the camber of the ruddervators.
 
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Henning said:
This is not commonly true in GA aircraft, it depends on if the tail has more reserve AOA than the wing. Basically as long as the wing stalls first, the nose will always drop, because when the wing stalls the center of lift transfers to the tail which is far behind the CG.
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That's good to know. Glad the manufactures designed it as such. Thanks for sharing.
 
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Since the primary purpose of recording my flights is to learn from them...I going to start keeping track of things that I can do better next time. Some things I notice immediately, and some things I am sure others will point out. I'll try and keep this post up to date with observations from this video, keeping in mind that I cut out about an hour of video (pre-flight) and some to/from flight time.

Here's the list:

  • Trim! I did okay in cruise, but didn't trim in ascents and descents.
  • Take-off ground track was off...need to maintain heading on takeoff
  • Relax the ailerons as airspeed increases on takeoff - I turned into the wind, but didn't fade back towards level as speed increased...resulting in a bit of a turn to the right at the roll
  • Better attention to maintaining proper airspeed on the ascents. I need to pitch more than I think I do to keep that airspeed down.
  • Watch putting my hand back to the mixture knob rather than throttle.
  • More right rudder on takeoff


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This is flight lesson #2 for me in the C152. This was also my first take-off and landing. (The first lesson was way too windy for either.) It was still choppy today, particularly at pattern levels, but I assume this is just something that I'll be dealing with constantly.

We practiced some pattern work in prep for the first landing. I did my first power-off stall recovery. And then went back for the real landing. There was a lot of radio traffic, and lots of traffic to watch for in the airspace. I also learned out easy (and much) the heading indicator can get out of sync with the magnetic compass doing low-rpm work in this aircraft. It ended up 30 degrees off after our practice time.

Audio/video was better this time. I got the camera angle I was hoping for, and was able to record full video and audio without issue. I ended up putting a Wasabi extended battery on the GoPro, so there was nothing to worry about there. I also added a neutral density filter...so now the prop is blurred away. I like that much better. Now I just have to sort out the jello/resonance. It varies with different RPM settings.

 
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I didn't see you change trim. When ever you change speed, you should trim for that speed, that includes the 65 for climb out and 55 on final. Trim, trim, trim. Trim controls speed, throttle controls climb and descent. Trim is the key to everything you do in a plane.
 
Henning said:
I didn't see you change trim. When ever you change speed, you should trim for that speed, that includes the 65 for climb out and 55 on final. Trim, trim, trim. Trim controls speed, throttle controls climb and descent.
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Yep! Good call. I trimmed pretty consistently for cruise to/from, but not nearly as often as I should have for the ascent/descent practice time. That would probably help me maintain the magic 67KIAS a little better, rather than relying on my precise back pressure to keep the speed correct. Thanks!
 
BTW...you may have noticed from the videos, I decided to stick with the Serengeti Velocity sunglasses. After all of the testing and switching sunglasses day to day, I chose the Serengetis because:

1. They were lighter
2. They have better contrast
3. They excel in that weird low/light gray time of day over my other sunglasses
 
cipio said:
Yep! Good call. I trimmed pretty consistently for cruise to/from, but not nearly as often as I should have for the ascent/descent practice time. That would probably help me maintain the magic 67KIAS a little better, rather than relying on my precise back pressure to keep the speed correct. Thanks!
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If you are holding pressure on the yoke for a non transitional attitude, you're only screwing yourself. When you get to steep turns you'll also notice they go much better if you give it a couple of flicks nose up as you roll and dump them as you roll out.

Never use your muscles to do what the machine will do for you. Trim on speed is the key to landing well consistently. With trim, you don't maintain speed, the plane does. You're just there to act as guidance.
 
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People always seem to assume trim is about fatigue. It's a factor, as I found out Saturday flying a 172 that needed constant left aileron pressure and right rudder to fly straight and coordinated at the same time.

But the real point is precision. All servos, including meat servos, work better correcting a deviation rather than holding a zero point. We balance our telescope for the same reason.
 
I decided to keep the latest flight video post up to date with observations for improvement. The primary purpose of the video is to learn from it, so I want to keep track of things I can do better. If you see something, let me know. I am on this forum because I want to learn from others. Me + my CFI + you = education. :)


Here's the link back to the video post for a quick jump.

http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1755350&postcount=205
 
cipio said:
I decided to keep the latest flight video post up to date with observations for improvement. The primary purpose of the video is to learn from it, so I want to keep track of things I can do better. If you see something, let me know. I am on this forum because I want to learn from others. Me + my CFI + you = education. :)


Here's the link back to the video post for a quick jump.

http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1755350&postcount=205
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Good attitude, learning is really all on you, the CFI's primary function is to keep you from killing yourself, and hopefully from breaking the airplane, while you learn; you have to do all the work at the end of it all.

Remember, trim is about controlling the speed of the plane (kinetic energy)and power (mechanical energy) controls your vertical profile (potential energy). Set your speed/trim first, then adjust your power for anything except cruise performance.

All flying is about balancing those 3 energy sources.
 
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Henning is right, of course, about the trim. I would also note on take off that you are not coordinated. The ball is right of center. As you get more comfortable, you won't be so overwhelmed and you will be able to make the necessary corrections. With the ball out of center, two problems occur: 1) you are not flying as efficiently, and you are costing yourself performance, and 2) if you stall, you are subject to entering a spin.
 
You never really fly a plane, you coax it along to where you want to go and let the plane do all the flying. It is rare that you should ever need more effort than just 2 fingers can provide, and never for any extended period. Planes fly, pilots direct them where.
 
PPC1052 said:
I would also note on take off that you are not coordinated. The ball is right of center. spin.
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Too much right rudder? I was wondering about that myself. I was prepared to "need more right rudder than I think I will", but perhaps I was over prepared for that? ;-)
 
cipio said:
Too much right rudder? I was wondering about that myself. I was prepared to "need more right rudder than I think I will", but perhaps I was over prepared for that? ;-)
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If the ball is right of center, you need more right rudder.

It's the opposite of a yaw string. Step on the ball.

As you gain experience, you'll learn where you need the most. Basically, an extra bit on rotation, and a bit less but still elevated while climbing. If the rudder is trimmed for cruise, you'll need some left rudder during descent, but not as much because you're usually at low power.
 
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cipio said:
Too much right rudder? I was wondering about that myself. I was prepared to "need more right rudder than I think I will", but perhaps I was over prepared for that? ;-)
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Not enough, "Step on the Ball" Use that rudder, don't be afraid of it or any of the controls. Be smooth, be firm, and be positive. You don't have to be afraid of the control stops, go ahead and hit them if it's indicated, no worries.
 
Flying a plane is a lot like running a horse, you have to give it reign, but can't be afraid to do what you have to do to keep command of the overall situation; otherwise it's going to be a 'bad day'.:lol:
 
Henning said:
Not enough, "Step on the Ball" Use that rudder, don't be afraid of it or any of the controls. Be smooth, be firm, and be positive. You don't have to be afraid of the control stops, go ahead and hit them if it's indicated, no worries.
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This! I was hesitant to use the rudder pedals to the stops in the beginning even with my instructor telling me "to the stops", the airplane will not magically fall from the sky.
 
mikeinbama said:
This! I was hesitant to use the rudder pedals to the stops in the beginning even with my instructor telling me "to the stops", the airplane will not magically fall from the sky.
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Taking the yoke to the stops (any of them) continuously in a non-aerobatic plane is another story entirely. Except on the ground, of course.
 
cipio said:
Too much right rudder? I was wondering about that myself. I was prepared to "need more right rudder than I think I will", but perhaps I was over prepared for that? ;-)
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Also remember that every maneuver you learn involves the use of rudder. If your feet aren't moving you're going to have a tough time with maneuvers. Lazy feet can kill you.
 
MAKG1 said:
Taking the yoke to the stops (any of them) continuously in a non-aerobatic plane is another story entirely. Except on the ground, of course.
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Continuously does make it interesting.:rofl:

However if you are going into a steep turn, cranking that yoke to the stop then backing out to catch the bank angle and stabilizing while adding at least a half deflection of rudder, giving full throttle and adding 2 flicks of nose up trim makes for a damned crisp and positive entry that you can hold level without much additional pull at all. Start reversing the process 10° before your final heading.
 
Here's a question...the landing in that last video, as we were in flare, I was pulling back on the yoke and the stall horn was starting, we got a bit of an updraft and some quick lift. The instructor reached under and added a bit of power, and then pulled it back to idle. We didn't really get to talk about it because she had another student right after me.

I am told that this airport is kinda known for weird wind challenges like that, and that those runway gusts are pretty common. I assume I'll get more experience in them...but...

What's the reason for adding a bit of power in that little updraft? (It's at about 25:05 in the video)
 
cipio said:
Here's a question...the landing in that last video, as we were in flare, I was pulling back on the yoke and the stall horn was starting, we got a bit of an updraft and some quick lift. The instructor reached under and added a bit of power, and then pulled it back to idle. We didn't really get to talk about it because she had another student right after me.

I am told that this airport is kinda known for weird wind challenges like that, and that those runway gusts are pretty common. I assume I'll get more experience in them...but...

What's the reason for adding a bit of power in that little updraft? (It's at about 25:05 in the video)
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In short because you could drop like a rock back down to the runway.

If the extra airspeed was caused by say a quick 10 kt gust then equally you could lose 10 kts just as fast. If you were say at 15 feet above the runway right at stall speed when that gust went away you would essentially just fall back to the runway for a hard landing. Looks like she was trying to get a bit more airspeed and rewind the landing to just before the flare again.

With a big bump up like that it's often best to just go-around for another try rather than trying to save the landing, but if you have a long runway and gust wasn't too bad you could try a second touchdown. Certainly discuss with your instructor next time.

Certainly if there's any side movement in the gust that's an immediate go around since you don't want to be low and slow and then being blown sideways.
 
cipio said:
Here's a question...the landing in that last video, as we were in flare, I was pulling back on the yoke and the stall horn was starting, we got a bit of an updraft and some quick lift. The instructor reached under and added a bit of power, and then pulled it back to idle. We didn't really get to talk about it because she had another student right after me.

I am told that this airport is kinda known for weird wind challenges like that, and that those runway gusts are pretty common. I assume I'll get more experience in them...but...

What's the reason for adding a bit of power in that little updraft? (It's at about 25:05 in the video)
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Because landing is a timed balance of matching a deteriorating state of energy and contact with the ground. What happens in a gust that gains you altitude, is that it throws off that balance, and what the burst of throttle does is turns some mechanical energy into kinetic energy so you get back the energy state that you need from that altitude/phase of the round out/landing process.

If you don't add that burst of throttle, one of two things will happen, you will stall with excess altitude and "drop" in (you WILL do this at least once.:lol: As long as you are below 3' and hold nose high, you probably won't break a 152. ;)), or you will land on the nose wheel and set up a proposing event that if you allow to go more than two bounces normally will break the plane, so anytime you bounce the nose wheel, immediately give some throttle. If you aren't confident yet managing a small add to recover the landing, just throttle up, carb heat off, get it climbing, then clean it up and go around. Never let that nose wheel head for the third bounce. :nono: After that your chances of a successfully salvaging a landing or go around are on odds level with lotteries and miracles.
 
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Next flight ask to practice slow flight, and practice level, climbing, descending, turning, flight all with the stall warning horn blaring. Get used to the feel of the controls in that speed range, get comfortable with the feel of the plane and how you have to use the rudder as the primary turning control, and controlling your altitude with the throttle rather than pitch. Basically you hold the yoke still and fly the plane with the rudders and throttle. You have to be comfortable flying the plane next to the ground just above stall speed, because that is exactly what you have to do on landings.

One thing I notice a lot of people do is they quit flying the airplane after they hit their landing attitude in the flare. This actually works really well in benign conditions, however in a gusty crosswind leaves you in a bad state.
 
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Henning said:
If you don't add that burst of throttle, one of two things will happen, you will stall with excess altitude and "drop" in (you WILL do this at least once.:lol: As long as you are below 3' and hold nose high, you probably won't break a 152. ;)), or you will land on the nose wheel and set up a proposing event that if you allow to go more than two bounces normally will break the plane, so anytime you bounce the nose wheel, immediately give some throttle. If you aren't confident yet managing a small add to recover the landing, just throttle up, cab heat off, get it climbing, then clean it up and go around. Never let that nose wheel head for the third bounce. :nono: After that your chances of a successfully salvaging a landing or go around are on odds level with lotteries and miracles.
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i.e. Don't do this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMmHYWjEmkY :no:
 
I wish she wouldn't have corrected you on the mixture. That could have been a good lesson! :)
 
JasonM said:
I wish she wouldn't have corrected you on the mixture. That could have been a good lesson! :)
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Thankfully, you have to push the button to change the mixture (I assume without some hard tugging) or twist it. I'm hopeful I would have noticed that it doesn't easily move if I would have tried it! :)
 
cipio said:
Thankfully, you have to push the button to change the mixture (I assume without some hard tugging) or twist it. I'm hopeful I would have noticed that it doesn't easily move if I would have tried it! :)
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Correct, the Verneer style control requires pushing the button or turning it.
 
Step on the ball. If not, you risk a spin if you stall. Stall with a spin close to ground and there PROBABLY just isn't enough time to recover. Step on the ball.

I did some spin recovering for PPL and that was an eyebrow raiser for sure.

Smooth confident control inputs. You know when your getting it when your relaxing and using 1-2 fingers on the yoke in level TRIM flight. That's when the CFI will fail your engine.... Lol

Trim to remove the back pressure but don't fly with the trim. When in level flight (trimmed), with out manipulating the elevator control, an increase of rpm will take you up higher. When at your new altitude reduce your power back for level flight. Pull the power in anticipation of the new altitude. Same for descent except obviously you pull a bit of power instead. Eventually you'll know how much power to increase or decrease to get the desired vertical speed (VSI).

Oh I havnt flown in about ten years but I remember it all very clearly. Can't wait to sell my boat!

Good work CPO. Keep it up. You'll be going for $100 burger in no time!
 
Not bad for a first landing and takeoff.

During the approach, ALWAYS pitch for airspeed and throttle for altitude. If your airspeed is too low, pitch down. If it's too high, pitch up. If you're too low at a certain point during the approach, add power. If you're too high, reduce power.

One thing that helped me with landings was to pick an aiming point on the ground, usually the numbers, and then make small but IMMEDIATE corrections in order to keep that point absolutely fixed in your windscreen. If you feel like you are starting to sink(and your aiming point starts moving up in the windscreen) add enough power to halt the sink and resume on the desired approach slope. Conversely if you see the point begin to move down in your windscreen, reduce power and allow the plane to descend back onto the desired approach slope.

Also, don't let your airspeed get away from you. In the 152, I shoot for 80 abeam the numbers, 70 on base, and 60 for final(higher if there is wind shear/gusts). You should try to maintain +/- 3 knots or better with a steady 500fpm descent. Once you flare, like Henning states, don't stop flying the airplane!

Anyways, congrats on the first takeoff and landing, they are the most fun parts of a flight!
 
Those are good numbers for a 172. For a 152, 5 knots slower.

5 knots can make a LOT of difference.

Pitch for airspeed, throttle for altitude works fine until you start getting combinations. Which is, like, every time. Avoid making more than one change at a time. High and slow = pitch down, leave throttle alone (at least until the airspeed is right).
 
Nice video. Thanks for posting.

A tip for your next stall recovery. I heard your CFI say "push" during the recovery. It is typically less a push, and more a relaxing of back pressure.

I like your CFI's calm demeanor and measured, slow speaking and responses.

Nice work.
 
asechrest said:
Nice video. Thanks for posting.

A tip for your next stall recovery. I heard your CFI say "push" during the recovery. It is typically less a push, and more a relaxing of back pressure
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Exactly. All you have to do to recover from a stall is reduce the angle of attack. It doesn't necessarily mean having a nose low attitude.
 
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