Commercial XC - again...

ChemGuy

ChemGuy

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ChemGuy
OK. So I got my IR a few weeks ago. Now I am thinking of doing Commercial check ride next year, mostly for *****s and giggles.

1) I am flying solo from KRYY to C91 in S. Mi on Wed and returning on Sun. The straight line distance is ~480nm. That is over the 300nm required. If I land at 2 airports on the way, making sure #1 is >250nm away, ie north of Louisville, this flight up will meet the long commercial XC, correct?

2) I don't need an instructor sign off or under their supervision or anything for these flights correct?

3) For the 2hr XC >100nm on Saturday I flew solo from KRYY to HSV IFR and back I did KHSV to KCNI (cheaper fuel) and then back to KRYY. Total flight time for this was ~2.3 hours and each main leg was >100nm (114nm to HSV and 118NM to KCNI) Do these flights meet the requirement for the daytime 2 hr XC?

I am just making sure I have this all correct so I can knock this off requirement. I don't see any restriction on VFR or IFR for any of these XC so does that matter?

Thanks for the help on these,
 
1) Correct - except any of the landings can be 250nm away, not just the first one. They just want to make sure you get >250nm away from home.

2) Correct

3) Those are training flights, and need to be with an instructor.
 
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ChemGuy said:
OK. So I got my IR a few weeks ago. Now I am thinking of doing Commercial check ride next year, mostly for *****s and giggles.

1) I am flying solo from KRYY to C91 in S. Mi on Wed and returning on Sun. The straight line distance is ~480nm. That is over the 300nm required. If I land at 2 airports on the way, making sure #1 is >250nm away, ie north of Louisville, this flight up will meet the long commercial XC, correct?
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Yes.

ChemGuy said:
2) I don't need an instructor sign off or under their supervision or anything for these flights correct?
Click to expand...

Correct, but make sure it is logged as "solo" time.

ChemGuy said:
3) For the 2hr XC >100nm on Saturday I flew solo from KRYY to HSV IFR and back I did KHSV to KCNI (cheaper fuel) and then back to KRYY. Total flight time for this was ~2.3 hours and each main leg was >100nm (114nm to HSV and 118NM to KCNI) Do these flights meet the requirement for the daytime 2 hr XC?
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No, you need one with an instructor. Read carefully–that requirement is under the 61.129(a)(3) "training" requirement.

ChemGuy said:
I don't see any restriction on VFR or IFR for any of these XC so does that matter?
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I guess not. It used to say VFR, but they changed it.
 
thanks.

I missed that training part of the list. that's why I asked, reading legalese gub'mint stuff is not my strong suit.
 
ChemGuy said:
thanks.

I missed that training part of the list. that's why I asked, reading legalese gub'mint stuff is not my strong suit.
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(3) 20 hours of training ... that includes at least -
(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions...;
(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions ...​

is legalese?

Don't they teach outlining in 5th grade anymore? Or is it just a case of regophobia? It's pretty common.
 
The requirement is:

"One cross-country flight of not less than 300 nautical miles total distance, with landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is a straight-line distance of at least 250 nautical miles from the original departure point."

So none of the legs need to be any specific length. Both the 250nm straight line requirement and the 300nm total distance requirement will be met due to the fact the total straight line distance of your flight is greater than 300nm. You could break your 480nm trip down into three equal lengths of 160nm if you want.
 
What the others said.

But why not go further? Do you have any friends a couple states away? If you're actually getting your CPL to act as a CPL having a major XC will help. I flew across the country before my instrument, it's good ether way, just a thought.
 
midlifeflyer said:
(3) 20 hours of training ... that includes at least -

(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions...;

(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions ...​



is legalese?



Don't they teach outlining in 5th grade anymore? Or is it just a case of regophobia? It's pretty common.
Click to expand...


BTW, you can do the 2 hour cross country flights at the same time. Fly to someplace 2 hrs away in the early evening, stop for dinner, fly back home at night, 1 trip
 
midlifeflyer said:
(3) 20 hours of training ... that includes at least -
(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions...;
(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions ...​
is legalese?

Don't they teach outlining in 5th grade anymore? Or is it just a case of regophobia? It's pretty common.
Click to expand...

When you pull it up on a search some places don't have it laid out with all those nice line breaks. So it turns into a jumbled mess of (I)'s and (1)(v) etc.
 
midlifeflyer said:
(3) 20 hours of training ... that includes at least -
(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions...;
(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions ...​
is legalese?
Click to expand...

I find this requirement odd. By the time someone is into Commercial training, they should have far more than a 2 hour day and a 2 hour night XC. Are these flights required to be in the complex airplane? Or is it just for the CFI to make sure they understand how to manage long flights?
 
murphey said:
I find this requirement odd. By the time someone is into Commercial training, they should have far more than a 2 hour day and a 2 hour night XC. Are these flights required to be in the complex airplane? Or is it just for the CFI to make sure they understand how to manage long flights?
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Not required to be in a complex airplane. No one I've talked to (including a handful of DPEs) has any idea what the logic is behind that requirement.
 
midlifeflyer said:
(3) 20 hours of training ... that includes at least -
(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions...;
(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions ...​

is legalese?

Don't they teach outlining in 5th grade anymore? Or is it just a case of regophobia? It's pretty common.
Click to expand...
61.129 specifies both XC must be dual, at least 2 hr and at least 100 nm straight line.
 
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murphey said:
I find this requirement odd. By the time someone is into Commercial training, they should have far more than a 2 hour day and a 2 hour night XC. Are these flights required to be in the complex airplane? Or is it just for the CFI to make sure they understand how to manage long flights?
Click to expand...
The purported rationale is in the "areas of operations" language that appears throughout the training and experience requirement regs for certificates and ratings. IOW, a dual xc flight "on the areas of operations" listed in 61.127 is,at least in theory, different in terms of standards and quality than those listed in 61.107. It's identical to the reasoning behind the no double dip rules, such as not being able to use a long solo xc as a student pilot to satisfy the commercial long xc requirement.

BTW, keep in mind that the source of many of these rules, especially the commercial requirements, is ICAO not FAA.
 
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