CNN says you can flame out a jet engine flying through hurricane

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by AggieMike88, Sep 12, 2018.

  1. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2010
    Messages:
    15,567
    Location:
    Denton, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Now offering reverse discounts.
    did a satirical Grumman pilot switch a cue card?

     
    pigpenracing likes this.
  2. Greg Bockelman

    Greg Bockelman Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    9,363
    Location:
    Yona (Say Joan ya), Guam
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Greg Bockelman
    ROTFLMAOPIMP. “it doesn’t happen with a propeller plane...as much.”

    Wow. Doesn’t anyone do any research anymore? I wonder if he has a clue as to what drives the propeller on a “propeller” plane.

    Oh yeah. He doesn’t.
     
    Ravioli likes this.
  3. eman1200

    eman1200 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2013
    Messages:
    10,187
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    eman1200
    you don't have to do research when people will believe anything and everything they hear on the tele.
     
  4. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    2,888
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    So much wrong, in so few seconds. Outstanding.
     
  5. jordane93

    jordane93 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    8,589
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Jordan
  6. Half Fast

    Half Fast En-Route

    Joined:
    May 7, 2016
    Messages:
    2,724
    Location:
    Central Florida
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Half Fast
    C’mon, what do you expect from the Comedy News Network?
     
    CC268 and josephades like this.
  7. Ted DuPuis

    Ted DuPuis Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2007
    Messages:
    23,388
    Location:
    Paola, KS
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iBanYou
    It's a good thing the people who design this stuff don't get their learning from the news.
     
    Paul Allen likes this.
  8. texasclouds

    texasclouds Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2018
    Messages:
    258
    Location:
    Bryan, Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    And cnn talks boulsheet.
     
  9. Ryanb

    Ryanb Final Approach PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2010
    Messages:
    7,860
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Ryan
    Are you crazy? Doing research is waaay to much work!
     
  10. overdrive148

    overdrive148 En-Route

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2013
    Messages:
    3,225
    Location:
    Fort Worth, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    overdrive148
    "...57 miles per hour - if you want to go old school and fly through it in a propeller airplane, because they dont fly jets through these things they fly props, if you get a jet with the wind going the wrong way, you can get a flameout - that doesn't happen with the propeller planes... as much"
     
  11. Tantalum

    Tantalum Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    2,415
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    San_Diego_Pilot
    CNN is a raging joke
     
    josephades likes this.
  12. Pilawt

    Pilawt Final Approach

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    6,422
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Pilawt
    Yeah, the prop planes don't have the delicate flux capacitators like the jets do ...

    :confused:
     
    Ghery and X3 Skier like this.
  13. Matthew

    Matthew Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Messages:
    14,198
    Location:
    kojc, kixd, k34
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Matthew
    "Dammit, who typed a question mark on the TelePrompter? How many times do I have to tell you? Anything you type, Burgundy will read!"
     
    Ronbonjovi and Heftiger like this.
  14. Matthew

    Matthew Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Messages:
    14,198
    Location:
    kojc, kixd, k34
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Matthew
  15. Rushie

    Rushie Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2006
    Messages:
    1,761
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Rushie
  16. dmspilot

    dmspilot En-Route

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2006
    Messages:
    2,909
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    dmspilot
    You missed the best part.

    "Hurricane will be a like a Mike Tyson punch"

    Really? WTF does that mean!
     
  17. Pilawt

    Pilawt Final Approach

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    6,422
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Pilawt
    Dat's cwazy!
     
  18. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2010
    Messages:
    15,567
    Location:
    Denton, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Now offering reverse discounts.
    The movie "Idiocracy" was intended as a comedy... who knew it was gonna turn out as prophecy?
     
  19. Peter Anderson

    Peter Anderson Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Messages:
    100
    Location:
    NorCal
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    SVTPete83
    You would think after spending a full year covering the mh370 missing plane they would know how one works!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
     
  20. teejayevans

    teejayevans Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2013
    Messages:
    1,936
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Tom
    It’s completely understandable, planes aren’t used to high winds
     
  21. PPC1052

    PPC1052 En-Route

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2012
    Messages:
    3,964
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    PPC
    I am no expert in this area. Is there any truth to the idea that flying in a hurricane can cause a jet engine to flame out? I could certainly see ingestion of a large amount of rain at low idle (as you might set it for severe turbulence) might cause the flame to extinguish. Given that not all prop planes = piston engines, can the above happen to turboprops, even if not as often as it might in a jet? Thanks to those that know more for educating me on this topic.
     
  22. wayne

    wayne Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2007
    Messages:
    983
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    wayne
    CNN reporters can't accurately tell when the sun is up.
     
    X3 Skier likes this.
  23. Hacker

    Hacker Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Hacker
    Yes, if you dump enough water into the engine, it can flame out.

    And...if the wind is going the wrong way...well, yes, it can compressor stall in flight or hot start on the ground.
     
    jonnyjetprop likes this.
  24. Greg Bockelman

    Greg Bockelman Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    9,363
    Location:
    Yona (Say Joan ya), Guam
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Greg Bockelman
    All of this is true. But that wasn’t really the context of the news story.

    The point being that a turbine engine is turning a prop instead of a fan and is susceptible to the same issues.

    I am sure the hurricane hunters have been fortified to an extent for their mission but it is still a turbine engine running the show, so to speak.
     
  25. mscard88

    mscard88 Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Messages:
    23,226
    Location:
    Alabama
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    Go see Tyson and find out! It'll definitely be lights out for you. ;):)
     
  26. mscard88

    mscard88 Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Messages:
    23,226
    Location:
    Alabama
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    All true. Procedures call for continuous ignition ON so that helps.
     
  27. Hacker

    Hacker Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Hacker
    I was really more answering the question in post 21: "Is there any truth to the idea that flying in a hurricane can cause a jet engine to flame out?"

    Plus, the title of the thread is:
    CNN says you can flame out a jet engine flying through hurricane

    Which just happens to be true.

    I know of a C-17 that had a 4-engine flameout due to water ingestion while flying through a typhoon doing humanitarian evacuation.
     
    KA550 likes this.
  28. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2008
    Messages:
    10,664
    Location:
    DXO124009
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Light and Sporty Guy
  29. Ted DuPuis

    Ted DuPuis Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2007
    Messages:
    23,388
    Location:
    Paola, KS
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iBanYou
    Alright, turbine engine engineer here with a few clarifications.

    On a turbofan/turbojet engine, crosswinds tend to have a bigger impact on inlet pressures at the nacelle inlet. This can be how some of the crosswind limitations may be applied, and it's something that we have to test for during certification, basically making sure that the inlet pressure doesn't get low enough for a compressor stall which is a bad thing. Turbofans tend to be more susceptible to compressor stalls and there are a lot more systems involved in most of them to try to prevent them... various pressure relief valves, bypass valves, and variable geometry vanes on the stators for the compressor.

    Turboprops tend to be different in terms of design, enough such that compressor stalls can happen, but they pretty much don't. I think some of this has to do with not needing optimization for higher speeds like you do with a turbofan, and probably also something to do with not having a turbofan in front of the compressor. The propeller behaves differently than a fan (even though its function is essentially the same) and probably makes for more uniform air pressures in front of the compressor.

    With that said, the issues are during lower speeds and crosswind landings especially. The winds of a hurricane may be shifting a lot, but you're still moving forward at a significant speed. That report is just a load of crap by someone who doesn't have a clue what they're talking about.

    The hurricane hunter aircraft are fortified, but to my knowledge they aren't doing anything to change the overall behavior of the engine, it really has to do with making the plane itself tougher against hail etc.

    Oh, hail. That's the biggest reason I could see for using turboprops vs. turbofans. The props tend to be tougher, and easier to make tough against hail. Turbofans need to be tested against hail ingestion, but it's not the same.

    This is why I don't watch or listen to the news.
     
    labbadabba likes this.
  30. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    853
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    The thing to takeaway from this is how bad the news media gets things. We realize it in this case because we are knowledgeable in this area. So just remember that when watching any other news story.

    I really don't hold the media any more accountable than Hollywood. We all know how bad Hollywood gets things wrong in the name of entertainment, the media isn't much better.
     
    jspilot likes this.
  31. Ted DuPuis

    Ted DuPuis Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2007
    Messages:
    23,388
    Location:
    Paola, KS
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iBanYou
    The problem is, the current news media has turned into entertainment, rather than actual news. It's all about ratings, it's not about doing the job.
     
    MauleSkinner and EppyGA like this.
  32. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    853
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    I used to know guys that flew the Air Force Reserve C-130 Hurricane Hunters out of Keesler AFB. According to them, their aircraft are standard C-130s. The only provisions made are for the sensors and dropping buoys. Other than that, standard off the line C-130 from Lockheed.

    They also told stories of the damage they had taken on missions, including losing multiple engines due to hail damage to the oil coolers.
     
    Ted DuPuis likes this.
  33. Ted DuPuis

    Ted DuPuis Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2007
    Messages:
    23,388
    Location:
    Paola, KS
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iBanYou
    Interesting. I had heard different about the P-3s that NOAA uses. I'm not surprised a stock C-130 can take the abuse, those things are flying tanks.
     
  34. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2012
    Messages:
    8,031
    Location:
    Lincoln NE
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Brian
    Just apply the incredible lack of knowledge regarding everything related to aviation and apply that same startling lack of knowledge to most everything they report on.
     
    BrianNC and Hank S like this.
  35. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    853
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    I've seen the NOAA WP-3s. I know they have received unique modifications for the sensor platforms they are carrying, such as the UFO under the nose. I can't say definitively whether there are or are not any other airframe/engine mods, but I suspect very little was changed. Don't forget though, the P-3 shares a basic wing and engine design with the C-130.

    I know they try to plan their routes through the easier parts of the storm to avoid the heavy stuff, but we are talking about a hurricane. Even the not so bad areas can still be very nasty. Not a job I'm terribly envious of.
     
  36. FlySince9

    FlySince9 En-Route

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,576
    Location:
    Huntersville, NC
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Jerry
    wait... C-130...it has propellers but jet engines are turning them, right?
     
  37. Ted DuPuis

    Ted DuPuis Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2007
    Messages:
    23,388
    Location:
    Paola, KS
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iBanYou
    I'd sign up tomorrow.
     
  38. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    853
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    I just recall one story the crews told me about. Not sure if it was a "fishing" type story (fish gets bigger with each telling). On this particular mission they found their C-130 with two failed engines from hail damage, struggling to make it the 200 miles back to Miami on the remaining two, one of which had increasing oil temps due to a damaged oil cooler as well, and just making it into Homestead AFB.

    I can't vouch for the legitimacy of the "story", just that was one that was told to me. If true, sounds hairy to say the least. :p:eek:
     
  39. Zeldman

    Zeldman Final Approach

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2014
    Messages:
    9,652
    Location:
    NM or the emergency room...
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Billy
    But can their C-130 hold altitude when the fuel tanks are empty..??? :rofl::rofl:
     
    paflyer likes this.
  40. jordane93

    jordane93 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    8,589
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Jordan
    Only if they are on a flight plan on the tarmac and the black box is turned on.
     
    Zeldman and paflyer like this.