Cirrus SR20 or Bonanza V35A for commercial time building?

mohamedpac

mohamedpac

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Mohamedpac
Hey guys!

I'm new to the forum and aviation in general, but I'm excited to be a part of the POA community!

My basic question is whether flying a Cirrus SR20 or a Bonanza V35A will a) make me a better pilot by challenging me and b) be a better fit for me after I've gotten my multi/commercial and most of my training is behind me.

I recently received my single engine instrument rating and am loving my flight training so far. I'm based out of Dallas and usually fly out of Addison KADS.

I'm learning to fly as a hobby and definitely want to keep flying bigger and better things as I get more advanced in my training and readiness. As such, I've been spending a lot of time looking into what plane I'll want to buy/invest in whenever I receive my commercial and multi-engine ratings this summer.

Therefore, I want to fly in something a little more advanced than just a 172 or 172RG that's available at the flight schools. I've found two flying clubs I found that are willing to lease/rent out planes in my area, PlaneSmart! and PlaneSet. PlaneSmart! offers a Cirrus SR20 and PlanSet offers a Bonanza V35A.

I've asked several people for advice and I've gotten different answers on what would be the best plane to fly. This is an aircraft I'll get a lot of type-specific training in for insurance requirements and will fly over 100 hours in a few months, so I want to choose a plane that I can see myself flying in the future.

I've heard different things about the V-tail; some say it's safe, some wouldn't recommend it, even after my 25 hour training requirement for insurance. It's also very expensive compared to the SR20.

Alternatively, I've heard that the Cirrus isn't too advanced of an aircraft, and there's even a certain stigma around Cirrus pilots. I definitely want to fly something that will challenge me.

I'm going for a demo flight in the Cirrus in a week, but won't be able to do a demo flight in the Bonanza.

I'm really split! Both seem like beautiful aircraft with very different qualities. Previously, I was interested in buying a Bonanza or Mooney after I'm done training, but I'd be open to a Cirrus if it is the better and safer option.

Thanks for reading, I appreciate any and all advice for a new pilot!
 
A Travelair, Apache, Aztec, Baron, or 310 would be better. Multi time is what you want.
 
haha Did the Planeset guy actually get that off the ground??

He pitched something to me like unlimited flying for no hourly charges or something too good to be true

Cirrus is going to be more comfortable than the Bo.
And yes they are easy to fly.
And yes people are going to tell you why every chute pull could have an awesome landing had it been a real pilot in a different plane.

I think the Bo will be more challenging. Blue knob. Retracts. Missing the rudder :)
 
There's not really a 'right' answer. If you're going the multi route, you'll likely be detailing with retracts. In that case, might make sense to get used to putting the gear up and down (i.e the Bo).
 
How much are these programs charging? I would bet that you can build all your time in a Travelair or Apache for less than it will cost in the SR-20 or V-35A. The real question you need to answer first is "What do you want from aviation? What needs does it fill for you?" There's all sorts of planes, and all sorts of reasons to fly. Why limit yourself to any one choice? Why are you 'building time'? Are you looking at a carrier flying? If it's a hobby, building time is irrelevant, it's building experiences you are paying for. The reality is, to really get full value out of aviation as a hobby, I need access to at least 3 planes, and preferablely 5. There is no one plane that fills all the roles I have for planes.
 
Who cares what other people think? Some make fun of the cirrus because they can't have it. Pure jealousy. You're going to love it. Go for it! The Bo is so narrow your passengers will greatly appreciate the SR20.
 
bikert said:
Who cares what other people think? Some make fun of the cirrus because they can't have it. Pure jealousy. You're going to love it. Go for it! The Bo is so narrow your passengers will greatly appreciate the SR20.
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Guess it depends on how fat his passengers are.
 
bikert said:
Who cares what other people think? Some make fun of the cirrus because they can't have it. Pure jealousy. You're going to love it. Go for it! The Bo is so narrow your passengers will greatly appreciate the SR20.
Click to expand...

For the money I'd rather be in a Malibu where I can cruise at FL250 in comfort.
 
bikert said:
Who cares what other people think? Some make fun of the cirrus because they can't have it. Pure jealousy. You're going to love it. Go for it! The Bo is so narrow your passengers will greatly appreciate the SR20.
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Oh my.....I guess I need to inform my passengers next time of the narrowness of the cabin. :yikes::goofy:

btw....the SR20 is gonna be bout 15-20 kts slower. :rofl:
 
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SixPapaCharlie said:
I think the Bo will be more challenging. Blue knob. Retracts. Missing the rudder :)
Click to expand...

I thought we covered the knob issue this past Sunday. The Blue knob is no more difficult to work with than -ahem- your personal one.
 
This is out of my territory but the Bo is complex, would that not fit the OP's goals better than the Cirrus in this case? Would an employer like to see more complex time in your logbook? Just thinking out loud cause I don't know the answers:)
 
fiveoboy01 said:
This is out of my territory but the Bo is complex, would that not fit the OP's goals better than the Cirrus in this case? Would an employer like to see more complex time in your logbook? Just thinking out loud cause I don't know the answers:)
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ya but....how's he gonna build his chute time? :D :goofy:
 
mohamedpac said:
Hey guys!



I'm new to the forum and aviation in general, but I'm excited to be a part of the POA community!



My basic question is whether flying a Cirrus SR20 or a Bonanza V35A will a) make me a better pilot by challenging me and b) be a better fit for me after I've gotten my multi/commercial and most of my training is behind me.



I recently received my single engine instrument rating and am loving my flight training so far. I'm based out of Dallas and usually fly out of Addison KADS.



I'm learning to fly as a hobby and definitely want to keep flying bigger and better things as I get more advanced in my training and readiness. As such, I've been spending a lot of time looking into what plane I'll want to buy/invest in whenever I receive my commercial and multi-engine ratings this summer.



Therefore, I want to fly in something a little more advanced than just a 172 or 172RG that's available at the flight schools. I've found two flying clubs I found that are willing to lease/rent out planes in my area, PlaneSmart! and PlaneSet. PlaneSmart! offers a Cirrus SR20 and PlanSet offers a Bonanza V35A.



I've asked several people for advice and I've gotten different answers on what would be the best plane to fly. This is an aircraft I'll get a lot of type-specific training in for insurance requirements and will fly over 100 hours in a few months, so I want to choose a plane that I can see myself flying in the future.



I've heard different things about the V-tail; some say it's safe, some wouldn't recommend it, even after my 25 hour training requirement for insurance. It's also very expensive compared to the SR20.



Alternatively, I've heard that the Cirrus isn't too advanced of an aircraft, and there's even a certain stigma around Cirrus pilots. I definitely want to fly something that will challenge me.



I'm going for a demo flight in the Cirrus in a week, but won't be able to do a demo flight in the Bonanza.



I'm really split! Both seem like beautiful aircraft with very different qualities. Previously, I was interested in buying a Bonanza or Mooney after I'm done training, but I'd be open to a Cirrus if it is the better and safer option.



Thanks for reading, I appreciate any and all advice for a new pilot!
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Who says it has to be one or the other?

If commercial flying is potentially in your future, I'd recommend getting checked out in both. High performance and retract time is good, but total time is a bit more important. Since you say the Bonanza is considerably more expensive than the SR20, spend most of your time in the Cirrus and rent the Bo here and there for longer cross countries.

As a commercial pilot, you should be able to fly a variety of airplanes.
 
Eff all that...... Cessna 150/152 and fly the sheeeet out of it for practically nothing. Hours are hours. If you have a money tree, fly whatever you want and make it a turbine for that matter.
 
Wow! I'm blown away at all the great responses! Thanks a lot guys! Excited to be part of the community.

Several people asked me why I'm "limiting" myself to those two options. Something I neglected to say in my in my intro is that I am only interested in GA, not as a career or anything for pay. I am planning on purchasing a quick single engine aircraft, like a Mooney, Bonanza or Cirrus in a year or two after I have my commercial and feel proficient enough to handle one.

Thus, as I am currently knocking out hours to get to my commercial 250 number (I have 130 hours so far), I wanted to fly a lot of it in a type of aircraft that I will actually buy fairly soon so that I will have the proficiency and insurance hours. Since joining the club is quite a monetary investment, I kind of feel that I'm choosing which plane I'll be flying in the future now since I can't afford to just join two clubs. I'm planning on getting my multi but not planning on actually getting a twin aircraft since I've read they're less economical.

One thing that wasn't addressed is the thoughts on a V tail; many people have told me they're dangerous. Thoughts?
 
Whatever is cheaper, no one will care.

The only exception would be to build all your time in a

Tailwheel
Seaplane
Multi

Everything else is all the same.



Now if you're buying one, fly each for a few hours and see which one is the most fun/most mission capable FOR YOU.

If it were me, our of your list, is get a IO550ed V tail Bo, I mean if you're going to get a Bo I don't understand why your would get the real one.

As for the dangerous, meh, only if you can't handle the plane, frankly I wouldn't consider it dangerous at all.
 
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Fly the the V-tail and respect the maneuvering speeds and you'll never even know it's back there.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
This is out of my territory but the Bo is complex, would that not fit the OP's goals better than the Cirrus in this case? Would an employer like to see more complex time in your logbook? Just thinking out loud cause I don't know the answers:)
Click to expand...

No, they want to see multi, SE is SE. Now a SE job counts somewhat differently in that it is work experience, but unless it's turbine time, they don't really care what SEL you fly. Personally I say use both, and whatever else you can find to fly.
 
I'm happy to see a thread where a Bo isn't the only allowable answer :)
 
James331 said:
Whatever is cheaper, no one will care.

The only exception would be to build all your time in a

Tailwheel
Seaplane
Multi

Everything else is all the same.



Now if you're buying one, fly each for a few hours and see which one is the most fun/most mission capable FOR YOU.

If it were me, our of your list, is get a IO550ed V tail Bo, I mean if you're going to get a Bo I don't understand why your would get the real one.

As for the dangerous, meh, only if you can't handle the plane, frankly I wouldn't consider it dangerous at all.
Click to expand...

Really? I've been told that insurance would require me to have at least 25 hours of time in a Bonanza before they will insure me, so I have to pay a CFI to fly me for those hours. That has been a big part of my consideration.
 
mohamedpac said:
Really? I've been told that insurance would require me to have at least 25 hours of time in a Bonanza before they will insure me, so I have to pay a CFI to fly me for those hours. That has been a big part of my consideration.
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Figure out which one you want, fly in it with a EXPERIENCED CFI till you're proficient, I wouldn't worry about PPL vs CPL.

If you're looking at these class of planes PPL + IFR would really be the biggest thing you need.

Once you're good to go, if you still have CFI time you need to burn off, find a low time CFI who wants some Bo time and you probably can would a good deal.

Shop the insurance around.
AVEMCO, AOPA, AIR POWER
 
mohamedpac said:
Wow! I'm blown away at all the great responses! Thanks a lot guys! Excited to be part of the community.

Several people asked me why I'm "limiting" myself to those two options. Something I neglected to say in my in my intro is that I am only interested in GA, not as a career or anything for pay. I am planning on purchasing a quick single engine aircraft, like a Mooney, Bonanza or Cirrus in a year or two after I have my commercial and feel proficient enough to handle one.

Thus, as I am currently knocking out hours to get to my commercial 250 number (I have 130 hours so far), I wanted to fly a lot of it in a type of aircraft that I will actually buy fairly soon so that I will have the proficiency and insurance hours. Since joining the club is quite a monetary investment, I kind of feel that I'm choosing which plane I'll be flying in the future now since I can't afford to just join two clubs. I'm planning on getting my multi but not planning on actually getting a twin aircraft since I've read they're less economical.

One thing that wasn't addressed is the thoughts on a V tail; many people have told me they're dangerous. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Biased, I am, as I own a V35A, based at Addison - and I'd be glad to take you for a flight, but cannot so do until my engine is installed. Hopefully right after January 1...

...the Bonanza is a very safe airplane; there was a "spate" of accidents in the distant past, which generally centered around the operation of the aircraft outside its allowable performance envelope on airframes with a revised design for the V-tail, but a structural mod to the V-tail resolved that particular issue.

The Bos are also exceptionally sweet to fly, and have enough additional challenge in operations to help develop your skills (or so says I).

Suggestion above for membership in the RFC club was very good- there is no better place to get time in such capable aircraft as the RFC Flying Club, and they have three (3) F33A Bonanzas (admittedly, with the "Piper tail," but still...). You can qualify for the Bos with 10 hours dual, and there are some extremely good instructors at RFC.

And, I hasten to add, none of that is a dig at the Cirrri, which are and remain great aircraft - but SR20 time would not count as "high-performance" in your logbook- and PlaneSmart costs are eye-watering.
 
mohamedpac said:
Wow! I'm blown away at all the great responses! Thanks a lot guys! Excited to be part of the community.

Several people asked me why I'm "limiting" myself to those two options. Something I neglected to say in my in my intro is that I am only interested in GA, not as a career or anything for pay. I am planning on purchasing a quick single engine aircraft, like a Mooney, Bonanza or Cirrus in a year or two after I have my commercial and feel proficient enough to handle one.

Thus, as I am currently knocking out hours to get to my commercial 250 number (I have 130 hours so far), I wanted to fly a lot of it in a type of aircraft that I will actually buy fairly soon so that I will have the proficiency and insurance hours. Since joining the club is quite a monetary investment, I kind of feel that I'm choosing which plane I'll be flying in the future now since I can't afford to just join two clubs. I'm planning on getting my multi but not planning on actually getting a twin aircraft since I've read they're less economical.

One thing that wasn't addressed is the thoughts on a V tail; many people have told me they're dangerous. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Biased, I am, as I own a V35A, based at Addison - and I'd be glad to take you for a flight, but cannot so do until my engine is installed. Hopefully right after January 1...

...the Bonanza is a very safe airplane; there was a "spate" of accidents in the distant past, which generally centered around the operation of the aircraft outside its allowable performance envelope on airframes with a revised design for the V-tail, but a structural mod to the V-tail resolved that particular issue.

The Bos are also exceptionally sweet to fly, and have enough additional challenge in operations to help develop your skills (or so says I).

Suggestion above for membership in the RFC club was very good- there is no better place to get time in such capable aircraft as the RFC Flying Club, and they have three (3) F33A Bonanzas (admittedly, with the "Piper tail," but still...). You can qualify for the Bos with 10 hours dual, and there are some extremely good instructors at RFC.

And, I hasten to add, none of that is a dig at the Cirrri, which are and remain great aircraft - but SR20 time would not count as "high-performance" in your logbook- and PlaneSmart costs are eye-watering.
 
Dont pay rent for 250 hrs. Buy the plane you need for your flying, get your instrument rating in it. So if you need an A36 or SR22 with AC to fly the family, huy it now. The extra cost of insurance will be less than two months of planesense or 10-15 hours of rentals.
 
mohamedpac said:
Really? I've been told that insurance would require me to have at least 25 hours of time in a Bonanza before they will insure me, so I have to pay a CFI to fly me for those hours. That has been a big part of my consideration.
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I just purchased a V35B two months ago and I had no prior time in a bonanza with only around 60-70 retract (most my time was in fixed gear Tiger) and an instrument rating.

The only insurance requirement for me was 2hr dual with CFI having more than 25hr in V35 and no passengers until after 5hr logged as PIC.

Rates were pretty reasonable too.

I think this was London Aviation (thru AOPA)
 
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mohamedpac said:
One thing that wasn't addressed is the thoughts on a V tail; many people have told me they're dangerous. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Planes in general can be dangerous and I if they are referring to the tail falling off then do some home work and read up on the underlying causes of the earlier accidents.

I have about 40 hours in my newly purchased V35B and I have to say compared to Grumman Tiger the plane feels very solid in IFR and is quite predictable. I am also very impressed with cross wind and shortfield landings which I questioned how the vtail would handle.

Landed 22kt gusting to 28kt 80deg off the nose and still had a fair amount of rudder left, and I am able to set her down with around 800ft ground roll (and Im not even trying that hard yet).

So in my opinion (although biased) the plane is actually more capable/stable than the planes I was flying so I would say less dangerous not more.:dunno:
 
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SCCutler said:
Biased, I am, as I own a V35A, based at Addison - and I'd be glad to take you for a flight, but cannot so do until my engine is installed. Hopefully right after January 1...

...the Bonanza is a very safe airplane; there was a "spate" of accidents in the distant past, which generally centered around the operation of the aircraft outside its allowable performance envelope on airframes with a revised design for the V-tail, but a structural mod to the V-tail resolved that particular issue.

The Bos are also exceptionally sweet to fly, and have enough additional challenge in operations to help develop your skills (or so says I).

Suggestion above for membership in the RFC club was very good- there is no better place to get time in such capable aircraft as the RFC Flying Club, and they have three (3) F33A Bonanzas (admittedly, with the "Piper tail," but still...). You can qualify for the Bos with 10 hours dual, and there are some extremely good instructors at RFC.

And, I hasten to add, none of that is a dig at the Cirrri, which are and remain great aircraft - but SR20 time would not count as "high-performance" in your logbook- and PlaneSmart costs are eye-watering.
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Thanks for the offer! I'd love to go up with you sometime! I'll PM you so we can exchange info.

I took a look at RFC, and their rates are indeed very reasonable; I've sent them an email and am waiting on a response. However, I've read that there's over 100 members that fly 5 airplanes; I don't know much about flying clubs, but doesn't that seem like a high number? I'd be worried I wouldn't get to access the aircraft very much.
 
mohamedpac said:
I took a look at RFC, and their rates are indeed very reasonable; I've sent them an email and am waiting on a response. However, I've read that there's over 100 members that fly 5 airplanes; I don't know much about flying clubs, but doesn't that seem like a high number? I'd be worried I wouldn't get to access the aircraft very much.
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How active are those 100 members? That is the big question to ask.

I am a member of a club with over 1000 members and around 50 airplanes, which is about the same pilot to plane ratio. 20 pilots per plane. The vast majority of those 1000 members are not regularly active/frequent flyers, so there is almost always an airplane available. Many are people like me who live on the opposite side of the country and may only fly a couple times a year.
 
Fearless Tower said:
How active are those 100 members? That is the big question to ask.

I am a member of a club with over 1000 members and around 50 airplanes, which is about the same pilot to plane ratio. 20 pilots per plane. The vast majority of those 1000 members are not regularly active/frequent flyers, so there is almost always an airplane available. Many are people like me who live on the opposite side of the country and may only fly a couple times a year.
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No way that would work if you want to use a plane to travel cross country (imagine that), and if most are VFR, depending on where you live, potential flying days are limited, especially weekends.
 
teejayevans said:
No way that would work if you want to use a plane to travel cross country (imagine that), and if most are VFR, depending on where you live, potential flying days are limited, especially weekends.
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No way what would work?

The example I gave is a real world club in San Diego: Plus One Flyers, look it up. I'm a member. I live in Virginia. I made a couple cross country trips from San Diego this past year. Many members don't even live in the US- they come here and rent a plane once or twice a year.
 
Fearless Tower said:
No way what would work?

The example I gave is a real world club in San Diego: Plus One Flyers, look it up. I'm a member. I live in Virginia. I made a couple cross country trips from San Diego this past year. Many members don't even live in the US- they come here and rent a plane once or twice a year.
Click to expand...


How would that work? With larger clubs it may work, but if you have only 5 planes and 1-2 members take week long trips during a holiday week, you got 98 members fighting over 3 planes? Maybe there is a large segment that flys so infrequently, I don't understand it, why bother if only flying 1-2 times a year.
 
mohamedpac said:
Wow! I'm blown away at all the great responses! Thanks a lot guys! Excited to be part of the community.

Several people asked me why I'm "limiting" myself to those two options. Something I neglected to say in my in my intro is that I am only interested in GA, not as a career or anything for pay. I am planning on purchasing a quick single engine aircraft, like a Mooney, Bonanza or Cirrus in a year or two after I have my commercial and feel proficient enough to handle one.

Thus, as I am currently knocking out hours to get to my commercial 250 number (I have 130 hours so far), I wanted to fly a lot of it in a type of aircraft that I will actually buy fairly soon so that I will have the proficiency and insurance hours. Since joining the club is quite a monetary investment, I kind of feel that I'm choosing which plane I'll be flying in the future now since I can't afford to just join two clubs. I'm planning on getting my multi but not planning on actually getting a twin aircraft since I've read they're less economical.

One thing that wasn't addressed is the thoughts on a V tail; many people have told me they're dangerous. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Go to www.beechtalk.com, register, and ask your question there.

Bob Gardner
 
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