Circling approach protected area

ArrowFlyer86

ArrowFlyer86

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While conducting a practice circling approach in VFR conditions we had to extend our downwind leg portion for landing traffic. During that time I realized that I don't know exactly how far out the protected area extends for a circling approach. I realized I should probably learn that :)

Now I want to see if I'm interpreting protected area correctly in conjunction with the approach plate below it.

If I'm doing a LOC 2 approach with a DME onboard and can identify the CETAN fix, and I want to circle to RWY09, my circling MDA for a class-A aircraft is 1360'. That would mean 1.3nm of protected space b/c I'd use the standard circling approach maneuvering radius? If I saw the "C" symbol as shown in reference #2, then I'd use the expanded chart?

upload_2022-12-15_19-0-38.png

The approach:
upload_2022-12-15_19-1-11.png

Reference #2: This is the "C" that would indicate an expanded protected area?
upload_2022-12-15_19-11-2.png

EDIT: used wrong runway designation in my initial one
 
Tom Wells said:
While conducting a practice circling approach in VFR conditions we had to extend our downwind leg portion for landing traffic. During that time I realized that I don't know exactly how far out the protected area extends for a circling approach. I realized I should probably learn that :)
Click to expand...
If the Class D area is below VFR minimums the tower cannot extend your downwind, FWIW. That got added to the controller's "bible" in 1972, because it could cause you to leave CTL TERPs protected area.
 
aterpster said:
If the Class D area is below VFR minimums the tower cannot extend your downwind, FWIW. That got added to the controller's "bible" in 1972, because it could cause you to leave CTL TERPs protected area.
Click to expand...
What would they normally do if they couldn't clear you for landing, but also couldn't extend your downwind?
 
aterpster said:
If the Class D area is below VFR minimums the tower cannot extend your downwind, FWIW. That got added to the controller's "bible" in 1972, because it could cause you to leave CTL TERPs protected area.
Click to expand...
The reported weather, whether the ‘field’ is IFR or VFR, does not matter. They aren’t supposed to do it. The METAR could be reporting a 1000 and 3 and a plane circling could be in the goo. You remember that 1972 explicitly. Was there an incident that led to it?
4−8−6. CIRCLING APPROACH
a. Circling approach instructions may only be given for aircraft landing at airports with operational control towers.
b. Include in the approach clearance instructions to circle to the runway in use if landing will be made on a runway other than that aligned with the direction of instrument approach. When the direction of the circling maneuver in relation to the airport/runway is required, state the direction (eight cardinal compass points) and specify a left or right base/downwind leg as appropriate.
PHRASEOLOGY−
CIRCLE TO RUNWAY (number), or
CIRCLE (direction using eight cardinal compass points) OF THE AIRPORT/RUNWAY FOR A LEFT/RIGHT BASE/DOWNWIND TO RUNWAY (number).
NOTE−
Where standard instrument approach procedures (SIAPs) authorize circling approaches, they provide a basic minimum of 300 feet of obstacle clearance at the MDA within the circling area considered. The dimensions of these areas, expressed in distances from the runways, vary for the different approach categories of aircraft. In some cases a SIAP may otherwise restrict circling approach maneuvers.
Approach Clearance Procedures
c. Do not issue clearances, such as “extend downwind leg,” which might cause an aircraft to exceed the circling approach area distance from the runways within which required circling approach obstacle clearance is assured.
 
aterpster said:
If the Class D area is below VFR minimums the tower cannot extend your downwind, FWIW. That got added to the controller's "bible" in 1972, because it could cause you to leave CTL TERPs protected area.
Click to expand...

Which begs the question why a circle to land to a runway with another aircraft on approach was ever approved.
 
Clip4 said:
Which begs the question why a circle to land to a runway with another aircraft on approach was ever approved.
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If there is Radar Coverage to the ground, very nearly to ground actually, I don’t remember the exact number, and Radar Procedures are used, more than one aircraft at a time can be Cleared for Approach.

f. Except when applying radar procedures, timed or visual approaches, clear an aircraft for an approach to an airport when the preceding aircraft has landed or canceled IFR flight plan.
 
Tom Wells said:
What would they normally do if they couldn't clear you for landing, but also couldn't extend your downwind?
Click to expand...
Miss approach. When the airport is below VFR minimums you have both a regulatory and safety obligation to remain within CTL protected airspace. If unable you go miss, as set forth in the AIM.
 
luvflyin said:
If there is Radar Coverage to the ground, very nearly to ground actually, I don’t remember the exact number, and Radar Procedures are used, more than one aircraft at a time can be Cleared for Approach.

f. Except when applying radar procedures, timed or visual approaches, clear an aircraft for an approach to an airport when the preceding aircraft has landed or canceled IFR flight plan.
Click to expand...
Non-towered airports are one in, one out for IFR. Airports with VFR towers are the same.
 
aterpster said:
Non-towered airports are one in, one out for IFR. Airports with VFR towers are the same.
Click to expand...
There are ways traffic can be kept moving at VFR Towers. Here’s one example. There are other ways. Approach could tell the Tower a departure can be released if it is off before an Arrival gets to the FAF.

d. If the nonapproach control tower controller states to the radar controller that they will provide visual separation between arrivals, departures/ar- rivals and/or successive departures, and states the call signs of all aircraft involved, the radar controller can approve the application of visual separation as requested.
PHRASEOLOGY−
VISUAL SEPARATION APPROVED and for departing/succeeding aircraft, (ACIDs) RELEASED
NOTE−
A nonapproach control tower by accepting authorization for visual separation becomes responsible for ensuring that separation. Separation of IFR aircraft before and after
application of visual separation is an IFR control function that must be applied by the Approach/Departure/En Route facility. Separation requirements also apply to VFR aircraft when IFR, Class B, Class C or TRSA separation services are required.
 
luvflyin said:
If there is Radar Coverage to the ground, very nearly to ground actually, I don’t remember the exact number, and Radar Procedures are used, more than one aircraft at a time can be Cleared for Approach.

f. Except when applying radar procedures, timed or visual approaches, clear an aircraft for an approach to an airport when the preceding aircraft has landed or canceled IFR flight plan.
Click to expand...

Within 1/2 mile from end of runway.
 
At this airport, there isn't a tower. Airspace is G 700 AGL and below, above is E. During the daytime, VFR is allowed anytime CTL is allowed. So there may be VFR aircraft in the pattern when the pilot chooses to CTL. There is not tower asking you to extend downwind, the only reason you might need to extend downwind is for VFR traffic. It is one in-one-out for IFR operations so there should not be any IFR traffic.
 
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