Chevy Volt

flyingron said:
In actuality, the earlier Volts though they tell you to put premium fuel in them, don't give a darn as to octane. This was done because they feared deterioration of the fuel if it sat.
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Hmmm... That's not what GM has had to say on multiple occasions.


https://www.cars.com/articles/2010/08/does-the-chevy-volt-require-premium-fuel-yes-and-no/

Premium gas will maximize the fuel economy when the engine is used, GM powertrain spokesman Tom Read said. In an emergency, regular gas can be used on the Volt, but fuel economy will be compromised, and the engine may become noisier. The Chevy Volt’s engine computer will detect the octane change and retard ignition timing. Still, Read highly recommends refilling the Volt's tank with premium fuel as soon as possible to avoid damaging the engine. ​

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2010/07...tatement-about-volt-premium-fuel-requirement/

"Utilizing state-of-the-art technology, the Volt is capable of driving 40 miles on battery power alone. For longer trips additional electricity is supplied by a 1.4L internal combustion engine generator.

This unique architecture of the Volt causes the engine to act more like a generator. As such, premium fuel is required to maximize fuel efficiency. The use of premium fuel in the Volt increases fuel efficiency by five percent or greater over the use of regular fuel. Simply put, premium fuel optimizes this engine’s characteristics.”​

https://www.autoblog.com/2014/10/29/2016-chevy-volt-will-not-need-premium-gas/

"Buried in the new technical details of the 2016 Chevy Volt released yesterday was a throwaway line about a small but important change that's due to the new 1.5-liter, four-cylinder engine. The first-gen Volt has always required premium gas but the new powerplant will be happy burning plain old regular.

The Volt's chief engineer, Andrew Farah, told AutoblogGreen that the change was due to today's Volt owners explaining they were not happy paying for top-shelf petroleum. "The ability to use regular unleaded was based directly on customer feedback," he said. "Since the range extender is an all-new engine, it was optimized to use regular unleaded at the outset. Using regular fuel will not have effect on vehicle acceleration or other performance factors.""​
 
There's no economy hit. Octane was not an issue. The issue was they were concerned that people would (and they do) leave the gas sit for extended periods in the car while driving it exclusively on electric.

Nearly all cars have knock sensors and will run on lower octane than they require with performance loss, but that's not an issue with the Volt. I run regular if I'm on an extended trip where I'll be burning gas. I fill up with premium at home when I rarely use gas.
 
tspear said:
You need to drive more :D
Payback for a co-worker who goes 60 miles each way was less than two years when comparing the Chevy Bolt to a new Civic he was considering, even with New England energy prices.
Based on the fact I am doing around 8K miles a year now, and my Subaru is paid off, and only has about 50K miles on it, the payback is probably never.

Tim
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Or somebody needs to move closer to work. Sixty miles each way?! :eek:

I drive 10 miles each way. I typically fill up my car's tank every other week. For me the price of gas is just something to complain about like the weather. I rarely drive far. A long drive for me is 36 miles to my parents or ~40 miles to LZU. For trips we fly.

Yeah, my driving is probably a perfect fit for an electric car. That's not enough fun though. I drive a Mustang convertible with a manual transmission.
 
flyingron said:
There's no economy hit. Octane was not an issue. The issue was they were concerned that people would (and they do) leave the gas sit for extended periods in the car while driving it exclusively on electric.

Nearly all cars have knock sensors and will run on lower octane than they require with performance loss, but that's not an issue with the Volt. I run regular if I'm on an extended trip where I'll be burning gas. I fill up with premium at home when I rarely use gas.
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Why do you believe that premium fuel doesn't go bad if it sits just like regular does?
 
flyingron said:
There's no economy hit. Octane was not an issue. The issue was they were concerned that people would (and they do) leave the gas sit for extended periods in the car while driving it exclusively on electric.

Nearly all cars have knock sensors and will run on lower octane than they require with performance loss, but that's not an issue with the Volt. I run regular if I'm on an extended trip where I'll be burning gas. I fill up with premium at home when I rarely use gas.
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I understand how knock sensors work, and the risks of running engines at octanes below what they were designed for.

Do you have a source on how the Volt engine octane / performance limits were established? All I saw when I was digging in were anecdotal forum posts.

I’ll set the shelf life comment aside.
 
It's what I was told over on the volt forums and I've not really noticed any difference in 4 years of driving mine on various octanes.
 
Dav8or said:
Why do you believe that premium fuel doesn't go bad if it sits just like regular does?
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I don't believe anything. This is what I was told from GM internals on the volt forum.
 
flyingron said:
I don't believe anything. This is what I was told from GM internals on the volt forum.
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Likely a generalization. In many parts of the country, premium fuel has less to no ethanol compared to regular gas. Therefore, you end up with a more stable fuel do to the lack of ethanol.
Back when i lived in TN, a local pilot who flew on mogas told me the specific reason premium was excused and it related to the EPA clean air act. But I cannot recall the details.

note: this is all third party info, I have not researched or verified!

Tim
 
Life is waaaay too short to drive economy cars, no QOL in that.
 
JOhnH said:
I know quite few people that drive old, cheap, "economy" cars so that they can afford to fly an old airplane.
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There are better options.

Even as a poor kid in flight school for like 4K I had a jacked up Subaru, ugly as sin but I engine swapped it and it was a riot to drive.
 
JOhnH said:
I know quite few people that drive old, cheap, "economy" cars so that they can afford to fly an old airplane.
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That was my explanation for years. I drove a 12 year old car so I could afford to fly a 50 year old airplane.
 
I actually enjoy driving the Volt. Acceleration is good, the quiet sound of electric is cool, it’s neat to see how efficiently you can drive it and the styling (gen 1) ain’t bad.

There’s actually quite a cult following with owners. I’m a FB member and there’s some hardcore Volt folks out there.
 
wayne said:
Yeah, my driving is probably a perfect fit for an electric car. That's not enough fun though. I drive a Mustang convertible with a manual transmission.
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Not enough fun? You've never driven an electric car, have you?

Even the Leaf is peppy and fun compared to most gas cars. I have a LOT of fun with my current EV, which is one of these:

2017-bmw-i3-ev-test-review-car-and-driver-photo-693636-s-original.jpg


My favorite thing to do with it is pull up next to a Mustang, which may have a manual transmission, at a stop light, look at them as they give me a derisive look because I'm driving something that looks like a suppository wearing a tuxedo, and then leave them in the dust when the light turns green. :D

The i3 is BMW's fastest car from 0-30. I think the i8 is probably the fastest 0-60.

These would be even more fun:

20-tesla-model-3-2018-review-otr-topleft_1.jpg
Tesla_Model_X_Family_Car.jpg
 
JOhnH said:
I know quite few people that drive old, cheap, "economy" cars so that they can afford to fly an old airplane.
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I hear that the money spent flying an old airplane is enough to fund a Ferrari.
 
wayne said:
Does the top go down?
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That was my wife's complaint. In fact, it was her Audi A4 Cabriolet I drove to the Audi officers when they had me test drive the Tesla.
I think the Tesla S has a very large sliding roof available. Listening to some of the ex-Tesla software engineers is scary, however. If you think the fit-and-finish issues are concerning, the absolute lack of any sort of software management discipline is even more so.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
My favorite thing to do with it is pull up next to a Mustang, which may have a manual transmission, at a stop light, look at them as they give me a derisive look because I'm driving something that looks like a suppository wearing a tuxedo, and then leave them in the dust when the light turns green. :D

The i3 is BMW's fastest car from 0-30. I think the i8 is probably the fastest 0-60.
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Most Mustangs are automatic; I was searching for a manual and it took some work as there are not many.

Most people can't start moving at a green light for cr@p. I used to regularly get across an intersection before a Corvette was across the line in my Chrysler convertible LeBaron. Most Corvettes have an automatic transmission. They'd smoke the LeBaron in a 1/4 mile, if the driver had even the smallest clue of what to do, but couldn't get it moving very quickly; wasn't the car's fault. They'd sit there with their right foot on the brake until the light turned green. :rolleyes: Meanwhile my engine was running well above idle and I was just waiting to get off the clutch pedal.

Yes, I know electric motors have lots of torque, so they accelerate very well. Doesn't mean the car is fun to drive though, but the acceleration may feel good. I love the Mustang because it's a convertible, but the BMW 328i I had before was a better handling car. I can't imagine the i3 is even remotely in that class of handling, with the narrow frame and skinny tires.
 
JOhnH said:
I know quite few people that drive old, cheap, "economy" cars so that they can afford to fly an old airplane.
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That's not the only reason, tiny parking spaces is another great one. I really don't give a crap if my car gets scratched, dinged, etc. People with really nice cars park farther away, makes it easier for me.

My dad was at the body shop the other day (town is 800 people so typical super small town) and the guy was saying they just spent almost $2000 on a freaking headlight housing and new bulb for a Mustang! That didn't include the bumper cover, grill and labor to fix the car. No thanks.
 
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For some unknown reason, gasoline prices went up 15 cents yesterday. That's another reason I like driving electric, I'm tired of the shenanigans going on in the gasoline marketplace. Electric rates don't go up just because some oil sheik sneezes or the weather in the Gulf of Mexico looks questionable.
 
As I posted about my driving speeds earlier. What I notice is (Our family car is a Toyota Sienna Minivan) that people HATE being passed by either our Prius or Minivan. Its like they have a complex or something. 95% of the time on i10, when I go to pass someone, they notice the car and speed up. So I get back into the lane behind them and they slow down. Then I have to pass them for real.
 
wayne said:
I can't imagine the i3 is even remotely in that class of handling, with the narrow frame and skinny tires.
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I have not driven the i3. However, considering our roads have fairly low speed limits, a narrow frame with skinny tires can be a lot of fun. Especially when you try and corner....
Turning the corner in my Subaru with its AWD and road hugging fat tires is not really challenging. But when I tried to do the same corner in a Nissan Leaf, I was skidding through the turn. A lot more fun :D

Tim
 
jmp470 said:
As I posted about my driving speeds earlier. What I notice is (Our family car is a Toyota Sienna Minivan) that people HATE being passed by either our Prius or Minivan. Its like they have a complex or something. 95% of the time on i10, when I go to pass someone, they notice the car and speed up. So I get back into the lane behind them and they slow down. Then I have to pass them for real.
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They do that for everybody on I-10. That is why so many people don't use turn signals; it just warns the car you are about to pull in front of to speed up to cut you off.
 
tspear said:
But when I tried to do the same corner in a Nissan Leaf, I was skidding through the turn. A lot more fun :D
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Meh. If you aren't applying opposite lock while rolling on the accelerator then that is not fun.
 
wayne said:
Most Mustangs are automatic; I was searching for a manual and it took some work as there are not many.
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Sadly, most people don't know how to drive stick any more. :( I've never owned an automatic, unless I count half of whatever car my wife drives as "mine"... I went straight from stick shift to electric. And even my wife's is a CVT now, not that that's a huge difference from automatic. ;)

Yes, I know electric motors have lots of torque, so they accelerate very well. Doesn't mean the car is fun to drive though, but the acceleration may feel good. I love the Mustang because it's a convertible, but the BMW 328i I had before was a better handling car. I can't imagine the i3 is even remotely in that class of handling, with the narrow frame and skinny tires.
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It handles a helluva lot better than it looks like it should! That was one of the biggest surprises for me - Once you're in it, you can't tell it has the skinny tires.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
It handles a helluva lot better than it looks like it should! That was one of the biggest surprises for me - Once you're in it, you can't tell it has the skinny tires.
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Underfloor battery pack = low center of gravity = pleasant handling
 
Fun for me really isn’t how the Volt handles or accelerates, although it does do both fairly well. The common thread that you see with most Volt owners, is how it turned them into efficiency junkies. They start becoming numbers crunchers and try techniques to see how far they can stretch a charge.

Never been any sort of carbon footprint tree hugging hippie type but I enjoy driving around 37 miles on only $1.20 a charge and a lifetime mpg of 144 mpg.
 
I drive a 2006 Toyota Highlander Hybrid that I bought new off the show room floor after a semi wrecked the trailer I was pulling and totaled the car pulling it, a 1998 Toyota Corolla. (Our guardian angels worked overtime that day!) I did a little research before I pulled the trigger, and it seemed the recent model Highlanders held their value so well I might as well buy new. My wife drives a 2008 Toyota Highlander (not a Hybrid) and I get about 50% better mileage than she gets when I drive 50/50 highway and street, and almost 90% better 90/10 highway and street. The gas engine is relatively quiet, the main way I tell it's running is when I feel a little jerk when it comes on, or goes off. My tires don't last as long as they should because of the extra battery weight. I use regenerative braking a lot, and I haven't had my brakes done, nor needed to in 130K miles. That makes up for faster tire wear.

When we bought it, we got a tax credit that pretty much covered the extra cost of the hybrid drive train. My sister recently bought a hybrid Highlander, and the price differential was about $75.00 (Seventy five dollars!)
 
Velocity173 said:
Fun for me really isn’t how the Volt handles or accelerates, although it does do both fairly well. The common thread that you see with most Volt owners, is how it turned them into efficiency junkies. They start becoming numbers crunchers and try techniques to see how far they can stretch a charge.

Never been any sort of carbon footprint tree hugging hippie type but I enjoy driving around 37 miles on only $1.20 a charge and a lifetime mpg of 144 mpg.
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This is true. When I had my Fusion Energi I tried really hard to get the gas engine to never kick in, which was sometimes a challenge with its shorter range (I think it was rated at 21 miles).

Of course, now with the i3, I'm quite a bit less efficient. It's just so fun to pull up next to unsuspecting gasser drivers at a stop light and then leave them in the dust when it turns green. :D
 
A friend of mine has a 2013 Tesla. I have mentioned this before.

He had always wanted a Corvette and recently he found a cherry 2012 w 8k miles and 400hp engine and a 6 speed. It was love at first sight so he bought it. He kept the Tesla

Yesterday he told me sold it because it just wasn’t as much fun to drive as the Tesla. He wound up buying a 310R that he parks next to his DA40. He seems to have more fun than I do. He also seems to have more money too.
 
It you recall, Karen and I are considering a Honda Clarity PHEV.

We both test drove one a few weeks ago, and both liked it. Feels quite “normal” when on the electric motor. Would have to be really disciplined not to be distracted by all the bells and whistles at first. They’re selling really poorly, so we’d be looking to drive a hard bargain on a leftover 2018 once the 2019’s come out, which should be any day now.

If you further recall, we were counting on our 100 shares of TSLA to mostly or fully finance our purchase. Elon’s shenanigans may have put at least a temporary crimp in those plans.
 
Any thoughts/guesses as to what Tesla stock is going to do tomorrow?

I can see it taking a hit because of uncertainty going forward with Musk’s demotion.

But I can also see it going up, with Musk being reined in and hopefully cooler heads prevailing.

Of course, I’m hoping for the latter!
 
Well, there is no question that Tesla has some outstanding product, and a reasonable prospect for more - what they have failed to do, is to demonstrate that they can build and sell the product profitably.

I still look for an eventual acquisition of Tesla by a major automobile manufacturer, or perhaps a very extensive joint venture process. They desperately need legitimate manufacturing expertise.
 
SCCutler said:
Well, there is no question that Tesla has some outstanding product, and a reasonable prospect for more - what they have failed to do, is to demonstrate that they can build and sell the product profitably.

I still look for an eventual acquisition of Tesla by a major automobile manufacturer, or perhaps a very extensive joint venture process. They desperately need legitimate manufacturing expertise.
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What information do you have that says they cannot build the cars profitably?
As long as I have occasionally read the financial filings, there is insufficient details to answer this question.
They have historically had a massive capital spend. How much of the capital is required to build the cars?

Sent from my SM-J737T using Tapatalk
 
tspear said:
What information do you have that says they cannot build the cars profitably?
As long as I have occasionally read the financial filings, there is insufficient details to answer this question.
They have historically had a massive capital spend. How much of the capital is required to build the cars?

Sent from my SM-J737T using Tapatalk
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Absolutely none.
 
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