Avionics upgrade before my trip

C

callegro

Pre-Flight
Joined
May 30, 2014
Messages
72
Display Name
Display name:
Callegro
Hi guys,

I am planning a trip in my PA28-180 from LA-New Orleans for work in the next 3 weeks. I have been meeting with my avionics guy about possible upgrades when I return this summer. Seeing right now that I don't have a lot of time and/or money, I was wondering what you guys think would be the most important item to upgrade on my list and the least expensive in parts/labor at the moment. If the timing is right, my avionics guy might be able to squeeze it out. Here is my list:

-Transponder upgrade to a GTX345 (from old Bendix-King)
-GTN650 with a GI106 (to replace my ancient MK radio stack)
-GNC255 Nav/Com with GI102 (to replace nav/com2 KX170)
-Audio panel upgrade, possibly Garmin or PS to replace my ancient one.

Let me know what you guys think.
 
The GTN replacement of the MK stack, hands down.


Is also look at the used GNS prices too.
 
put in the audio panel and the GTN650 with all the provisional wiring for a GTX345 and GNC255, dump the stuff not wanted now. It costs a lot of money to go back in over & over to redo wiring.
 
Make a master plan,of what you really want and can afford. Then start with the GPS and audio panel. Then you can upgrade without duplicating the work,have a heart to heart with your avionics person.
 
bnt83 said:
provisional
Click to expand...
frfly172 said:
Make a master plan,of what you really want and can afford. Then start with the GPS and audio panel. Then you can upgrade without duplicating the work,have a heart to heart with your avionics person.
Click to expand...

That's the second best way though it can be difficult to keep the master plan when new boxes are constantly coming out.

The best being all-at-once.
 
For the Audio panel... hands down go with one of the PS Engineering models.

We just did the PMA450 in the Skylane and love, love, love it. Club also has the PMA8000BT in the Bonanza and those that use that aircraft are very happy.
 
Shouldn't add too much to have a harness made at the beginning that will work for all planned avionics. Later the install of the additional items will be much easier. Not sure if that may be done with a certified plane though.
 
AggieMike88 said:
For the Audio panel... hands down go with one of the PS Engineering models.

We just did the PMA450 in the Skylane and love, love, love it. Club also has the PMA8000BT in the Bonanza and those that use that aircraft are very happy.
Click to expand...
I have the 8000BT in my work airplane. It is awesome i highly recommend it.
 
If a 650 goes in, why not leave the old transponder and just install a gdl88?
 
"Squeeze it in" before a trip that is how long?

Might I suggest making the trip with everything as is and known working, then when no "squeezing" is needed do your upgrades, fly some learning trips, verify all the silly bugs are worked out, and then start thinking about >3000 nm round trips?
 
rolivi said:
"Squeeze it in" before a trip that is how long?

Might I suggest making the trip with everything as is and known working, then when no "squeezing" is needed do your upgrades, fly some learning trips, verify all the silly bugs are worked out, and then start thinking about >3000 nm round trips?
Click to expand...

I just finished a harness for my airplane that included a GDL88. I really didn't want to add a separate and remote mounted box so I was very happy to see the new line of transponders come out. Since those transponders use the same Unswitched Audio, RS232 and Ethernet interfaces I'll just cut the 20 foot long GDL88 harness down to about 3 feet and hook them to a GTX345.

Old transponder + GDL88 means another hole & antenna.

GTX345 uses the existing transponder antenna (assuming its getting GPS data from the GTN or other).

I can't wait to dump my old KT76A for the GTX345.
 
Last edited:
rolivi said:
"Squeeze it in" before a trip that is how long?

Might I suggest making the trip with everything as is and known working, then when no "squeezing" is needed do your upgrades, fly some learning trips, verify all the silly bugs are worked out, and then start thinking about >3000 nm round trips?
Click to expand...
Absolutely what I am thinking. Do the trip with KNOWN FUNCTIONING equipment. It will be much more enjoyable than having to troubleshoot what got screwed up or worst case scenario experience in-flight electrical malfunction or fire.
It is smarter to wait than rush.
 
I'll pile on to the bunch saying "don't upgrade and then go on the trip".

No upgrade of avionics ever goes off flawlessly. Our club has had stuff done to both aircraft in the last 3 years and each time when the shop declares they are done, we find a host of real world usage gremlins that their shop testing didn't uncover. The shop did take care of the problems, and we're happy with the shop, but it took a while for the tech to get the time on his busy schedule to fix.

Go do your trip, enjoy yourself, then get the upgrades done.
 
Has the price on the 345 come down enough already to be reasonably competitive with the 88 yet? Especially if I already have a 327 and 430?
 
mkosmo said:
Has the price on the 345 come down enough already to be reasonably competitive with the 88 yet? Especially if I already have a 327 and 430?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure it's been out long enough to have sufficient competition to push the price downward.

For review and additional data, there's more than one version of the GTX345. See this article in Aviation Consumer for more info (may require subscribing).

Summary:
  • the most basic is the entry-level GTX335 ES without GPS. At $2995, it has 1090ES extended squitter ADS-B Out, but no ADS-B In.
  • the GTX335 is available with internal WAAS GPS as an option, which meets the ADS-B mandate standard for a position source and increases the price to $3795. This means you won’t have to install a panel-mounted GPS to drive the transponder. The shop will have to install a GPS antenna, of course, and the transponder will need a traditional L-band antenna system like any transponder.
  • The $4995 GTX345 series kicks the interface potential up to a higher level with a dual-band ADS-B In receiver. Dual bands mean the transponder can receive ADS-B data on both 978 and 1090 MHz frequencies. Like the GTX335, the GTX345 is a 1090ES unit, making it a player for higher altitudes where 1090ES is required. The flagship GTX345 with internal WAAS GPS is $5795.

Bluetooth Enabled​

A major difference between the GTX345 and lower-end GTX335 is the internal wireless Bluetooth transceiver, which follows the footsteps of Garmin’s remote-mounted Flight Stream wireless hub. Using Garmin’s Connext Bluetooth link, the GTX345 streams ADS-B traffic and FIS-B weather data to the aera795/796 portable GPS, iOS and Android tablets running the Garmin Pilot navigation app, in addition to the ForeFlight Mobile app for iPad.​
 
Awesome! I appreciate the information. The articles I had been reading hadn't mentioned the other models. The Bluetooth is appealing, though, kicking my desired feature set back to the 345 or 88 with the FS.
 
What is going to be interesting over the next bunches of months is what might be announced about this space at SnF and AirVenture.

We now have Garmin and L-3 in this certified space. Apaero has something in the pipeline. I expect others to come along soon.

I also remember attending a presentation by FreeFlight 3 years ago about their ADS-B product they were introducing. That was onwards of 10 AMUs. Always fun to watch how advancement and competition bring more features at lower prices.
 
Absolutely! That's one of the reasons I keep holding out. The options keep getting better! I'm just beginning to wonder when I'll be forced to pull the trigger due to avionics shop workload saturation so I'm not stuck on the ground for an extended period beginning in 2020.
 
The 2020 deadline is becoming an item of interest. Several major entities with large fleets are saying they may need more time to have the entire fleet in compliance. While past news articles have mentioned the FAA isn't going to budge the date... that was in the past and as we get closer, other heavy weights might start pushing for extension or change.

And then come 2025 when we have yet another generation of avionics... Perhaps something with it's own inflatable Otto Pilot.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top