Are fairings part of Airworthiness?

Discussion in 'Maintenance Bay' started by 4RNB, Jan 6, 2021.

  1. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    Someone tried telling me today that folks thought my fairings were not airworthy due to cracks. Any truth to this? Not an issue at 10/20 annual or last months pre buy.
     
  2. Doc Holliday

    Doc Holliday Pattern Altitude

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    Which fairings? Wheel?
     
  3. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    I do not know.
     
  4. Doc Holliday

    Doc Holliday Pattern Altitude

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    OK. So who is telling you this?
     
  5. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Eh? Some details would be useful here. What kind of fairings on what kind of aircraft. What is the extent of the cracks? Have they been abated (stop drilled or whatever)?

    Technically, everything attached to an airplane (or that should have been attached) is part of airworthiness. The question is whether the cracking you have makes the plane unairworthy.
     
  6. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    If your IA says so, It must be.
     
  7. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Yes there could be an airworthiness issue.
     
  8. Kenny Phillips

    Kenny Phillips En-Route

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    We had to pull a front wheel fairing (pant) due to cracking. It can become a serious issue if it lets go at a bad time.
     
  9. Bell206

    Bell206 Final Approach

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    FYI: no where near enough info to answer.
     
  10. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    OK, I went out to look at the plane. It still looks better than what I have been training in, and what I looked at when shopping. Plane is a Cessna 172. So I was having problems with old school not being willing to train me in my new plane. My CFI would train me if his mechanic did an inspection. This after a 10/20 annual and a prebuy last month. CFI a busy man. New school looks at logs books, says looks good, assigns me a newer CFI because he has the most time. We meet once, he desired his own checkride in the plane from another CFI before teaching me. Yesterday was supposed to be the day. I'd left what ARROW documents I knew in the plane, brought home logs and "the notebook" CFI calls me last night, said things came up and they did not fly. Said equipment list needed to be in the plane, you know "the notebook". Cancels my lesson time for today, cancels for Thursday, wants to try and get a meeting with all the powers that be, acknowledges he is in the middle. So, I am still not flying, they did not fly, and if they had called me I could have taken them the paperwork in 5 minutes.

    So I put out on some local FB groups that I am looking for a CFI to finish my training in my plane. Like it has been nearly a month, no flying. One of the responses comes from the head CFI of the school, asks if I am not flying with them any longer. I take the discussion private, said I was willing to fly with anyone, any time, any where, just wanted to fly, and thus far that school had not made that happen. He wrote me that the plane was not airworthy when they went to fly it yesterday, does not explain. So I call the head of the school, he commented about airworthiness of "fairings" said the folks yesterday were concerned. On the phone he made it sound like perhaps we could still fly, they just don't work with other peoples planes much. We are meeting in person Thursday to discuss, also make sure I understand fully what from the notebook belongs in the plane.

    The head CFI that told me the plane was found unairworthy is not a mechanic. He is an FAA designated examiner and could potentially be giving me my checkride.

    So I go take pictures, hope I get them loaded up here. I talked to someone else, showed him the pictures, he explained how the PIC could think of them as unairworthy, and that it was a judgement call.

    Ok, pictures are listed as being too large to upload.
     
  11. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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  12. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Unairworthy? Not sure I'd go that far. In need of maintenance, yep. Designated examiners have no authority to make pronouncements on airworthiness or interpret FARs or anything other than the narrow scope of their designation (doing checkrides).
     
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  13. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    when was the annual completed?
     
  14. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    October 2020.
    Prebuy was December
     
  15. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Then get a pilot to fly the aircraft out of here, and find a new CFI.
     
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  16. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Now you know why I don't like a flying clubs/schools
     
  17. Bell206

    Bell206 Final Approach

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    Sounds like you're getting caught in the politics of the school. FWIW: time to break and run. This is beyond a simple mx issue which based on your pics it's not an issue. Good luck.
     
  18. WannFly

    WannFly Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    Sounds like a bunch of excuses to me. I have seen flight school airplanes with more cracks than the pictures
     
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  19. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    It has been so frustrating getting this license!
     
  20. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Next question? who holds the maintenance records?
    if you do, follow Bells advice and run.
     
  21. WannFly

    WannFly Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    find another school or another independent CFI to train you. though i havent heard the other side of the story, it sure sounds like they are coming up with excuses that are outside their authority. a DPE can always say he wont ride in your plane, whatever, but he cant declare your plane unairworthy as @flyingron mentioned above
     
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  22. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    it need not be, find someone to teach you. other than the place that was screwing you
     
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  23. X3 Skier

    X3 Skier En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Hard to tell. Mostly cracked paint, little cracked metal, not much if anything needing attention.

    I’d move on as others have suggested. They just don’t want to lose rental income.

    Cheers
     
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  24. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    I have the records but the school wants to review them with me in person Thursday @ 1600. The person I am meeting with already got an email with electronic logs
     
  25. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    I would like to see the little stuff repaired, but it is not unairworthy in my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2021
  26. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

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    Saw the pics. LOL you should some of mine. Buddy, you're being railroaded by a cabal who feel you're shorting someone rental revenue somewhere down the pick-pocket line. Nothing wrong with that plane. Welcome to the grift of part 61.
     
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  27. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    get away from them, they only want money..

    They are your logs, get some one to fly it away.

    Were is this taking place.. ?
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2021
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  28. Jdm

    Jdm Line Up and Wait

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    I think you might be getting the run around. All 172s deal with cracked plastic. Yes they’ll need to be replaced at some point. I’m sure your A&P can evaluate that in a couple of seconds.

    Betcha the flight school’s airplanes are worse!
     
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  29. texasclouds

    texasclouds Pattern Altitude

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    Why would the CFI need another to check him out in your 172? He must be a green horn. I assume they were going to have you pay both CFIs for the flight time.
     
  30. Salty

    Salty Touchdown! Greaser!

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    It's not up to a school or a CFI to determine if your plane is airworthy. It's up to your IA. If your IA says it's airworthy, keep looking for a CFI that's not a douche. There are also other DPE's, even if you have to travel to get to them.
     
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  31. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    Yes, I think he was newer, had the most availability.

    To tell the truth, money not an issue. If someone said we are going to charge you double I would say get in the plane! I don't want to get ripped off, but I want to fly. I got no beef paying for peoples time and efforts. I've thought about hiring a CFI to come to me, stay with us until I get done. Give you a vehicle to drive, cook you good food, private room. I also thought to go to FL where I had a chance to fly every day. One guys hires out for $2500 a week but not available until February.
     
  32. WannFly

    WannFly Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    @4RNB not sure where you are located, may be i missed it, but if you post your location, i am sure the people here can recommend someone. open another thread under pilot training or flight following and see if you get any recommendations
     
  33. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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  34. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    To be clear, I am not aware of folks trying to grift me or whatever. I just want to fly and these are the obstacles in front of me.
     
  35. texasclouds

    texasclouds Pattern Altitude

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    Where are you located?
     
  36. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    Eastern NC
     
  37. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Make certain they do not make any entries in those copies
     
  38. Briar Rabbit

    Briar Rabbit Line Up and Wait

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    And make sure you maintain control of them. Do not leave the log books in the plane and keep them in your possession! They are not required to be in the airplane during flight.
     
  39. 4RNB

    4RNB Pre-takeoff checklist PoA Supporter

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    Yeah, I've already thought to just leave the logs at home or in the car.
     
  40. donjohnston

    donjohnston Pattern Altitude

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    At home. In a fireproof safe. NOT in your car.

    The only time my logsbooks came out was when an entry needed to be made.
     
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