Airport nomenclature

cowman

cowman

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This one has bugged me for a while and continues to do so when going to an unfamiliar field.

So, the airport I got private at was KEAU which in the sectional and anywhere "official" you'd look is called the "Chippewa Valley Regional Airport". The airport it's self is in Eau Claire, WI. Since "Chippewa Valley Regional" is a mouthfull on the radio we always just called up "Eau Claire Tower" for clearances and such.... as did pretty much everyone else except the occasional out of area pilot who would actually call "Chippewa Valley Regional".

To me, living there at the time, it made more sense to call "Eau Claire Tower" or, after hours "Eau Claire Traffic" because that's just how anyone local referred to the field. But, anyone looking at their sectional who isn't acquainted with the area might hear those radio calls and be confused. At KEAU the Tower would answer to either and have it figured out but what about uncontrolled fields? It's happened to me elsewhere...

I made a fuel stop on the way to FL at KPIM, which on the sectional is "Harris County". I started making my radio calls while inbound for "Harris County". I heard other pilots calling out entering the pattern at "Pine Mountain". I quickly figured out the town next to KPIM is Pine Mountain and we were talking about the same field... I changed my radio calls. No harm, no foul but it's easy to see how things could get confused really fast in a situation like that.

Guess the moral here is know your destination and the name of all the towns by it. However, what is the correct way to refer to airports like these in ATC world? What's on the sectional, or does it just not matter?
 
If I am not certain, I usually listen to the freq whether it is tower or CTAF to see what others call it. If it is a slow day and no one else makes a call before I need to, I go with the name on the chart.
 
write-stuff said:
Local custom.
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Nope.

The A/FD and instrument approaches all list a frequency for "Eau Claire Tower." That's official.

Tower names don't always match the airport names. For instance, there is no "Sacramento Tower," though there are two airports called "Sacramento." They are Executive Tower and Capitol Tower.

The upshot is that the sectional is not authoritative. The A/FD is.
 
There is "official". And there is local custom. The answer to the guy's question is local custom.
 
Sometimes it's a little of both.

local custom: Harrisonville
official: Lawrence Smith Memorial Airport
AWOS: "Harrisonville, Lawrence Smith Memorial Airport"
 
Both the sectional and the A/FD call my home base Knapp State, and many pilots both local and transient call it that. Others call it Montpelier, or Barre/Montpelier. I found it a bit confusing at first and asked the FBO owner. He said he calls it Montpelier. I decided to call it that, unless the last pilot on the frequency called it Knapp State in which case I'd call it that so everyone would be clear that we were talking about the same airport.

Short answer: I agree with local custom, but best to be flexible so as not to cause confusion.
 
write-stuff said:
There is "official". And there is local custom. The answer to the guy's question is local custom.
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Yeah, I agree and have run into this myself before. There is a great BBQ place in Carthage, NC (BQ1). It's technically Gilliam-McConnel airfield. When you fly in there, some pilots call "Gilliam McConnel traffic" on CTAF, some say "Carthage traffic". Me, "Carthage Traffic" is a lot less of a mouthful, but if everyone else is using the former, I just go with the flow.

[Note: If you aren't too far away and like good BBQ, I highly suggest it]
 
I usually go with whatever the atis/AWOS identifies the airport as. If there's neither, I take an educated guess based on the airport name and correct if someone else on the frequency uses something else.
 
write-stuff said:
Local custom.
Click to expand...

True, but what if you're completely unfamiliar with the area and the town name they're using isn't on the chart? You'll have no clue as to what airfield they're talking about. I always try to use the name on the charts. Local custom be damned.
 
Brad Z said:
I usually go with whatever the atis/AWOS identifies the airport as. If there's neither, I take an educated guess based on the airport name and correct if someone else on the frequency uses something else.
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That works in some places. The ATIS at Flint, MI identifies the airport as Bishop International, but absolutely NO ONE says Bishop Approach or Bishop Tower. I think the same thing is true at Detroit City Airport "Coleman Young Int'l", and even the sectional says "Young". Pilots say City Tower.

When there's a tower or approach facility, I just listen as there's usually other traffic around talking to the facility.
 
On a similar note...

I was flying around the St. Simons Island, GA area a few months ago on a busy weekend. There was a "republican think tank" meeting on the island that weekend and there were more corporate jets flying in and out than you can shake a stick at. They closed down their cross wind runway for parking and had 50 or so parked on the field. I took 3 or 4 sightseeing flights that weekend and it wasn't unusual to hear the corporate jets announce "brunswick traffic" instead of "McKinnon-Sipes."***** At one point in time there were three corporate jets announcing that they were inbound for runway 04 @ Brunswick...instead of runway 04 McKinnon.

And an old voice came on the radio and the fun started...

"Gentlemen, the Brunswick frequency is 123.0"

(I initially thought it was someone from the FBO but that notion was quickly dispelled as the conversation continued)

(long pause on the radio)

One of the corporate jet jocks responded "my chart says Brunswick is 123.05."

The old man responded with something like "No, sonny, if you look at the index on your chart you'll see where it explains that a name in all capital letters is the name of the town. Not the name of the airport. Airport names are upper/lower case. What's worse is that there actually is an airport called Brunswick about 10 miles NW of here...it doesn't have a runway 04 though. But please use the proper name when coming in here so folks don't think your actually at Brunswick."

(another long pause on the radio)

No one responded to the old man but all started announcing "McKinnon."

But the old man just can't help himself and after four or five calls by the jet jocks he pipes up with "okay boys, now say three hail marys and tear two epaulet bars off."

I laughed my ass off as I envisioned an old man sitting in his t-hangar, sipping on a beer, listening to traffic on his handheld, and smirking.

But to confuse matters, McKinnon's ASOS says "brunswick-mckinnon"

***** I swear when I was last down there (just a couple of months ago) it was titled "McKinnon-Sipes" on the charts. Now I see it's titled "McKinnon-St. Simons." I'm pretty sure that's a very recent change but could be wrong.
 
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BTW...you would think that something as important and simple as airport names would be a bit more standardized. It kinda helps if everyone is using the same name so we all know where each other is at.

You would think............
 
Well this is timely. I just went barreling into KODO yakking about "Odessa Traffic". Wasn't until short final I heard some call "Schlemeyer Traffic". At least now I know how to pronounce it. :blush:
 
timwinters said:
True, but what if you're completely unfamiliar with the area and the town name they're using isn't on the chart? You'll have no clue as to what airfield they're talking about. I always try to use the name on the charts. Local custom be damned.
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Well sure. I wasn't arguing in favor of local custom, I was just answering the guy's question.
 
Flew out of Grider Field yesterday. Locals call "Pine Bluff Traffic"....out of towners call" Grider Field Traffic." Sam same... When in Rome........
 
It's even more confusing when the airport changes names. When Sanford-Lee got delusions of grandeur and started calling themselves Raleigh Executive it was amusing.

Of course, having flown around Hyde for years, nobody ever called it Washington Executive.
 
timwinters said:
BTW...you would think that something as important and simple as airport names would be a bit more standardized. It kinda helps if everyone is using the same name so we all know where each other is at.

You would think............
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You would think pilots would read the green book, as required by 14 CFR 91.103.

Almost all of the examples in this thread are in there. Certainly all of the tower and approach names.
 
timwinters said:
On a similar note...

The old man responded with something like "No, sonny, if you look at the index on your chart you'll see where it explains that a name in all capital letters is the name of the town. Not the name of the airport. Airport names are upper/lower case. What's worse is that there actually is an airport called Brunswick about 10 miles NW of here...it doesn't have a runway 04 though. But please use the proper name when coming in here so folks don't think your actually at Brunswick."
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Great story. Very funny. But I think the old man got it backwards in your story. Isn't the name of the town normally in upper/lower case and the airport name in all upper case? Also the town name is in upper/lower is only for smaller towns but they put it in all upper for larger cities. Plus the name of the airport is in either blue or magenta and matches the airspace.

Still cool story. Not trying to take away from it.
 
flyingron said:
It's even more confusing when the airport changes names. When Sanford-Lee got delusions of grandeur and started calling themselves Raleigh Executive it was amusing. Of course, having flown around Hyde for years, nobody ever called it Washington Executive.
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We've got Dallas Executive, but for most it will always be Redbird.
 
SkyDog58 said:
But I think the old man got it backwards in your story. Isn't the name of the town normally in upper/lower case and the airport name in all upper case? Also the town name is in upper/lower is only for smaller towns but they put it in all upper for larger cities. Plus the name of the airport is in either blue or magenta and matches the airspace.

Still cool story. Not trying to take away from it.
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Well, I had to look it up myself after the exchange because I certainly didn't know. And the only place I could find where "BRUNSWICK" was listed right next to the airport was on the IFR Low chart. The legend confirmed what he was saying.
 
timwinters said:
Well, I had to look it up myself after the exchange because I certainly didn't know. And the only place I could find where "BRUNSWICK" was listed right next to the airport was on the IFR Low chart. The legend confirmed what he was saying.
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Ah! Silly me just looked at the VFR sectional.
 
You run into this problem trying to find airports in the Instrument plates. They are listed by city, but you never really know which city. For instance KBJC is listed in Denver (its actually in a suburb called Broomfield) etc. This can be a real problem when you have to divert and try and figure it out in the air.

KCRQ is in Carlsbad California, but everyone calls it McClelland or Palomar or McClelland/Palomar. Its listed as McClelland on the Instrument plate and Carlsbad on the enroute chart with no town at all named on the VFR chart. It's a mess.
 
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MAKG1 said:
You would think pilots would read the green book, as required by 14 CFR 91.103.

Almost all of the examples in this thread are in there. Certainly all of the tower and approach names.
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The A/FD will say things like FLINT TWR for the Bishop International airport in Flint, MI, or MAGIC CITY TWR for the Minot International airport in Minot, ND. So it lists a tower name when the name doesn't match the city or the airport (Minot) and at least for Flint when it doesn't match the airport but does match the city. Does that mean that every TWR listed on its own should be called after the airport name, as at KCRQ?
 
iamtheari said:
The A/FD will say things like FLINT TWR for the Bishop International airport in Flint, MI, or MAGIC CITY TWR for the Minot International airport in Minot, ND. So it lists a tower name when the name doesn't match the city or the airport (Minot) and at least for Flint when it doesn't match the airport but does match the city. Does that mean that every TWR listed on its own should be called after the airport name, as at KCRQ?
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According to the AF/D legend, the tower is named the same as the airport (not the city) if it is not named in the AF/D. So, it is McLellan-Palomar (no D). Which is a dumb name, as there is another McLellan Airport (KMCC). At least that one doesn't have a tower.
 
Around Indianapolis you have:
Indianapolis International - once upon a time, many years ago was called Weir Cook.
Indianapolis Regional- formerly Mount Comfort Airport
Indianapolis Executive - formerly named Terry Airport
Indianapolis Metro - I do not recall if it ever had another name

I think keeping their original names would have been better but those decisions are made by politicians.
 
MAKG1 said:
The A/FD and instrument approaches all list a frequency for "Eau Claire Tower." That's official.
Click to expand...

Those are what I use to determine what to call the tower/CTAF.

SkyDog58 said:
Around Indianapolis you have:
Indianapolis International - once upon a time, many years ago was called Weir Cook.
Indianapolis Regional- formerly Mount Comfort Airport
Indianapolis Executive - formerly named Terry Airport
Indianapolis Metro - I do not recall if it ever had another name

I think keeping their original names would have been better but those decisions are made by politicians.
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And FBO operators. The Montgomery's and Indy Jet pushed for the name changes along with the airport boards. They think corporate guys are more likely to go to places with Regional or Executive in the name as opposed to Terry and Mt. Comfort. Whether the name changes work I don't know. Doesn't really make it confusing when they are all on different frequencies and the names themselves aren't confusing.

"Regional Traffic..."
"Executive Traffic..."
"Metro Traffic..."
Also have the Indy Heliport on 123.05(same as exec) which most use as the CTAF for the general downtown area, "Downtown Area Traffic..."
 
Gucci Pilot said:
Those are what I use to determine what to call the tower/CTAF.



And FBO operators. The Montgomery's and Indy Jet pushed for the name changes along with the airport boards. They think corporate guys are more likely to go to places with Regional or Executive in the name as opposed to Terry and Mt. Comfort. Whether the name changes work I don't know. Doesn't really make it confusing when they are all on different frequencies and the names themselves aren't confusing.

"Regional Traffic..."
"Executive Traffic..."
"Metro Traffic..."
Also have the Indy Heliport on 123.05(same as exec) which most use as the CTAF for the general downtown area, "Downtown Area Traffic..."
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And if you're landing on the freeway "Any Interstate 10 traffic, please advise".:D
 
azure said:
That works in some places. The ATIS at Flint, MI identifies the airport as Bishop International, but absolutely NO ONE says Bishop Approach or Bishop Tower. I think the same thing is true at Detroit City Airport "Coleman Young Int'l", and even the sectional says "Young". Pilots say City Tower.
When there's a tower or approach facility, I just listen as there's usually other traffic around talking to the facility.
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The Chat Supplement shows it as 'Deroit City' tower.
 
Keith Smith from PilotEdge (@coma24) just recently covered this exact issue in this video about Air Traffic Control, starting at about 32 minutes:

The name to use is found on the Airport Diagram with the frequencies, or in the A/FD.

Edit: I am trying to post the link to the exact spot in the youtube video, but the editor keeps changing my plain link to a MEDIA link. Does anyone know how to post a youtube link where the forum software doesn't mess with it?
 
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