Airline go-arounds

gprellwitz

gprellwitz

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Grant Prellwitz
Coming back from Munich this evening in a Lufthansa A340-600, we experienced something I've never experienced before. No, not A go-around, but TWO go-arounds, and not weather related. They blamed the first one on ATC putting them too close to another plane, and the second on a tailwind thT was beyond the airplane limits. When we finally landed on the third attempt, the passengers broke into applause!:dunno:
 
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I experienced my first airline go-around yesterday. A level 4 storm developed on top of us during the approach. The plane hit some really bad wind shear on short final and the crew decided to go to their alternate.

It was the worst wind shear I've experienced. The nose made a figure 8 and it felt like I was showing a student dutch rolls.
 
I have been through a few. Pilot always blames ATC, even though 2 of then I was listening to channel 9 and heard that the pilot requested it for blowing visual approaches.

Funny stuff.
 
I had a 777 go around in Brisbane due to low fog. Looking down you could see the runway and we couldn't have been more from a few feet from T/D when they throttled up and we ended up flying to Cairns for the day.
 
A lightly loaded 737 doing a missed approach in Juneau, AK. Impressive!
 
Aeromexico DC9 on th eway from Cancun to Los Angeles, one stop in Monterrey. Three missed approaches at MMTY, and it was interesting because the cockpit door was snapped open and I could see out the windshield from my aisle seat 3 rows back. Could very clearly hear the "MINIMUMS MINIMUMS" callout and they'd power up and clean up. The last time, when the "MINUMUMS" annunciation happened, guess they saw enough because they chopped power and we touched down right quick.

Cleared customs and (of course) the ceiling was too low to depart, so the airline put us up for the night.

Also, several go-arounds with other carriers - one with Southwest at San Antonio, someone did not clear the runway fast enough, another at DFW when the wind shifted (frontal passage) when we were short final.
 
I remember coming into Tahiti and my dad, who was sitting next to me and a commercial pilot, said that we were too high. That has been my only commercial go around. I am glad that we went around rather than trying to salvage a high approach with a disaster.
 
I was sitting in the FSS at Kotzebue, AK, and watched the Alaska Airlines 737 try 6 times to land. Seems there was fingers of fog blowing across the runway. Everytime he got close to the runway another finger would cover the runway. After the 6th try he went up into the hold and let several of the local planes come in.

On the 7th try, he made it.

And yes, after landing the crew opened the cockpit door and keyed the mike. You could hear everyone clapping and celebrating.
 
I've had two missed approaches on an airline before. CRJ going into CVG a while back. We kept breaking out of the overcast well above DH, but there were low clouds obscuring the runway so they had to go missed. Did that twice and finally got in on the third attempt.
 
I've only experienced one go-around on scheduled service, on a Delta Connection RJ into LaGuardia. Fair weather day, after configuring for landing the pilot starts making a couple of lazy s-turns, right past the Whitestone bridge (landing 22). After a little of that, its power up, nose up, wheels up. I was actually surprised at how quickly they made a hole for us to get back in line for landing. It really was no more than a pattern.

Cockpit crew came on the intercom and blamed the flight ahead not clearing the runway quick enough. I remember thing that they were the only ones with a view out the front so the rest of us would never know. :D
 
I was on a Southwest 737 coming in to SMF several years ago that did two go arounds due to strong crosswinds.
 
Two years ago, flying United into Tokyo, bad weather forced two go-arounds. Would have liked to hear what the first one was for, as I could see the runway below us and could also see well into the distance, even though there was a fair bit of rain. Second time was no question; we never got out of the clouds.

Ended up landing at Osaka and sitting on the ramp for a few hours for weather to clear back in Tokyo. Third time was a charm.
 
Zeldman said:
I was sitting in the FSS at Kotzebue, AK, and watched the Alaska Airlines 737 try 6 times to land. Seems there was fingers of fog blowing across the runway. Everytime he got close to the runway another finger would cover the runway. After the 6th try he went up into the hold and let several of the local planes come in.

On the 7th try, he made it.

And yes, after landing the crew opened the cockpit door and keyed the mike. You could hear everyone clapping and celebrating.
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6 Missed? At what point would he have diverted? Man... That would make me nervous as a back seater.
 
I've only been in one on commercial flight, in Costa Rica (SJO) in an A319 or 320. During the rainy season, there is usually rain beginning in the early afternoon from an hour or two to several hours. And the clouds get very low.

We were landing about 3pm I think. I kind of expected some of what happened. So the approach is white out the whole way, can't see a thing. Thick white clouds. The gear comes down and still can't see a thing. As we get closer and closer, I start to get a bit nervous seeing how I can't see anything but white (and grey). Then we are low, maybe 100 feet AGL, and I see the runway threshold zoom by and then thousand footer (so we are not on centerline--I should not be able to see the thousand footer if we are lined up). And we are still descending. Now, I'm starting to freak a little. This guy is going to land halfway down the runway. I know it's 10k feet but it's been raining all afternoon, not the best time to practice hard braking. LOL (I remember turning toward my buddy and telling him that this idiot is going to try to land halfway down the runway or something like that)

Finally, as the wheels are about to make contact with the ground, we heard the engine throttle up and it got loud and we started a steep climb (or maybe it just felt that way). Any way, we circled for about 45 minutes but the weather would not give, so we had to go to our alternate Panama City to refuel. After the refuel, we waited there for about another hour until we got the go-ahead to return to Costa Rica. The low cloud cover was gone and we landed with no issue. I don't know what could've happened if he had tried to land and stop on that wet runway with 5 or 6,000 feet to go. Or is that plenty for a 320 to stop, even in pouring rain?
 
orange said:
I've only been in one on commercial flight, in Costa Rica (SJO) in an A319 or 320. During the rainy season, there is usually rain beginning in the early afternoon from an hour or two to several hours. And the clouds get very low.

We were landing about 3pm I think. I kind of expected some of what happened. So the approach is white out the whole way, can't see a thing. Thick white clouds. The gear comes down and still can't see a thing. As we get closer and closer, I start to get a bit nervous seeing how I can't see anything but white (and grey). Then we are low, maybe 100 feet AGL, and I see the runway threshold zoom by and then thousand footer (so we are not on centerline--I should not be able to see the thousand footer if we are lined up). And we are still descending. Now, I'm starting to freak a little. This guy is going to land halfway down the runway. I know it's 10k feet but it's been raining all afternoon, not the best time to practice hard braking. LOL (I remember turning toward my buddy and telling him that this idiot is going to try to land halfway down the runway or something like that)

Finally, as the wheels are about to make contact with the ground, we heard the engine throttle up and it got loud and we started a steep climb (or maybe it just felt that way). Any way, we circled for about 45 minutes but the weather would not give, so we had to go to our alternate Panama City to refuel. After the refuel, we waited there for about another hour until we got the go-ahead to return to Costa Rica. The low cloud cover was gone and we landed with no issue. I don't know what could've happened if he had tried to land and stop on that wet runway with 5 or 6,000 feet to go. Or is that plenty for a 320 to stop, even in pouring rain?
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Yep, it is.
 
I've experienced go-arounds at least three times on scheduled flights. I think one was windshear and the other two were spacing issues.
 
This guy I know caused a RJ to go around at Tunica MS by taking a real long time to clear the runway after flying a real slow final. I had a bird's eye view from downwind.
 
orange said:
I've only been in one on commercial flight, in Costa Rica (SJO) in an A319 or 320. During the rainy season, there is usually rain beginning in the early afternoon from an hour or two to several hours. And the clouds get very low.

This guy is going to land halfway down the runway. I know it's 10k feet but it's been raining all afternoon, not the best time to practice hard braking. LOL (I remember turning toward my buddy and telling him that this idiot is going to try to land halfway down the runway or something like that)
.....................................
Finally, as the wheels are about to make contact with the ground, we heard the engine throttle up and it got loud and we started a steep climb (or maybe it just felt that way). Any way, we circled for about 45 minutes but the weather would not give, so we had to go to our alternate Panama City to refuel. After the refuel, we waited there for about another hour until we got the go-ahead to return to Costa Rica. The low cloud cover was gone and we landed with no issue. I don't know what could've happened if he had tried to land and stop on that wet runway with 5 or 6,000 feet to go. Or is that plenty for a 320 to stop, even in pouring rain?
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frcabot said:
Yep, it is.
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Tail wind? Wind shear? Cross wind limitation? How deep was the standing water?

BTW, trying to land outside of the touchdown zone is a big no no. :nono:

121.195 Airplanes: Turbine engine powered: Landing limitations: Destination airports.

(a) No person operating a turbine engine powered airplane may take off that airplane at such a weight that (allowing for normal consumption of fuel and oil in flight to the destination or alternate airport) the weight of the airplane on arrival would exceed the landing weight set forth in the Airplane Flight Manual for the elevation of the destination or alternate airport and the ambient temperature anticipated at the time of landing.
(b) Except as provided in paragraph (c), (d), or (e) of this section, no person operating a turbine engine powered airplane may take off that airplane unless its weight on arrival, allowing for normal consumption of fuel and oil in flight (in accordance with the landing distance set forth in the Airplane Flight Manual for the elevation of the destination airport and the wind conditions anticipated there at the time of landing), would allow a full stop landing at the intended destination airport within 60 percent of the effective length of each runway described below from a point 50 feet above the intersection of the obstruction clearance plane and the runway. For the purpose of determining the allowable landing weight at the destination airport the following is assumed:
(1) The airplane is landed on the most favorable runway and in the most favorable direction, in still air.
(2) The airplane is landed on the most suitable runway considering the probable wind velocity and direction and the ground handling characteristics of the airplane, and considering other conditions such as landing aids and terrain.
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RotorAndWing said:
Tail wind? Wind shear? Cross wind limitation? How deep was the standing water?
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Per the QRH should still be plenty. I'm assuming no tailwind, but if the proper runway is in use you shouldn't have one. Even at max weight with standing water gives 1770m.
 
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frcabot said:
Per the QRH should still be plenty. I'm assuming no tailwind, but if the proper runway is in use you shouldn't have one.
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Huh? Go back and read 121.195 and also what I wrote about landing outside the touch down zone.

BTW, Limitations allow for up to a 10 knot tailwind in landing. We don't always get to land into the wind.
 
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RotorAndWing said:
Huh? Go back and read 121.195 and also what I wrote about landing outside the touch down zone.
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I wasn't commenting on that part. I agree that landing outside the TDZ requires go-around.
 
frcabot said:
I wasn't commenting on that part. I agree that landing outside the TDZ requires go-around.
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No, but you answered

I don't know what could've happened if he had tried to land and stop on that wet runway with 5 or 6,000 feet to go. Or is that plenty for a 320 to stop, even in pouring rain?
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with

Yep, it is
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Even if the QRH table shows 1770M (5807 feet) you still have to add 115% to have an effective runway of 6678 feet. And that is predicated on touchdown in the touch down zone, once outside of that your runway guarantees go out the window.
 
RotorAndWing said:
No, but you answered



with



Even if the QRH table shows 1770M (5807 feet) you still have to add 115% to have an effective runway of 6678 feet. And that is predicated on touchdown in the touch down zone, once outside of that your runway guarantees go out the window.
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I'm talking about RLD (required landing distance) not ALD (actual landing distance). Of course there are all sorts of variables including reversers, crosswind, headwind, autobraking, landing config, etc.
 
RotorAndWing said:
You're confusing the question, he didn't ask for the ALD. He wanted to know if the jet could have continued the landing in the remaining runway.
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Oh, I thought he was asking about whether it could theoretically land and stop. If your interpretation is correct, then no, obviously not.
 
gprellwitz said:
Coming back from Munich this evening in a Lufthansa A340-600, we experienced something I've never experienced before. No, not A go-around, but TWO go-arounds, and not weather related. They blamed the first one on ATC putting them too close to another plane, and the second on a tailwind thT was beyond the airplane limits. When we finally landed on the third attempt, the passengers broke into applause!:dunno:
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Was an a 747 that went around in Honolulu. Traffic on runway.
 
I only remember being on one flight with a go-around. We were coming into LGA on the Expressway Visual 31 (which I hear is a really cool/challenging/fun approach). Not sure if the pilot overshot the final or if there was traffic.
 
January 1991, Eastern Airlines L-1011, go around at night in low IFR at Atlanta. On the P.A. captain blamed spacing.

It was a weird trip. We were returning home to L.A. from a San Juan-based Caribbean cruise. The flight was two hours late departing out of SJU. EAL mechanics at SJU were on strike. :eek: Connection time in ATL was tight anyway; with the departure delay plus the go-around, it was hopeless. Fortunately, though, they did hold the connecting red-eye to LAX for us.

We boarded the A300 for the leg to LAX. A fellow passenger from our SJU flight asked a FA for a pillow; she curtly said there were none available. He grumbled something in response. She whirled and spat, "Sir, we waited two hours for you!" Without missing a beat he replied, "No, ma'am. You waited two hours for your airplane."

Two weeks later EAL ceased operations.
 
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Pilawt said:
January 1991, Eastern Airlines L-1011, go around at night in low IFR at Atlanta. On the P.A. captain blamed spacing.
Two weeks later EAL ceased operations.
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Ah... the L-1011 and Eastern Airlines... two great stories of aviation history. The TriStar is one of my favorite airliners of all time.
 
Ah... the L-1011 and Eastern Airlines... two great stories of aviation history. The TriStar is one of my favorite airliners of all time.
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Some pics from that trip ...

Unscheduled pre-dawn stop at Nashville on the eastbound trip from LAX, to wait out the fog in ATL:

Caribbean_Cruise_1991_01001.jpg



At foggy ATL, waiting for the connection to SJU. We made it to the cruise ship in San Juan with 20 minutes to spare. No kidding.

Caribbean_Cruise_1991_01002.jpg



In the SJU terminal, waiting to board the delayed L-1011 back to ATL.

Caribbean_Cruise_1991_01078.jpg
 
Avianca 52 in January 1990. Was flying from MDE to JFK. We spent what seemed like an eternity holding. Then it seemed like we were going to land and the cabin was being prepped. Was very turbulent and dark. Then we held again. Then we began descending again. The pilots must have missed the runway because they executed a missed approach at what seemed like the last second. The cabin was for some reason playing classical music over the PA. Then the music abruptly stopped and the cabin lights started flickering, and then they went out completely. The cabin was pitch black. Some people began screaming but most were deathly silent and holding hands or praying. We heard the engines surge then it became eerily quiet. No communication from the flight deck or flight crew whatsoever. At this point I knew something was very wrong and I assumed the brace position on my own. A few seconds later we crashed, I remember a deafening sound and being launched forward. This apparently only took a fraction of a second but I felt my seat was flying through the cabin for a minute, and i remember predicting where my seat and body would impact (into another passenger, as it turned out) and thinking that was it, I was going to die. The next thing I remember is waking up in the Nassau County Medical Center hospital a couple days later with numerous fractures, a concussion, and severe lacerations and bruising. I basically couldn't move at all. It felt very surreal.

I was apparently one of the last rescued from the plane and medevaced at around 3 AM. I found out later that the first responders initially thought I was dead, but that I briefly regained consciousness at some point and cried out before passing out again, which probably saved my life. While I was in the ICU I had several successful surgeries to stem the internal bleeding that was quite literally killing me. I didn't walk for a month, and had to fight painkiller withdrawal when I was finally discharged. Then I spent the next 6 months in physical rehab.

Needless to say I did not fly Avianca again. The rest is history.
 
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