AD Log Question

Discussion in 'Maintenance Bay' started by Eric Lehto, Feb 9, 2019.

  1. Eric Lehto

    Eric Lehto Pre-Flight

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    So in March my plane will be going through its 1st Annual with me as its owner. It's a 1979 Beechcraft Sundowner.

    Anyway, I bought in to AD Log to clean up/organize the records. I've been going through all the AD's and the associated AD Note sheets. I've got quite a few that don't apply to my airplane (PN/SN/Age). So I've been handwriting what I've found regarding why they're N/A on sticky notes and sticking them on the AD Note sheets for the time being.

    I haven't seen anything in the AD Log for keeping these N/A AD Notes or the rationale for why they're N/A. Seems like there would be value to keeping them and providing detailed rationale for why they were determined NA for future reference.

    Am I missing something obvious?
     
  2. alfadog

    alfadog En-Route

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    I am going through the education process on this as a fairly new A&P. My take on it is that, if one searches the FAA AD db and comes up with an AD as possibly applicable, then it behooves the owner and the certifying A&P/IA (100-hr./annual) to notate the fact that this AD that the FAA search turned up is N/A and why. That becomes part of the maintenance records. That is as regards ADs that can easily be eliminated by S/N or "not installed". Some ADs require physically checking something on the a/c to determine that they are N/A, say by P/N. In that case, if an A&P/IA has previously certified that then I go with that in my report. Similarly if an AD has been p/c/w (previously complied with), all I am looking for is a certificate number for whoever previously signed it off. That leaves the recurring ADs and new ones for my attention. Or any missed ones.
     
  3. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    Your IA is going to do an AD search, just take a highlighter to each AD entry. Then create an AD log.
     
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  4. Bell206

    Bell206 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Good on the AD Log. But if you never done an AD search it's better to get an AP/IA to do the initial entry into the AD Log. Plus if any ADs require actual aircraft entries it will need an A&P signature. Once completed this log becomes the AD record required by the FARs so it's best to get it set up correct from the start.

    On the Not Applicable side, it can be a double edge sword. If an AD is N/A because the AD applicability statement does not apply to your aircraft, e.g., C172 vs C182, no log entry is required. If the AD does apply to your aircraft, e.g., C172, but is N/A by a separate factor under C172s, e.g., C172D model vs C172H model, then a signed log entry is required showing N/A by model number. The AD applicability statements can be rather cryptic and can throw even experienced IA/APs for a flip.
     
  5. Eric Lehto

    Eric Lehto Pre-Flight

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    Yeah, I understand all of the above. Thanks for the help. I've been doing my research based on previous log book entries and some other invoice/records from previous annuals. Previous IA's simply noted N/A by SN, etc. In my mind it makes sense to make some notes about why the AD is NA (SN Installed is xxxxx, NA per AD applicability; last engine OH xx/xx/xxxx, NA per AD applicability, etc) to avoid this duplication of effort down the road for the next owner/IA). At least gives them a starting point on their hunt.

    And I'm making all my notes on sticky pads so the IA can make all the necessary entries. This should be especially helpful to him for the PCW entries because I'm noting when ADs were previously complied with (per my logs). Less digging required for him.

    I just hate seeing "NA - SN" listed in previous reports, that aren't a required part of the maintenance records. A little rationale permanently recorded just seems to make sense.

    So, for those of you using AD Log, are you just throwing away the AD Note sheets for the N/A ADs and writing "NA" in the column on the AD report supplied by Aerotech?
     
  6. Bell206

    Bell206 Cleared for Takeoff

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    I think you're on a great path. But as an A&P I always defer to the mechanic who will be putting their name on things. Being this is an important step with your records I would recommend asking your IA first and follow his specific preferences on anything concerning the AD Log.
     
  7. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Want to reinforce alfadog's comment on physically checking the airplane where possible*. I will also add; not trusting anything previously written in the logs/maintenance notes/ad compliance record regardless of which very esteemed IA or A+P has signed it. Especially ignore anything that resembles "PCW" or "P C/W".

    So if the AD says PN or SN range etc, ignore the notes in your logbook that say you don't have that part. Go to the airplane. Take a pen, notepad, bright light, mirror, or cell phone etc and (where possible) verify what part you do have and its PNs, SNs etc (then search for ADs [& SBs while you are at it] on that part), or verify that the white dot is present, or that the switch turns off the motor or that the nutplate has no cracking etc etc.


    (*if it is an internal engine component for example, sometimes the best you can do is refer to work orders, receipts, yellow tags, any documentation you can come up with)
     
  8. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    I will respectfully disagree with you on this. I have seen too many mechanic's sigs below things that were never checked as stated. Here is a non-AD example; for years (probably decades) mechanics had been signing off the change in W&B on my airplane before I bought it as being some 10 or 12 FEET AFT of the EWCG. Yes it was a typo but many subsequent mechanics had pencil whipped it during each radio addition or removal, without truly checking or thinking about it.

    Also; those 'automated AD printouts' (as I call them)? They are not going to catch every accessory or appliance or other modification that is added to the airplane unless you tell the computer that it is installed. They are easy - type in watcha got, wait for it to spit out your list. Classic GIGO situation.
     
  9. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    One thing that will help you or someone else down the road is when writing in your notes why it was determined that a particular AD is not applicable or terminated - write down the specific basis for this determination on your aircraft's first AD summary.
    You might write in, 'the starter in AD 01012013 is not on the airplane as of this date having been removed 1/1/15 (see P3 of engine log #2) and replaced with starter model/PN/SN which has no ADs on it as of this date (see purchase order for new starter on P51 of aircraft maintenance notes)'. After 10 years of ownership, you might be a little hazy as why you wrote "N/A" but if you have these notes it will help you...and these things do crop up later)
     
  10. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking PoA Supporter

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    Just a note, ADlog does the AD search, prints out the whole AD and adds it to the record.
    That is why they have you do a inventory of the aircraft and its appliances.
    All the Owner or A&P need do is verify each as AD for compliance.
    When the AD is found not applicable just log it as that right on the AD in the log "this AD is not applicable due to serial number". there is a place right on the AD to do that.
     
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  11. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking PoA Supporter

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    ADlog, does the AD search. From then on it is up to the A&P-IA to verify all ADs.
    ADlog simply makes that job easier.
     
  12. Eric Lehto

    Eric Lehto Pre-Flight

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    Yeah, my thoughts exactly.

    I'll have to take another look (I don't have my AD Log materials in front of me). I don't remember seeing and entry space for that on any of the AD pages supplied by AD Log. Also didn't get a binder divider for NA AD's. Just recurring AD's and 1 time compliance.
     
  13. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking PoA Supporter

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    Then you most likely didn't get each AD printed out.
     
  14. Eric Lehto

    Eric Lehto Pre-Flight

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    I got an AD Note sheet for each AD on the report. Each sheet has fields at the top for make/model/SN, a large field for recording compliance date and time (lots of space for recurring inspections) and the detailed text of each AD


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  15. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking PoA Supporter

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    My suggestion would be, follow the instructions given.

    Your A&P-IA will most likely want it done his way, anyway.

    I've never done it your option's way.
     
  16. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    don't mess up your logs with that crap.....

    as others said, update the AD log. There probably is one. I do a spread sheet and list every AD that could be applicable for what's "installed" in the aircraft. Most are "not applicable by serial number", but others will have how they were compliant and who signed and the date. Then if someone wants to go back and verify all the work was really done, vs just signed off, you just gave them an easy paper trail to piece things together and verify.
     
  17. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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  18. James W.

    James W. Filing Flight Plan

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    As an A&P IA I can help. An AD compliance log must be kept with each aircraft. To answer the question about the NA block. Each AD must be recorded in the aircraft log book by date and time and a brief exploration as to why it's A. NA B. a one time inspection and what was found or C. If it's a recurring AD. In your case log books should contain all the info. Also props, appliances, airframe all my contain Ad's. An IA can help you with all this.
     
  19. James W.

    James W. Filing Flight Plan

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    I make my entries NA By S/N and P/N then list what is installed. Saves me time in the future and eliminates headaches for mechanics coming behind me.