Another F-35 lost, 1/24

Historical context. Attached is a list of USAAF aircraft accidents -- stateside, non-combat -- over the course of one month of WW2, June 1943. Presumably the weather would have been relatively benign that time of year. If the letter 'K' appears in the "Action Code" column, there was at least one fatality.

http://www.aviationarchaeology.com/src/AARmonthly/Jun1943S.htm
 
I'm not a huge F-35 fan, but if I recall the history correctly, both the F-14 and F-111 has some pretty significant early trouble. Some might disagree, but both of those aircraft ended up being pretty useful.
 
Craig said:
JPALS maybe....
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Possibility, but the real difficulty with a pitching deck is that it is not necessarily always a perfect cycle/period. As the ship moves across the water, the swells and valleys can be kind of random in the open ocean, so you don't have a predictable up/down movement of the deck always. Depending on which way the ship is driving (relative to the waves) as well as any listing from the ship being unbalanced and "leaning", you can also often have an even more unpredictable dutch roll. We're talking like 10 ish feet of hook to ramp clearance on a 3 wire boat, on a day when the deck isn't moving, so there isn't a lot of room for error. Hence why the LSOs use the manual techniques that they use during a pitching deck recovery (MOVLAS, bumping you up in the middle-in close to make sure you have the ramp cleared and then dropping you like a rock as you cross the ramp, and plentiful waveoffs when the deck movement isn't in sync with where the airplane is in the sky)
 
Kenny Phillips said:
Automation can likely recover from an incident which leaves the pilot in a WTF condition.
Automation is not without risks, but once sorted, you can, say, move tens of millions of people in tin cans seven miles high without incident. Unsorted, you have MCAS.
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It will never be “sorted” because there will always be edge cases not yet considered, and the more you “sort” the higher the possibility you introduce new issues.
 
There were some posts on this thread which look to have been removed. Why?
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
There were some posts on this thread which look to have been removed. Why?
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A potentially inflammatory post and several which referenced it have been hidden from view while the management council discusses appropriate corrective actions.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
Ugh. That's what I suspected. I embraced POA and abandoned FB for just this reason.
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You should not be surprised. We have rules here. Posts not in compliance with those rules get deleted. I have had some deleted. It’s easy to do sometimes. Overall makes the place much better.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
...We have rules here...
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I'm 100% supportive of moderators keeping the discourse civil. In this case, someone posted a very sensational, aviation-related story that myself and several others immediately questioned its veracity. It seems the group would have sorted out truth from fiction pretty quickly w/o moderator intervention. I'm likely (over) reacting b/c of several recent examples of suppressed stories which have turned out to be true.

BTW, I was up in your neck of the woods yesterday. It was such a nice day KJNX was a complete zoo.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
I'm 100% supportive of moderators keeping the discourse civil. In this case, someone posted a very sensational, aviation-related story that myself and several others immediately questioned its veracity. It seems the group would have sorted out truth from fiction pretty quickly w/o moderator intervention. I'm likely (over) reacting b/c of several recent examples of suppressed stories which have turned out to be true.

BTW, I was up in your neck of the woods yesterday. It was such a nice day KJNX was a complete zoo.
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That was one of the stops on my long cross country for the private certificate. Been there many times since.
 
Morgan3820 said:
Can I see? I won’t tell anyone
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I believe there was a post that blamed the crash on the pilot having heart issues due to the covid vaccine. I did not see any of the replies so I missed the subsequent circus, but I can somewhat imagine how it went. I have not seen any other reference to that vaccine theory anywhere else so the post was likely an attempt at trolling. Probably best that it was deleted. Typical fake news trolling from a certain mindset.
 
SkyDog58 said:
I believe there was a post that blamed the crash on the pilot having heart issues due to the covid vaccine...
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I sent @Morgan3820 a link to the story referenced by the poster. I'm on the fence as to if moderator intervention was merited in this case. I'm sure POA has a good methodology for deciding truth from fiction. However, we've seen recently how centralized truth arbitration works so it bothers me that somehow I'm not able to make such a decision for myself.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
I sent @Morgan3820 a link to the story referenced by the poster. I'm on the fence as to if moderator intervention was merited in this case. I'm sure POA has a good methodology for deciding truth from fiction. However, we've seen recently how centralized truth arbitration works so it bothers me that somehow I'm not able to make such a decision for myself.
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Looking at the other stories posted it was obvious to me that was all satirical. But, whatever. Moving on.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Yeah. As in more than one but not sure how many. You keeping count for me? I didn’t know you cared that much. I’m blushing.

I’ve deleted way more of my posts than the mods have over the years. I think they allow plenty here…
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Just funnin’ you.
 
MICHAEL MAHN said:
I sent @Morgan3820 a link to the story referenced by the poster. I'm on the fence as to if moderator intervention was merited in this case. I'm sure POA has a good methodology for deciding truth from fiction. However, we've seen recently how centralized truth arbitration works so it bothers me that somehow I'm not able to make such a decision for myself.
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I saw that article, it was completely bonkers. What is sad is that there will be people that will take it as face value and spread it around the web. I have an aunt I’m fully expecting to email me it within a few days.
 
Groundpounder said:
I saw that article, it was completely bonkers. What is sad is that there will be people that will take it as face value and spread it around the web. I have an aunt I’m fully expecting to email me it within a few days.
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One of my wife's aunts emailed us (both) an article some years back telling about J. K. Rowling's devil worship, and how all of the Harry Potter books were basically satanic recruitment propaganda. The article was, as you may have already guessed, The Onion. I broke my rule about never replying to stuff like that and explained to her -- as politely as I could -- that she should familiarize herself with the source of articles like that before taking them as fact.
 
Babylon Bee is a good one. There's a military themed one too, called the Duffel? I think
 
When I was a kid my favorite plane was the B58 Hustler. I think I found out later that about a quarter of all that were built crashed
 
Albany Tom said:
I'm not a huge F-35 fan, but if I recall the history correctly, both the F-14 and F-111 has some pretty significant early trouble. Some might disagree, but both of those aircraft ended up being pretty useful.
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Scott Kelly's book "Endurance" has a couple of chapters about the F-14. As much as we all love them it had some issues and a number of people got killed in them before they developed a digital flight control system which Kelley worked on when he was a test pilot.
 
Silvaire said:
Scott Kelly's book "Endurance" has a couple of chapters about the F-14. As much as we all love them it had some issues and a number of people got killed in them before they developed a digital flight control system which Kelley worked on when he was a test pilot.
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No question about the improvement in handling qualities (and boarding rate!) with DFCS, but finally ****canning the TF30's probably had as much to do with saving lives as the DFCS. :eek:

Nauga,
not with a whimper, but a BANG
 
Yep, the TF-30s had a lot of issues. Primarily high AoA with high yaw. They liked compressor stalls. Kara Hultgreen would probably be alive today if GEs were behind her. Early Tomcats were a maintenance nightmare as well. Abysmal FMC rates. It required almost 50 hrs maint for 1 hr flying. The last couple of deployments I read they had some pretty reliable aircraft but that probably had more to do with an unlimited GWOT budget than anything.

5548F51B-6A6C-4C1B-AE73-7D9B88610DBE.jpeg
 
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Sierra_Hotel said:
Video on Instagram this morning claims to show a ramp strike as the cause of this crash. You can hear a handful of power just before coming across the stern. Trying to find a link.


*ETA: https://theaviationist.com/2022/01/...5c-mishap-landing-on-uss-carl-vinson-emerges/
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It was absolutely not a ramp strike. Aircraft that hit the ramp generally are in small pieces. What it probably was based on the video was a pulling the power back in the middle of the approach to work off a high energy state with a rapid but late application of power in close that was unable to arrest the sink rate. This probably caused considerable damage and a gear collapse. Impact point was prior to the one wire based on LSO injuries.
 
Jeff767 said:
It was absolutely not a ramp strike. Aircraft that hit the ramp generally are in small pieces. What it probably was based on the video was a pulling the power back in the middle of the approach to work off a high energy state with a rapid but late application of power in close that was unable to arrest the sink rate. This probably caused considerable damage and a gear collapse. Impact point was prior to the one wire based on LSO injuries.
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Watch the video in the link above. It’s pretty eye opening.

Found the whole video here.
https://gettr.com/post/pst16ob03b
 
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