Round-the-world teen sailor feared lost at sea

"They" is the people who respond when somebody calls them for help by pushing the button on their EPIRB, as this girl did.
-harry

You're saying the AFRCC (or foreign equivalent) chartered a jet for 300,000? Or did they request an airliner divert from a planned route?

Somewhere someone makes the decision "is this a valid use of resources".

I'm having a hard time with the $300,000 price tag - or is this accounting similar to that used by hospitals?
 
I just did a little research on the boat (the search for which has now been permanently abandoned, apparently).

Saith Wikipedia (in its article about Abby):

Sunderland's yacht Wild Eyes was a 40-foot (12.19 m) sloopsingle-handed through the Southern Ocean. Under its earlier name built in 2001 by A.S.A. Yachts PTY, Australia, designed by Jutson Yacht specifically for sailing BTC Velocity the vessel finished second in the Class 3 (Open 40) category of the Around Alone 2002 race.
I'm not a superstitious man, but I believe it's an old tradition that a vessel should never be renamed. In fact, a few years ago, my brothers re-named a boat -- which capsized in relatively calm seas with both of them on board not long thereafter. They survived, but were pretty shaken up by the experience.

-Rich
 
You're saying the AFRCC (or foreign equivalent) chartered a jet for 300,000? Or did they request an airliner divert from a planned route?
The news is reporting that Australian authorities chartered a Qantas A330 to fly from Perth to search for her. It's apparently a flight of several hours in each direction; I don't know how much time they spent searching for her.

I don't know where the cost estimate came from, or how accurate it is, or whether some reported just pulled it out of his butt, but I would presume that such a number would attempt to cover more than just the cost of that one flight.
-harry
 
I think all recreational adventurists should pay for SAR if something goes wrong regardless of their mode of adventure. Better yet, they should be required to buy SAR insurance before they disembark on their adventure. Rates proportionate to the risk involved.

Can't afford the insurance? Don't go.
 
They chartered a jet to find her? Who is "they"? If "they" chartered the jet, "they" better have the money.

The Australian Government, that's who. Her beacon went off in, but at the edge of, their zone of responsibility and they don't have the the resources of the USCG to send a plane out so they chartered an A-330 from Quantas.
 
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No, I didn't. And if this is true of boats on the open seas then I agree with you. However, if 99% of these ships are recreational and remain close to shore then I don't think someone circumnavigating the globe in open water poses much danger to them.

No, I'm talking about open ocean. If you want to talk coastal and littoral waters, the number goes up further.
 
You're saying the AFRCC (or foreign equivalent) chartered a jet for 300,000? Or did they request an airliner divert from a planned route?

Somewhere someone makes the decision "is this a valid use of resources".

I'm having a hard time with the $300,000 price tag - or is this accounting similar to that used by hospitals?

Aussie Government. What do you think it costs to operate an A-330 for say 10hrs or whatever its max range is? (They barely got away with an A-330, from what I heard they almost had to use a 747. It was not a "diverted airliner" is was a plane specifically dispatched for SAR.
 
I'm an avid sailor. I have sailed throughout the Bahama chain and all around S. Florida. My last boat was a 33ft Hunter. I have single-hand sailed through weather that took everything that a 180 lb adult male could handle. I think that turning a 16 yr old loose to do such a thing, is no more than a foolish stunt. Could it be done? ....Sure. But is it worth losing your little girl over?...Absolutly not. Some things just arent worth the risk involved. I'm sure that she is a gifted sailor. But such excursions ALONE, are simply stupiud IMHO. Weather pops up, things break, Sometimes an extra hand is needed and life could depend on it. Too many variables,Too little to gain, Too much to lose for bragging rights. No matter how mentally mature she seems, Sometimes things happen out there that take more than maturity. Fall overboard w/ a broken arm, Your suddenly trolled bait. The parents of these kids are in a race to set the youngest record at what potential cost? IMHO, I think the worst judgement call belonged to the parents.
 
I think all recreational adventurists should pay for SAR if something goes wrong regardless of their mode of adventure. Better yet, they should be required to buy SAR insurance before they disembark on their adventure...
Sounds reasonable to suggest that .... hey, wait, aren't those crazy people who fly around in little airplanes adventurists who sometimes require the services of SAR? :)
-harry
 
The Australian Government, that's who. Her beacon went off in, but at the edge of, their zone of responsibility and they don't have the the resources of the USCG to send a plane out so they chartered an A-330 from Quantas.

Wow. They should buy a few surplus C-130s. They make great SAR airplanes.

-Rich
 
a 16-year old sailing around the world? What kind of parent lets that happen?

There's a range of ages for which a parent's primary parental responsibility is to prevent the kids from finding a dumb way to kill themselves. 16 is within this range. Parenting fail.

Her parents earn a FAIL for letting her do something so incredibly risky.

is a publicity hound.

good God, there should be a license required to have children, these parents are morons.

I think that turning a 16 yr old loose to do such a thing, is no more than a foolish stunt.

This is the kind of crap people on sailing boards must say about parents who let their kids fly solo at 16. :rolleyes:
 
Aussie Government. What do you think it costs to operate an A-330 for say 10hrs or whatever its max range is? (They barely got away with an A-330, from what I heard they almost had to use a 747. It was not a "diverted airliner" is was a plane specifically dispatched for SAR.

Why the hell did they need such a huge airplane? Sheesh, don't they have any G-VSP's in Australia? :dunno:
 
This is the kind of crap people on sailing boards must say about parents who let their kids fly solo at 16. :rolleyes:
I'd say the same thing about a parent who sent his 16-year-old on a solo trans-oceanic flight in a light single. And that's before I find out that the parent is hitting up networks for a reality tv deal about his daredevil kids.
-harry
 
Wow. They should buy a few surplus C-130s. They make great SAR airplanes.

-Rich

They're good for kicking things like pumps and life rafts out of, but kinda slow for doing locating work (USCG uses Falcons), besides, they ain't exactly cheap to operate either.
 
They're good for kicking things like pumps and life rafts out of, but kinda slow for doing locating work (USCG uses Falcons), besides, they ain't exactly cheap to operate either.

Yeah, that's true.

Too bad the NSA satellites are too busy looking for capacitors being parachuted to bypass customs. I'll bet they could have had her coordinates in no time flat. :rolleyes:

-Rich
 
I am just a little curious. If a parent were to leave their 16 year old child alone at home for a couple of weeks what does the law say about the parents? Have they committed a crime?
 
Yeah, that's true.

Too bad the NSA satellites are too busy looking for capacitors being parachuted to bypass customs. I'll bet they could have had her coordinates in no time flat. :rolleyes:

-Rich

COPASS/SARSAT had her numbers relayed down to the GMDSS SAR Earth Stations within minutes of her activating her EPIRB. That code also gave the registration code with her name, address and emergency contact phone numbers. That's why the maritime world went lovingly to the 406 system, not kicking and screaming like the aviation world is (and the GMDSS rated ones cost the same as aircraft ones). The plane is needed to get "eyes on" and within VHF range of her.
 
+1. I cringe every time I hear "Indian Ocean" and "sailboat" in the same sentence.

I'm an avid sailor. I have sailed throughout the Bahama chain and all around S. Florida. My last boat was a 33ft Hunter. I have single-hand sailed through weather that took everything that a 180 lb adult male could handle. I think that turning a 16 yr old loose to do such a thing, is no more than a foolish stunt. Could it be done? ....Sure. But is it worth losing your little girl over?...Absolutly not. Some things just arent worth the risk involved. I'm sure that she is a gifted sailor. But such excursions ALONE, are simply stupiud IMHO. Weather pops up, things break, Sometimes an extra hand is needed and life could depend on it. Too many variables,Too little to gain, Too much to lose for bragging rights. No matter how mentally mature she seems, Sometimes things happen out there that take more than maturity. Fall overboard w/ a broken arm, Your suddenly trolled bait. The parents of these kids are in a race to set the youngest record at what potential cost? IMHO, I think the worst judgement call belonged to the parents.
 
I wondered that too. There's gotta be something more cost effective than an A330 for this job ?
I was curious where she was "lost" so I pulled up this map from her site. It looks like her last position was the width of the US away from Australia. It would be like flying from NY to LA before you could even start searching.

http://www.abbysunderland.com/location-route.php
 
I wondered that too. There's gotta be something more cost effective than an A330 for this job ?

We're talking mid Indian Ocean here, need legs. The most cost effective long term solution for these situations since they come up so rarely is to charter the minimum jet one can from an airline when you need one. They probably only do this once every few years. Doesn,t make sense to support a G-VSP for that. The A-330 is the minimum cost aircraft that Quantas has that would fulfill the mission range requirements and it just barely did. Australia is a small country with a large landmass. There's only a population base down here of 22 million or so and the GNP isn't that dang high.
 
This is the kind of crap people on sailing boards must say about parents who let their kids fly solo at 16. :rolleyes:

Et tu, Kent, with the rolleyes?

If they hear about parents letting their kids fly across the ocean and around the world at 16? Yea, they should say something.

Most parents expose children to risk on a graduated scale. You send them off, observe, teach, and push them farther out of the nest next time. It's been done that way for a long time. Sending them off on the penultimate sailing adventure alone at an age when most kids are learning to drive is, in my opinion, parental malpractice.

Now that it sounds like the dad was looking for a reality show deal or some other source of publicity and money seems to me to be unbelievably exploitative.
 
I was curious where she was "lost" so I pulled up this map from her site. It looks like her last position was the width of the US away from Australia. It would be like flying from NY to LA before you could even start searching.

http://www.abbysunderland.com/location-route.php


Looks to be about 2500nm from Perth which is where the plane would be fueled, so you need something that can fly there, get low and do a few orbits, climb out (lot's of fuel for that) and get back to Perth with reserves. That takes a significant aircraft.
 
Most parents expose children to risk on a graduated scale. You send them off, observe, teach, and push them farther out of the nest next time. It's been done that way for a long time. Sending them off on the penultimate sailing adventure alone at an age when most kids are learning to drive is, in my opinion, parental malpractice.

Now that it sounds like the dad was looking for a reality show deal or some other source of publicity and money seems to me to be unbelievably exploitative.

This.

The father (and I use that term loosely) and mother (likewise) need some serious help.

Octomom, balloon boy, this stunt...ugh.
 
+1. I cringe every time I hear "Indian Ocean" and "sailboat" in the same sentence.


Why? IO ain't all that bad, I've sailed all 3 Capes, you just need to know what the hell you're doing and have a properly found vessel. She lost her rig which tells me that she was improperly equipped, over canvased for the conditions, or lost control on a sled ride, possibly a combination of all 3. I've sailed through hurricanes and came out the other side.

I find it funny that people are now condemning this because pops had a TV contract. That's finding it wrong for the wrong reason. The reason is solid, and for all I care dad can produce Jackass Jr with his kids, he's got more than plenty and it seems like they subscribe to the Doritos theorem, "crunch all you want, we'll make more." What she did is wrong because it endangered other people. I could care less if she kills herself.
 
Dad should care if she kills herself.

I'm more of the opinion of Bill Cosby's dad, "I brought you into this world and I can take you out." I don't care if he sells her into slavery, it's his kid, and that's something for others to deal with.
 
Aussie Government. What do you think it costs to operate an A-330 for say 10hrs or whatever its max range is? (They barely got away with an A-330, from what I heard they almost had to use a 747. It was not a "diverted airliner" is was a plane specifically dispatched for SAR.


OK - But since the plane couldn't do anything (drop gear, etc) other than find the boat - I question the decision to launch an airplane that would cost that much. Alert mariners in the area (who should go look, render assistance, and submit a bill), sure.

I guess I'm saying I wouldn't launch an aircraft in this case. Passenger liner going down? Maybe, just to confirm location. Single sailor? Nope.
 
Okay, this is how I see it.

It's not easy to sail a boat, and what Abby wanted to do would be a challenge even for seasoned sailors with many years of experience.

But one thing that seems undisputed is that Abby is a seasoned sailor with many years of experience. Apparently she's been sailing since she could walk, and had been preparing for this voyage in particular since she was 13. It's said (although obviously I have no idea whether it's true) that her father tested her skills for those years, and finally made the decision to allow her to undertake the voyage during an unusually challenging day of sailing, with him on board.

"Do you still want to sail around the world?" He's said to have asked. Abby's response reportedly was, "Where's my boat?"

I know little about Abby's sailing skills except that what she did accomplish was more than I expect I could. But one thing I haven't heard alleged is that her sailing skills were deficient. Now, that says nothing about her judgment, maturity, emotional fitness, or any other factors that none of us are in a position to judge unless we know her. But by all accounts she is an accomplished sailor with a great deal of experience, much of it acquired when she was a little child, when newly-learned skills quickly become second nature.

So what is the issue, really, other than what Henning and others have pointed out about the inherent risks of the voyage regardless of who would undertake it? It's that she's only 16. If she were 18, her predicament would barely have attracted the passing notice of the media because she would be an adult.

I submit that the controversy at hand has nothing to do with Abby's sailing skills. I further submit that speculation about her maturity level is just that, because none of us know her (as far as I know, anyway). So all that's left is whether it was acceptable for a 16-year-old who is an accomplished sailor to be allowed by her parents to undertake a dangerous voyage, all by herself.

My opinion is this: I have no idea because I don't know Abby. But...

  • I know that I had dangerous hobbies at that age. I climbed mountains and explored caves, two fairly dangerous outdoor activities.
  • I know that 16-year-olds are allowed to drive (probably the most dangerous thing most people do, statistically speaking).
  • I know 16-year-old student pilots are allowed to fly their cross-country solos, which requires a pretty substantial degree of emotional maturity and responsibility, and carries a fair degree of risk.
  • I know I made a decision to join the military when I was 16, and went on active duty when I was 17.
  • I know that 16-year-olds are often prosecuted as adults by the justice system.
So assuming that she has the skills, which seems beyond dispute, I really have to refrain from second-guessing her parents. Apparently the whole family is an adventurous lot. Would I let my daughter do it? Were her passion for the sea and her skills were up to the voyage, it's possible I might have.

Not likely, but possible.

But that's me, and I don't claim to be any sort of an authority on parenting. I did a less-than-perfect job of it, quite frankly, which is perhaps another reason I'm reluctant to criticize the Sunderlands.

As for the book, the movie, the reality show, or whatever else they have up their sleeves, why not? It's a fascinating story with many lessons to be learned from it. So why not share it? I doubt they just decided one day, "Hey, let's stick Abby in a sloop and send her around the world as a publicity stunt."

In summary, I think there's been too much of a rush to condemn these parents, when it seems to me they did a pretty splendid job raising a very mature, competent, and capable young lady.

-Rich
 
I'm sure lots of sailors can handle that ocean, but the ones I read about evidently aren't in that group. Whatever the perils and pitfalls may be, they seem to encounter them with regularity and with predictable results.

Why? IO ain't all that bad, I've sailed all 3 Capes, you just need to know what the hell you're doing and have a properly found vessel. She lost her rig which tells me that she was improperly equipped, over canvased for the conditions, or lost control on a sled ride, possibly a combination of all 3. I've sailed through hurricanes and came out the other side.

I find it funny that people are now condemning this because pops had a TV contract. That's finding it wrong for the wrong reason. The reason is solid, and for all I care dad can produce Jackass Jr with his kids, he's got more than plenty and it seems like they subscribe to the Doritos theorem, "crunch all you want, we'll make more." What she did is wrong because it endangered other people. I could care less if she kills herself.
 
We're talking mid Indian Ocean here, need legs. The most cost effective long term solution for these situations since they come up so rarely is to charter the minimum jet one can from an airline when you need one. They probably only do this once every few years. Doesn,t make sense to support a G-VSP for that.

I wasn't thinking about supporting a G-VSP just for SAR, I was just thinking that there might be one available for charter in a country that's as relatively isolated. Or maybe even a corporate one that'd be willing to go check out the situation.
 
I'm more of the opinion of Bill Cosby's dad, "I brought you into this world and I can take you out." I don't care if he sells her into slavery, it's his kid, and that's something for others to deal with.


Sorry Dude, That's just terrible that you feel that way. I hope noone feels this kind of indifference toward your children.
 
Sorry Dude, That's just terrible that you feel that way. I hope noone feels this kind of indifference toward your children.

I'm going out on a limb here, and saying that I think Henning was being dramatic to make a point...
 
Sorry Dude, That's just terrible that you feel that way. I hope noone feels this kind of indifference toward your children.

im going to go out on a limb here and say that if Henning has any children, he doesnt know about them :ihih:
 
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