Private checkride went horribly wrong!

[MikeELP]

Even when I fail, I fail spectacularly.

You're doing great job of that here...that's for sure.




Mike

 

[pflemming]

The facts as we know them to be . . . . the examinee:

Passed an mock exam from his CFI who signed him off to take his checkride.
Passed the written portion of the exam and has the requisite signoff
Appeared at the Practical and became 'unsettled from the attitude of the DPE;'
Decided, without asking, to record the rest of the test;
The DPE pink slipped him - allegedly for 'not satisfying the PTS' and according to the OP because he 'had it out for him' 'because he was recording the test, which was his right,'
The DPE asked the CFI if the OP had a non-disclosed mental defect or mind altering drug;
He filed a complaint with the FSDO - or maybe he didn't, we're not sure;
He is threatening to sue the guy because of some perceived potential non-extant something the DPE might has said to the CFI in the form of a question;
He just wants to 'get along,' and take another test, without any 'attitude' from the DPE. . .

Is there a psychiatrist in the house? Or someone who stayed in a Holiday In Express last night?

Is this a correct statement of the Facts Mr. Flemming et. al.?

Yes, thank you, I feel that you are one of the few who understand what I am saying.

Didn't care for that bit about a psychiatrist though...

 

[pflemming]

Where as you sound like an arrogant prick in every post you make....

Takes one to know one. If we had an "ego-meter" in POA, you would self score right up there I'm sure, Mr Know-it-all!

 

[douglas393]

Yes, thank you, I feel that you are one of the few who understand what I am saying.

Didn't care for that bit about a psychiatrist though...

You don't get it do you? Comanchepilot was not supporting you, he was pointing out how wrong you are.

 

[Henning]

Yes, thank you, I feel that you are one of the few who understand what I am saying.

Didn't care for that bit about a psychiatrist though...

Lol, everyone understands what you are saying, you just don't like everyone's conclusion, including his, you need psychiatrist.

 

[pflemming]

Was wondering that myself. Not many folks take their PP-practical in a 4,000# aircraft - especially one that weighs 4,000# with only the pilot & CFI in it.

"Pete", do tell, what does your W&B sheet look like?

Okay so I used a little hyperbole for dramatic effect...

Although if I'm as inept as many of you think I am, having me twirl a ton of hot metal over your head is probably not a whole lot better is it?

 

[kenjr]

Well no, I won't face it. I don't mind being called names (sticks and stones, etc), but really there is a double standard if I get banned for this but it is okay for you.

By the way, congratulations on your checkride. I liked your write up. If anything, you should sympathize with me having also fallen prey to a dumbass DPE. Yes, you handled it better. But please don't let this PPL thing go to your head, you're just sounding a little bit like an arrogant prick at the moment.

You let yourself fall prey. Clearly you can't handle the pressure. The world is a cruel place. You either deal with and be the better man or crumble and come crying to the forum. Good luck with litigating the FAA. I'm sure that will work out really well for you. "But...but...I know I'm an a-hole...but he raised his voice to me!!!".

And I doubt I will get banned. I'm calling this one like I see it and I've actually contributed to this forum. You, well...not so much. I still cannot believe that 1) you are still here and 2) the admin's haven't just locked this thread. It's pure entertainment value at this point. Kinda like...you don't want to watch because it hurts...but can't turn your head...

And I'm far from being arrogant. Even though I had the very rare opportunity to teach my DPE a few things on my PPL checkride, I remain very humble and took the opportunity to learn on my checkride and actually befriend the DPE. He called me a couple days ago to follow-up on few questions about some avionics we talked about during the checkride.

Quit being a douche. Your life will get better. You should try it.

 

[Ken Ibold]

Yes, thank you, I feel that you are one of the few who understand what I am saying.

Didn't care for that bit about a psychiatrist though...

All admonishments aside, you have read what he wrote, but not the MEANING of what he wrote.

This flying thing, being a federally regulated activity, is very serious and well scripted almost every step of the way. It is said that FAA regulations are "written in blood" because over the last century people have figured out a lot of what causes misfortune to occur, and the FAA has codified solutions to those issues. What people are trying to explain to you is that attitude is an extremely important part of being a successful pilot. But that is a message you appear to choose not to hear. Your CFI or ground school should have gone over hazardous attitudes with you, but apparently that lesson has been forgotten.

Do yourself a favor. Dig out your old ground school book or do some google searches or whatever and read up on those hazardous attitudes. Think about what they mean. Make an honest appraisal of your own actions, without any grandstanding and without any audience. Your apparent refusal, not only to do that, but to accept that you may not be without any fault in this situation, is what has caused the piling on.

A PPL is a license to learn. After 500 hours, you'll still be learning. After 2000 hours you'll still be learning. Ditto 5000 hours. Do not fall into the trap that you have seen it all, or that your superior skills will dig you out of any hole. Remember that 100 years of history? That has shown anyone who cares to look the truth of that statement. This flying business is an unforgiving thing. I recently lost one of my best friends and my partner in the airplane as a result of a single thoughtless decision. This is serious stuff. You need to accept that, not only do you NOT know it all, you will NEVER know it all.

 

[MikeELP]

Okay so I used a little hyperbole for MORONIC effect...

FTFY....


Mike

 

[txflyer]

If I were a mean person, I would encourage you mr. Pete to hire an attorney.

Your failed flight and veiled threats into a lawyers pockets shows how little you know about legal matters.

 

[pflemming]

You let yourself fall prey. Clearly you can't handle the pressure. The world is a cruel place. You either deal with and be the better man or crumble and come crying to the forum. Good luck with litigating the FAA. I'm sure that will work out really well for you. "But...but...I know I'm an a-hole...but he raised his voice to me!!!".

And I doubt I will get banned. I'm calling this one like I see it and I've actually contributed to this forum. You, well...not so much. I still cannot believe that 1) you are still here and 2) the admin's haven't just locked this thread. It's pure entertainment value at this point. Kinda like...you don't want to watch because it hurts...but can't turn your head...

And I'm far from being arrogant. Even though I had the very rare opportunity to teach my DPE a few things on my PPL checkride, I remain very humble and took the opportunity to learn on my checkride and actually befriend the DPE. He called me a couple days ago to follow-up on few questions about some avionics we talked about during the checkride.

Quit being a douche. Your life will get better. You should try it.

Dude, you failed your PPL check ride, you're not my role model.

Go away.

 

[airheadpenguin]

okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

Yes! I did this very summer. Left my tablet at home by accident while taking family members up for a flight and breakfast in a part of the country I've never flown in. I could have easily gone home and picked it up but instead I bought a sectional at the local FBO and within 5 minutes had it folded appropriately (yes this is actually a part of the planning process) with a route planned.

Rather than looking like a tablet is required for make an antique fly, I looked like a calm collected pilot who can roll with the situation.

 

[Z06_Mir]

I've got $5 that says this whole thing is a troll attempt by that 'benpilot' (of a different board) guy.

I don't think it is. He forms his sentences much differently than Ben does.

Dude, you failed your PPL check ride, you're not my role model.

Go away.

I'm willing to bet a lot of people here have failed a checkride at one time or another. There are 10,000 hour ATPs here who take checkrides every 6 months. At some point in your career you're bound to fail one, it might be private and it might be a 121 recurrent... you just don't know. There is absolutely no reason to insult him for failing a checkride. No one insulted you for failing, they simply called you out on how stupid you look.

 

[kenjr]

Dude, you failed your PPL check ride, you're not my role model.

Go away.

Hmmm...goes to show that your reading comprehension sucks too.

Beginning to wonder, are you good at anything besides making an ass of yourself?

What a toolbox.

 

[pflemming]

If I were a mean person, I would encourage you mr. Pete to hire an attorney.

Your failed flight and veiled threats into a lawyers pockets shows how little you know about legal matters.

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

 

[JeffDG]

Dude, you failed your PPL check ride, you're not my role model.

Go away.

Dude, so did you...

 

[pflemming]

I don't think it is. He forms his sentences much differently than Ben does.


I'm willing to bet a lot of people here have failed a checkride at one time or another. There are 10,000 hour ATPs here who take checkrides every 6 months. At some point in your career you're bound to fail one, it might be private and it might be a 121 recurrent... you just don't know. There is absolutely no reason to insult him for failing a checkride. No one insulted you for failing, they simply called you out on how stupid you look.

Well, calling me out as a dumbass, douchebag, stupid, etc, not helpful. I came on here for advice. And the most aggressive is the most recent PPL, with a failure record to boot. Getting some "tough love" from some of the posters here I can handle, because they have thousands of hours and obviously know what they're talking about. Kenny though, sorry, he is just not, what's the word, worthy of even listening too. Happy for him for passing his PPL second time around, a situation I will repeat here soon too.

 

[JeffDG]

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

Anyone who wants to can express any opinion they like about you any time they want to.

I can say "I think you're coo-coo for cocopuffs" and there's not a thing you can do about it. I can tell your current employer, and everyone you interview with exactly the same thing, and there is nothing legally actionable about it.

 

[Henning]

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

Well, he wasn't making a diagnosis, and you aren't qualified to say that a statement about you being nuts is false.

 

[douglas393]

okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

My lesson from this is to bite my tongue and do that BS knowing inside I am right and he is wrong, but he is the one with the power to pass or fail me. Okay got it.

Did it this afternoon, and on purpose. I find non electronic pilotage to be a lot of fun. Took the plane out for my monthly(sometimes twice a month) maneuver practicing. After my clearing turns(which I did multiple times between different maneuvers) Did a few rounds of turn around a point(both right turns and left turns), followed by a dozen or so S turns, followed by a few rounds of turns around a pylon, and then some lazy eights. When I was done with that I did some chandelles to 5500 ft AGL, and then did some power on and power off stalls. At this point with all the turning, and what not, and one farm in the middle of florida looking pretty much like the next I truly did not know exactly where I was. My MFD was at full mag and so all I had was long and lat numbers. Well the next thing I did was an extended engine out glide which took me back down to 1000 ft(I would have made my chosen field anyhow). At this point it was time to head home(well actually to the non towered field northeast to do a few short field landings), but I did not know where I was. SO I got up to a few thousand feet to get my bearings, tried to figure out where I was(using my paper chart, and my eyeballs) and start heading to the field which was some 30 or 40 miles away(by my estimation). Once I felt pretty confident that I was where I thought I was I confirmed it with radials from two VORS. Flew the heading(using landmarks--a bare area in a field of green 5 or so miles ahead and then a small lake after that... ) and low and behold 20 minutes later I was on the radio announcing my position from the field. And then did my short field landings and then went home to my towered field. All my navigation done without the use of anything more than my eye balls, a paper chart, a heading indicator, and a VOR. Now I could have used my G1000 to do the same thing, but I had a lot more fun without. You should try it some time, you do not know what you are missing.

 

[kenjr]

And the most aggressive is the most recent PPL, with a failure record to boot.

It's real simple man - you are just wasting everyone's time. You started this thread looking for sympathy. Hopefully if you've learned anything so far...you aren't getting any. As someone who just busted my butt for 9 months and by all accounts had a very tough and thorough DPE...when I see this trash it just frustrates me.

And, as I mentioned you obviously can add reading comprehension to the list of things you suck at. My DPE's POI at the Dallas FSDO very clearly stated to me that under no circumstances should my DPE have failed me. My post to you was pretty clear - I was someone who SHOULDN'T have failed, but did, and yet had a DPE apologizng to me at the end of checkride that HE failed. I came back, passed it and made a friend in the process. I have way more reason to ****ed off, sending letters, filing complaints, etc... than you do. Grow up, you screwed up. Own it, take all the advice here to adjust your attitude and move on.

You refuse to learn anything - not a good quality for someone who thinks they are ready to be a pilot.

 

[douglas393]

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

You need to take a rest from this. Let's assume for the moment that everything you said about yourself, and your checkride is true. Then you are looking at this from a very bad and incorrect point of view. Believe it or not, everyone here is trying to help you, but you are so caught up in this whole paranoia thing that everyone is out to get you, that you are unable to see the truth. Do yourself a favor, stop posting for a day or so. Speak to someone you trust, show them this thread, and see what they say. Then after you have had time to think about it come back and start a new thread. The way you are headed can only going to lead to one outcome, and it's not going to say private pilot on the card.

 

[Ken Ibold]

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

You seem to think a lawyer letter is far more powerful than it actually is.

 

[Henning]

You seem to think a lawyer letter is far more powerful than it actually is.

Could even be counter productive when the DE shows it to the FSDO.

 

[MikeELP]

...Maybe he believes I have a screw loose.

He would not be alone.

Mike

 

[Ghery]

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

I've refrained from commenting (but have enjoyed reading this), but IIRC you originally stated that the DPE asked your CFI about certain items in your history. He did not make a statement. There is a difference.

BTW, I'm an EE with almost 40 years of experience. All but one year of that in a particular corner of the profession. Currently serve as the President of the IEEE EMC Society. Let me give you some unsolicited advice. You don't know it all and you never will. Neither do I. I'm always learning. I'm always learning about flying. I'm always learning about EMC. Oh, and I've failed a check ride, too. 1st attempt at the IR. I didn't blame the DPE, I know what I did wrong and fixed it. Passed on the second try. Take responsibility for your own life and stop blaming others when things don't work as you'd like.

There are a bunch of people on this board who make me look like an absolute novice when it comes to flying (I have just short of 400 hours). I love it when they get into discussions. I learn a lot. Remember a truth in aviation (and other fields) - learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make them all yourself. And a serious mistake is to think that you know it all. As I noted above, you don't, nor will you ever.

Some humility wouldn't hurt.

 

[pilot_dude]

Takes one to know one. If we had an "ego-meter" in POA, you would self score right up there I'm sure, Mr Know-it-all!

Since you were referring to Henning in this post I must say this is the first post you've made where I agree.

 

[Geico266]

Big difference between delusions of grandeur, and supreme self confidence and knowledge that I am the best in whatever I do. Even when I fail, I fail spectacularly.

So how is that working out for ya so far?

 

[airheadpenguin]

Um, no, if I disagree with a person with more experience who happens to be WRONG, that makes me right. The person who agrees with the one with more experience who is wrong, is the fool.

Don't be a fool John. Open your eyes. Open your ears. Expand your mind. Keep your mouth tightly shut.

A few people have pointed out that this should be treated as a conversation. Its useful when someone with considerably more experience is wrong to find out the basis of their assertion. If the basis or conclusion is still flawed when they are finished its time to educate them. At the same time you should carefully consider the basis for your assertion in light of potentially new information. In a conversation knowledge and perspectives are exchanged, people learn things and everyone comes out better. Insisting that they're WRONG isn't going to get them to open their mind, its not going to get them to want to learn and its sure as hell not going to get you what you want.

It sounds like you went in with the assumption that your iPad was the right tool for the job, he pointed out some areas where it was not, subsequently he determined that you lacked the underlying knowledge was faulty and did what he was supposed to.

That's in addition to the ADM areas where people have raised concerns here, but without the tape its impossible to determine how apparent those were to the DE

 

[pflemming]

I've refrained from commenting (but have enjoyed reading this), but IIRC you originally stated that the DPE asked your CFI about certain items in your history. He did not make a statement. There is a difference.

BTW, I'm an EE with almost 40 years of experience. All but one year of that in a particular corner of the profession. Currently serve as the President of the IEEE EMC Society. Let me give you some unsolicited advice. You don't know it all and you never will. Neither do I. I'm always learning. I'm always learning about flying. I'm always learning about EMC. Oh, and I've failed a check ride, too. 1st attempt at the IR. I didn't blame the DPE, I know what I did wrong and fixed it. Passed on the second try. Take responsibility for your own life and stop blaming others when things don't work as you'd like.

There are a bunch of people on this board who make me look like an absolute novice when it comes to flying (I have just short of 400 hours). I love it when they get into discussions. I learn a lot. Remember a truth in aviation (and other fields) - learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make them all yourself. And a serious mistake is to think that you know it all. As I noted above, you don't, nor will you ever.

Some humility wouldn't hurt.

Thank you. Wise words. I really do appreciate your comments. You are right that he only asked about my mental state, and did not necessarily state an opinion as fact. Thank you for pointing that out.

I hear what everyone is saying. I will try to resolve this amiably.

 

[weilke]

I think the OP should go to the FSDO and ask for a checkride. It is free, and the FAA is allways fair. Also, if he is not crazy, he wont have any difficulty convincing the FAA inspector of that fact.

 

[lmars]

I think the OP should go to the FSDO and ask for a checkride. It is free, and the FAA is allways fair. Also, if he is not crazy, he wont have any difficulty convincing the FAA inspector of that fact.

Agree +1

 

[gismo]

This "person" is sounding more like EdFred all the time.

EdFred "Unchained".

 

[DaleB]

You forgot to add "in your opinion". And your opinion is close to worthless, you're not even a pilot.

Ummm... neither are you. Probably never will be, either.

Well, let me explain this to you. His actions are going to prevent me from getting a qualification which will in turn prevent me from using it for financial gain at some point in the future.
Therefore, his false statements about me are going to cause me harm. I will hire an attorney, who can call it anything he wants (libel, slander, whatever), who will send a nasty letter to this DPE who will then probably soil himself. Remember, I have a video of him raising his voice at me, and badgering me. I have no mental defect. I am on no medication. So in the end, he has made an accusation that is false and last time I heard you cannot do that and not expect repercussions.

Assuming you do take the matter to an attorney -- which I very sincerely doubt, really -- your attorney will call it one of two things, depending on his or her ethics, level of boredom and personal attitude toward idiots. Either he or she will tell you honestly that you have absolutely no grounds for any sort of action and to go away and try acting like a grownup, or he'll bleed you for every dime in fees he can get, knowing that it's a colossal waste of time but still income.

Now, why do I really, sincerely doubt you'll take it to an attorney? Because, friend, I doubt you even know an attorney's name, let alone phone number. Your posts here indicate that you are such a spoiled, petulant child that you couldn't afford one even if you worked up the courage to call one. Lawyers don't take on things like this without cash up front, because they know it's a waste of time and effort. Life is not a TV show; Harvey Specter isn't going to ride to your rescue here. But, hey, chin up! Maybe Dr, Freedman will. Heck, he sure helped Hawkeye out of a tight spot once or twice.

 

[txflyer]

I don't pretend to be a legal expert. All I know is someone cannot make statements about me that are not true. Maybe he believes I have a screw loose. Is he qualified to make that diagnosis? No he is not.

I'm going to politely ask him (through a lawyer) to stop making statements that are damaging to me without proof. Statements that are false. All I want is a retest with another DPE. For that I need a medical.

Saying that you're going to ask him politely through a lawyer, is like saying your going to use a sledge hammer to drive a tack.

 

[LDJones]

Big difference between delusions of grandeur, and supreme self confidence and knowledge that I am the best in whatever I do. Even when I fail, I fail spectacularly.

Yep, many of his have already envisioned your ultimate smoking hole!

 

[pflemming]

Now, why do I really, sincerely doubt you'll take it to an attorney? Because, friend, I doubt you even know an attorney's name, let alone phone number. Your posts here indicate that you are such a spoiled, petulant child that you couldn't afford one even if you worked up the courage to call one.

Whoa, big guy, take it easy. Got jump on a treadmill or something, work off that aggression you have.

I understand it is tough to see how successful I am, because it only highlights what a dismal failure you are. You're talking about yourself, right? YOU don't know any attorney's, YOU wouldn't be able to afford one and YOU don't have the courage to call one. I am right, am I not? For this reason, I will look past this outburst of yours.

 

[JeffDG]

Whoa, big guy, take it easy. Got jump on a treadmill or something, work off that aggression you have.

I understand it is tough to see how successful I am, because it only highlights what a dismal failure you are. You're talking about yourself, right? YOU don't know any attorney's, YOU wouldn't be able to afford one and YOU don't have the courage to call one. I am right, am I not? For this reason, I will look past this outburst of yours.

So spectacularly successful that the DPE wouldn't even let you fly on your checkride?

 

[pflemming]

So spectacularly successful that the DPE wouldn't even let you fly on your checkride?

Only because he was being vindictive.

 

[Henning]

Whoa, big guy, take it easy. Got jump on a treadmill or something, work off that aggression you have.

I understand it is tough to see how successful I am, because it only highlights what a dismal failure you are. You're talking about yourself, right? YOU don't know any attorney's, YOU wouldn't be able to afford one and YOU don't have the courage to call one. I am right, am I not? For this reason, I will look past this outburst of yours.

It's hard to see how successful you are when you remain anonymous. The Internet is full of phonies and posers, you show yourself to be nothing but. Post under your real name and people may show you the respect you feel you deserve.