You are flying along and have signs of an electrical failure

SixPapaCharlie

SixPapaCharlie

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I watched the video about Jon and Martha flying I think their 210 and having elec. failure. Now they had the ice issues and ended up crashing but that aside, their decision was to shut off the master and keep on trekking.

So you are flying and you see radio lights start to dim and other signs of losing power. What do you do? Lets say it is mid day and clear out. And no other signs of danger (no fire, smoke, etc just power) you are 2 hours into a 4 hour flight.

Do you find the closest place to put it down?
Keep going?

Does it change your answer if the plane is outfitted differently
(retracts / elec. flaps vs manual)?

Does it change if it is Night vs day?

My gut reaction is that I shut off the master, find the closest field, and power back up just prior to entering the pattern but I can see asking how is this different than shutting it down, continuing and powering back on at my destination pattern.

What would you (or Have you) done in this situation?
 
Did her hair catch on fire?
 
Troubleshoot, land as soon as practicable, look for light gun signals, find a mechanic
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I watched the video about Jon and Martha flying I think their 210 and having elec. failure. Now they had the ice issues and ended up crashing but that aside, their decision was to shut off the master and keep on trekking.

So you are flying and you see radio lights start to dim and other signs of losing power. What do you do? Lets say it is mid day and clear out. And no other signs of danger (no fire, smoke, etc just power) you are 2 hours into a 4 hour flight.

Do you find the closest place to put it down?
Keep going?

Does it change your answer if the plane is outfitted differently
(retracts / elec. flaps vs manual)?

Does it change if it is Night vs day?

My gut reaction is that I shut off the master, find the closest field, and power back up just prior to entering the pattern but I can see asking how is this different than shutting it down, continuing and powering back on at my destination pattern.

What would you (or Have you) done in this situation?
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I just had that happen to me this weekend, I had just departed the airport .I returned immediately, called the tower and landed on the closest runway. Your suggestion for mid flight emergency sounds pretty good to me. Yes I would land at the closest airport.

Cheers !

PS. on the ground, I found out where the drain was coming from and quickly fixed the problem.
 
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Pull breakers one at a time to try to identify the source of the problem. Once identified, fix it when I get home. This very thing happened to me a couple of months ago.
 
What I did was notice the alternator dropped off-line and I couldn't keep it on-line. I was on flight following and about 40 miles from home base, FTG.

I turned around and then I told Denver Approach I was returning to FTG and that I had a problem with the alternator. I then shut down most of the unnecessary electric gear - left 1 com on and the transponder since FTG is under a Bravo. I also left the Aspen on even though it wasn't necessary - day VFR. The battery was fairly new and it lives on a trickle charger when in the hangar so I wasn't worried about electric power.

I flew back to FTG even though APA was closer. It was no big deal. Den App did tell FTG tower that I had an electric problem but no questions were asked other than did I need assistance and no paperwork required.

The key is to know and monitor the electric system so you aren't surprised by a low voltage situation.

Now when I lost a mag I did go direct to the nearest VFR airport...
 
Put it in a field with a discharging battery alone?

Only if there were some indication of something nastier. Maybe if oil temperature is high (that still works with the power off -- though pressure does not).

You can safely fly and land a certificated aircraft without power in day VFR conditions. Even a retract. You just have to be good at hand pumping or other alternate gear extension procedures if the gear is electric.

At night, find an airport with 24/7 lights and keep your head on a swivel. Maybe turn the master back on just for a brief transmission to Tower, and turn the lights (only) on after that. Note there are exceptions for the communications requirements in Class C/D (and even B, not that I'd suggest going there) in the event of lost comms and transponder.

Most of your gauges still work with no power -- ASI, AI, HI, tach, MP, oil temperature -- and you can fly more or less normally. Look for a runway long enough to land with no flaps if the flaps are electric (this ain't hard -- I've done no-flap landings in most airplanes I'm checked out in in well under 2000 feet). Even if you have some power, do NOT drop them or you may not be able to pull them up for a go-around.
 
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You may not get positive indication that the gear is down without electrics. Of course a gear failure on top of an electrical failure hopefully is unlikely. I've certainly had my share of electrical failures over the years:

1. Dead battery in rented 170. Noticed the segments were dying in the KX-155 which gave me an idea the bus voltage was low. Diverted to our maintenance base at night which fortunately is a mixed miltiary/civil field and plenty bright. Tower closed, no big deal.

2. Flakey voltage regulator in the Navion. I got good at yanking the battery out and carrying off to be charged up. Handy thing about a 12V electrical system. All of those were day VFR.

3. Flying in the back seat of someone else's Arrow while he was receiving an IPC (VFR conditions). Even managed to get back into IAD with no working transmitter.

On a longer trip, I'd definitely stop and get it fixed (I've heard John & Marthas unwanted adventure lecture as well. This one involved I think a Cherokee of some sort and they were on top and decided to try to conserve power and continue on rather than landing while they still had chance to do so for sure). Relying on stretching the battery when the alternator goes out is a bad situation. Either admit you can do the flight without electrics or get down relatively soon.
 
Lost the alternator,due to bearing failure,split the belt,fly the airplane,analyze the problem,land at closest airport with a mechanic available.
 
flyingron said:
You may not get positive indication that the gear is down without electrics. Of course a gear failure on top of an electrical failure hopefully is unlikely. I've certainly had my share of electrical failures over the years:
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Well, I fly Cessna retracts, so positive indication on one wheel is very, very easy. On some of them, you can see all three wheels. And you can FEEL it in the pump handle.

Even so, the gear light is not a big electricity suck, so turning on the master momentarily to check it prior to landing is not a bad idea. Turning the gear pump on may drain the battery, though.
 
Happened to me twice. First was total electrical failure doing VOR approach below the clouds after dropping off radar; cranked gear down, discontinued approach, flew home slowly (~35 nm, it was the next stop anyway). This was after unsuccessful attempts to restore power. Burned component behind the panel, nothing I could do.

Second was a dying alternator in a rental 182 at night. Called tower while I could for clearance (already on FF) and flew back. Light gun signals work well, for landing & taxi clearance. Neither was an emergency.
 
It's nice that everyone describes the classic alternator failure with battery potential at 30-45 minutes. I used to think they were all the same.

Two years ago on a night flight approaching the home drome I got a blast of smoke in the cockpit without previous warning. As I'm shedding power (shutting down individually), I get one tranmission out and the battery explodes (didn't know it at the time). My alternator separated front-to-back, causing the belt to continue turning on a stuck pulley, cocked slightly to the side (accounting for the smoke). Not sure why the battery blew. In short, from smoke to battery blowing was literally less than 20 seconds.

Be careful continuing on, you might have more of an electrical gremlin then a simple alternator failure.
 
When it happened to me midway through a 2 hr flight. I was told by the controller that he was loosing my transponder signal. I turned around and turned off the GPS but kept making my calls to the controllers until the power went out. I called the tower on my handheld and filed a report when I got to the hangar.
The mechanic fixed the broken exciter wire to my alternator for $25.
 
danhagan said:
It's nice that everyone describes the classic alternator failure with battery potential at 30-45 minutes. I used to think they were all the same.
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That's the scenario the OP gave. No smoke, no fire, no indication beyond slowly degrading voltage.

Of course, other indications, especially smoke, indicate different responses.
 
If you have IMMEDIATE notification of the failure (a warning light/tone), it gives you a fair amount of time to decide what to do - depends on the health of your battery of course. Plus you can immediately turn off stuff to maximize the juice you have in the battery.
If you don't have this type of notification, you can get one that plugs into the cigarette lighter receptacle. Highly recommended if you fly IFR. Turns the failure into an inconvenience instead of an emergency when radios quit working. :eek:
 
Depends what went wrong, what the mission of the flight is, what the flight conditions are, and how the systems on the aircraft work.

I had the alternator drop off-line on a Mooney once on about a 500 mile cross country. It happened with about 300 miles remaining. Severe clear weather, it was daylight. I noticed before I lost much of any power. I tried bringing the alternator back online but had no success.

In the mooney, the alternator is belt driven, so I wasn't worried about internal engine damage. I immediately turned the master off to conserve energy and navigated via my iPad to an airport that was about 45 minutes away where repair services and a rental car were available. There were closer airports but being stuck in the middle of nowhere wasn't high on my desire list.

Turned the master on before landing, put the gear down, and landed. Rented a car and drove the rest of the way.

Point is. It depends. Know your situation and know your systems and use that to make the best decision.
 
Generator went out on mine about an hour into a cross country once.

I just turned around and flew back home, no issues other than I had to shut everything down and kept enough juice in the battery to get radio. Portable GPS went on it's own battery.

It's really a non-event if you're CAVU.
 
Heck, I had an alternator that intermittently/randomly shut down for 10-20 minutes at a time for years. It wasn't the alternator or regulator. I had a few experts try to locate the ghost but I kept flying it. I'd turn off the lights is all. The little Odyssey always had enough juice left to start me at the other end. After a few years of that I rewired the plane tip to tail and switched to a B&C alternator and regulator. Problem solved. Those old wires don't last forever I guess.
 
Happened to me recently on a training flight. I just went home and landed, wrote it up. New alternator was installed a couple of days later. Of course, I was about 15 nm from the home drome. If I were on a XC, I would just find the closest reasonable airport and land.....after turning off the master.
 
petrolero said:
I don't think her hair on fire would meet the substantial damage criterion. It's pretty much a dumpster fire already. :D
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No, but the polyester leisure suit she wears would.


:)
 
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