WIFI over phone lines?

kgruber

kgruber

Final Approach
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Skywag
The house has super fast fiber optics WIFI here in the desert of WA, 100Mbps is common. But my hangar is 120 feet away, and doesn't get the signal from my router..

I no longer use the phone lines that are strung all over the house and hangar. Can I rig some kind of phone line kludge to get a signal in the hangar?

Best.......
 
I think you mean Ethernet, not wifi?

The problem with phone lines are that they don't meet the applicable standard (CAT 3 or CAT 5) for interference rejection (has to do with how the pairs are twisted in the cable) and it is often daisy-chained from outlet to outlet--Ethernet needs to be home-run (point-to-hub/switch) for each outlet.

Best bet is to bury a CAT 5 (or CAT 6) cable run out to the hangar. If you do, run at least two CAT5 and two RG6 coax cables for future flexibility. Won't be cheap, or easy if you do the grunt work yourself, but once it's done it will work very well. You can then have a wireless (wifi) access point (WAP) in the hangar to cover that area.

There are also ways to make a directional WAP. Run a CAT5 to the corner of the house closest to the hangar and have a directional WAP pointed from there to the hangar. Not sure about the cost and it won't be as rock solid as a wired Ethernet run.

Here's an example of such a WAP that I found with a quick search. This is just to show what I'm talking about. I have no idea if this would be suitable for your application.
https://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-WA5210G-Outdoor-Wireless-directional/dp/B004PFQX7K
 
kgruber said:
The house has super fast fiber optics WIFI here in the desert of WA, 100Mbps is common. But my hangar is 120 feet away, and doesn't get the signal from my router..

I no longer use the phone lines that are strung all over the house and hangar. Can I rig some kind of phone line kludge to get a signal in the hangar?

Best.......
Click to expand...
You can get outdoor-rated Cat5 cable - if you don't mind having it exposed (and visible). Otherwise, PVC conduit is cheap - but you do have to dig a trench (doesn't have to be very deep if no vehicle traffic over it).

Dave
 
If your phone lines are proper 4 conductor twisted pair, you should be able to make it work up to 10 MBps.

Pin it out like this:

4wirepatch.gif

Note it doesn't matter if they're green or orange. But it's very important that the twisted pairs are together.

1+2 as one pair, and 3+6 as another pair - then just do the other side to match.
 
Have buried some CatV, and other cables....ditto on the other Dave's suggestion to put it in pvc; very cheap protection.
If trenching...think ahead to what else you might want at the hangar in a few years and run a 2" pvc with string inside so you can pull whatever that is, later. Maybe you'll want water there? Telephone? TV? Electric?
 
I have seen the results of lightning strikes on buried cable and computers. You would need some expensive lightening protection gear to protect your equipment.
 
John221us said:
I have seen the results of lightning strikes on buried cable and computers. You would need some expensive lightening protection gear to protect your equipment.
Click to expand...

Doesn't have to be expensive, but yes, it's a good idea. Polyphaser brand stuff has saved a LOT of gear I'm responsible for, from lighting hits, when used correctly.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Have buried some CatV, and other cables....ditto on the other Dave's suggestion to put it in pvc; very cheap protection.
If trenching...think ahead to what else you might want at the hangar in a few years and run a 2" pvc with string inside so you can pull whatever that is, later. Maybe you'll want water there? Telephone? TV? Electric?
Click to expand...
I see that you can get direct burial ethernet cable as well. I have never used it, and would be inclined to go the conduit route, using standard cable (with provisions for later additions).

Dave
 
I see that you can get direct burial ethernet cable as well. I have never used it, and would be inclined to go the conduit route, using standard cable (with provisions for later additions).
Click to expand...

It's all about the digging for me; I hate doing it, and I swear our soil has the compressive strength of 10,000psi - ie way higher than standard construction concrete!
Not to say conduit never has problems but definitely less problems.
 
Frankly, I'd be very careful about burying or otherwise running regular cat5 cable outside. I lost just about everything that ran outside (my wired phones and my DSL model as well as the wiring to my well pump) with a nearby lightning strike. We also spectacularly lost the irrigation controller for the runway irrigation system (a large module just vaporized). You can try a cat5 lightning protector (they area available) but there's no guarantee (my phone wires did have the standard telco arrestor on them). I'd go fiber or radio link.
 
Get one of the Ubiquity outdoor wireless access points from a vendor with a 30 day money back guarantee. Mount it on the wall facing the hangar, dial on 'Hi'. Check whether you get a network. If no, return to store. If yes, problem solved.

Look at the phone wire that goes to the garage. A couple of months ago I helped friends to get WiFi throughout their 9000sqft castle. They had phone lines run to every TV location. When I opened the box, it turned out the electrician had used cat5e cable to wire the RJ11 phone jack. All it took was to crimp on RJ45 connectors at both end. Even if it is phone wiring, as long as the conductor is twisted pair type, and point-point, it will support network traffic. If it is not twisted pair, there are 'phoneline' adaptors that support fairly low speed connections (2Mbit) via phone wiring (basically using two DSL modems).
 
Last edited:
weilke said:
Get one of the Ubiquity outdoor wireless access points from a vendor with a 30 day money back guarantee. Mount it on the wall facing the hangar, dial on 'Hi'. Check whether you get a network. If no, return to store. If yes, problem solved.
Click to expand...

That's why I recommended the Ubiquiti Bullets or a similar two point system from Ubiquiti. Why "try" and see if it works? MAKE it work. The silly things will easily make multiple mile shots with the right antennas. Making them talk to a barn on-site is a no-brainer. Hell, at that range, a couple of old Linksys routers loaded with DD-WRT would do it in bridged mode.
 
I'm going to have to disagree. Even cat5 misterminated (not maintaining the twists all the way to the connector) will result in problematic network operation. You do not want to use just random twisted pair that doesn't meet the spec.
 
flyingron said:
I'm going to have to disagree. Even cat5 misterminated (not maintaining the twists all the way to the connector) will result in problematic network operation. You do not want to use just random twisted pair that doesn't meet the spec.
Click to expand...

It either works or it doesn't. If it doesn't you are out two crimp-on RJ45 jacks (and two RJ11 jacks to revert).
 
weilke said:
It either works or it doesn't. If it doesn't you are out two crimp-on RJ45 jacks (and two RJ11 jacks to revert).
Click to expand...

It will give you headaches over time. It might work the first time and then the NICs auto negotiate a gig connection over CAT 3 and start to reship packets. Performance drops, but does not completely fail, or a crimped connector starts working lose or the solid core cable breaks eventually from movement. Solid core cable is run in walls and is meant to be solidly terminated to a patch panel or a jack. Then, stranded core patch cables connect to the device from there. Do it right the first time, so you don't have to put up with a bunch of problems and then eventually re-engineer the solution in three months.
 
weilke said:
It either works or it doesn't. If it doesn't you are out two crimp-on RJ45 jacks (and two RJ11 jacks to revert).
Click to expand...

It's usually not that simple. A cable or termination that doesn't meet spec could produce intermittent issues which are difficult to troubleshoot, especially with residential-grade network equipment.

Nevertheless, I would be leery about running copper between buildings without proper grounding at the very least. Seems like wireless is a safer (and easier) route in this particular case.


JKG
 
I wouldn't want to rely on this to transmit the nuclear launch codes or to control grandmas breathing machine. To get internet in the hangar so he can post on POA from his hangar couch, there is little reason not to try it. If there is a space radio storm or unusually high humidity and the wifi goes down, he can still replace the $5.64 solution with the $300 or $1000 solution.

Here is the troubleshooting algorithm:

Connection doesn't work : --> probably the fact that I used a non-spec cable.
Solution: --> wiggle wires at both ends
A. Now it works again.
B. It doesn't work. --> Spray generously with contact cleaner

A. Now it works again.
B. It still doesn't work. --> Switch to wireless system
 
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