Why is the CAP so understaffed?

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JFK Humphries

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JFK Humphries
I am retired USAF and I remember working with the CAP back in the mid 1980’s and they, or that outfit seemed to be a coherent group that had their act together.

I recently went to one meeting as a favor for a friend and it was a shambles. The Cadets were overweight and they had beards and tattoos all over them. It would have been ridiculous but I remember when they had their act together. Actual CAP staff running around playing USAF. Even the so-called commander’s who had no college, not a day in uniform (active or reserve).

telling me to call them Sir or Mam. It’s just like you don’t even have 10 years in CAP and you are mad that you are only a CAP Major.

Think twice before you get involved with these people.
 
JFK Humphries said:
I am retired USAF and I remember working with the CAP back in the mid 1980’s and they, or that outfit seemed to be a coherent group that had their act together.

I recently went to one meeting as a favor for a friend and it was a shambles. The Cadets were overweight and they had beards and tattoos all over them. It would have been ridiculous but I remember when they had their act together. Actual CAP staff running around playing USAF. Even the so-called commander’s who had no college, not a day in uniform (active or reserve).

telling me to call them Sir or Mam. It’s just like you don’t even have 10 years in CAP and you are mad that you are only a CAP Major.

Think twice before you get involved with these people.
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Every squadron is different. Obviously you ran into a squadron that is not only not following CAP grooming standards, but it appears that the entire org chart for that wing is screwed up. What state are you in?

Or are you a troll, since this is your first post?
 
I have nothing to add, but my interactions with CAP have been universally cringe, so I will delight while the dog-pile ensues.

Those chickenhawks barking at me through squeaky voice, combat fatigues, and orthodontia at osh kosh to stay behind the burn line are the worst. I hope every one of them falls off of their Honda Elite 50 scooter and into a ditch.
 
What does this have to do with 6Y9 ?
 
I was briefly in the Little Rock squadron. What a **** show. Ass clowns with zero military experience trying to tell me what’s what’s what. *****, I have over a decade in the Corps and ribbons and medals actually earned. I could have been a resident expert, but the upper echelon were wanna be, nobodies. I popped smoke out of that **** Show after a couple months and never looked back.

CAP can suck a big phat you know what.
 
Unit74 said:
I was briefly in the Little Rock squadron. What a **** show. Ass clowns with zero military experience trying to tell me what’s what’s what. *****, I have over a decade in the Corps and ribbons and medals actually earned. I could have been a resident expert, but the upper echelon were wanna be, nobodies. I popped smoke out of that **** Show after a couple months and never looked back.

CAP can suck a big phat you know what.
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I wish you'd stop being so wishy-washy and just tell us what you really think.
 
My interaction with the CAP as a teenager back home became little more than glorified army JROTC. Lot of marching and very little of the aeronautical bend I was interested in. Made nominal college application fodder but little else. Never got an orientation flight. I remember the membership would swell for those, otherwise it was a ghost town. I did enjoy the fact it was held at the local Guard base, so I would catch a glimpse of the F-16As on the ramp. That really was ultimate motivation anyways.

Fast forward as a college student, I had my PPL in hand by then, and decided to volunteer as an adult at the PDK squadron, and yeah, getting to the airplanes was a bureaucratic non-starter, so I quit that like a one night stand and never looked back.

I can say now as a senior .mil flyer that CAP had very little to do with the mentorship that would otherwise be associated to making it to a usaf cockpit. It really is a shame, as youth development and promotion of aerospace is one of the supposed tenets of the organization in post WWII times.

PS: I take it back. I did learn how to drill/march/shine boots/jump my own -ss like a crayon eater, in the CAP. By the time I hit OTS, I was about on par with the prior-Es, which is above average for a straight up civi only heading straight to AFRC after OTS/UPT lol. Which is to say, that and a buck twenty gets me a cup of coffee but hey, credit where credit's due. :D
 
It's been a while since we last had a CAP-bashing thread. I guess we were overdue...
 
The few interactions I have had with a couple of squadrons was a little cringe worthy. They all just seem to come off as men that got too old for Boy Scouts. All they seem to be was all about the let’s pretend we’re something we aren’t.
 
murphey said:
Obviously you ran into a squadron that is not only not following CAP grooming standards
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I will point out that CAP doesn't have grooming standards for members unless you want to wear the USAF style uniform.

For the OP, I'm curious what you meant by "playing USAF"? I've never see that behavior before so I'd like to understand it better.
 
What little interaction I have had with CAP pilots left me with the impression that they had no social skills and were too self important for me to waste time on. I never could figure out why, while everyone in the pattern was using rwy 35, they felt the need to use rwy 17 for their pattern work.
 
Unit74 said:
I was briefly in the Little Rock squadron. What a **** show. Ass clowns with zero military experience trying to tell me what’s what’s what. *****, I have over a decade in the Corps and ribbons and medals actually earned. I could have been a resident expert, but the upper echelon were wanna be, nobodies. I popped smoke out of that **** Show after a couple months and never looked back.
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So a decade being a Marine makes you an expert on search and rescue, emergency management support, airborne photography, and public interaction missions? Maybe you could have stowed the attitude and tried to learn something?

To the contrary, you have obviously looked back. And you have an irrational anger about the past. When you were a child, were you jealous of your father's affection for your mother?
 
bflynn said:
So a decade being Marine makes you an expert on search and rescue, emergency management support, airborne photography, and public interaction missions?

To the contrary, you have obviously looked back. And you have an irrational anger about the past. When you were a child, were you jealous of your father's affection for your mother?
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Wow. Just wow. Pretty obvious you have never served. Just another entitled brat posting on the interwebz.

Stay classy.
 
Half Fast said:
I wish you'd stop being so wishy-washy and just tell us what you really think.
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That is a watered down version. The “CO” asked me why I was leaving so soon. I let loose. He had no argument with me and thanked me for the short time I was there. I tried Russellville, AR after that but it was nothing more than coffee and hanger scuttle butt.

CAP can eat a phat D.
 
anchorman-boy-that-escalated-quickly.gif


POA never disappoints. Reddit's for the meek. :D
 
I had gone to a bunch of meetings for a few months a number of years ago thinking it would be a good way to put my aviation passion and skills to good use

I was turned off by the extreme level of bureaucracy, obsession with paperwork, inability to actually fly, and the whole make-believe-Air-Force aspect

It's a great place for someone though who wants to tie aviation into the DMV experience.

It's too bad honestly
 
I found a squadron close by when I lived in Pittsburgh. They didn't mind that I wasn't interested in the bureaucracy and military games, and they were happy to have someone to fly orientation flights. I logged a lot of hours in their G1000 C182 with minimal hassle.
 
The only CAP pilot types I have seen since the '80s were some really old dudes flying an old jet, I think it was a Sabreliner.

They were flitting around several Western States delivering beer to their buddies and pretending they were supporting Homeland Security by cruising the Southern border and occasionally looking at a scope on the panel. They were the only actual pilots in their squadron and never went to meetings or suffered those monkeys with the tattoos.

Yep, the "Swivel Chair Patrol" is a big, disorganized coffee Klatch.
 
Katamarino said:
I found a squadron close by when I lived in Pittsburgh. They didn't mind that I wasn't interested in the bureaucracy and military games, and they were happy to have someone to fly orientation flights. I logged a lot of hours in their G1000 C182 with minimal hassle.
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You are lucky, a common complaint around here at least at our wing was the inability to actually fly any of the airplanes

It would have been pretty cool to look for lost hikers and generally have a positive presence and impact
 
Too much red tape and b/s to stay a pilot for them and complete real missions. A good idea though, just too much play military gets in the way of actually being useful.
 
Unit74 said:
Wow. Just wow. Pretty obvious you have never served. Just another entitled brat posting on the interwebz.
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You'd be completely wrong. You've been around here a while, but since we don't know each other, you probably don't remember or have never heard me talking about submarines...which is how it should be ;)

Your butthurt came from somewhere. I'm trying to understand what it was. There's nothing in Marine Corp training that would prepare you to be an expert in CAP. The topics are different, the work is different and you were in fact a clueless newbie. I want to understand why you think that was their fault?

And I'm guessing you were jealous of your father?
 
IK04 said:
The only CAP pilot types I have seen since the '80s were some really old dudes flying an old jet, I think it was a Sabreliner.

They were flitting around several Western States delivering beer to their buddies and pretending they were supporting Homeland Security by cruising the Southern border and occasionally looking at a scope on the panel. They were the only actual pilots in their squadron and never went to meetings or suffered those monkeys with the tattoos.

Yep, the "Swivel Chair Patrol" is a big, disorganized coffee Klatch.
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Respectfully, I think you just don't know enough about the organization. The things you're talking about would get someone bounced out of CAP, so why would you keep it to yourself?
 
bflynn said:
Respectfully, I think you just don't know enough about the organization. The things you're talking about would get someone bounced out of CAP, so why would you keep it to yourself?
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Do you have anything else to do than **** on posts that refer to people with military experience? The purpose of my post was to demonstrate that these guys were gaming the system and were in fact getting away with doing things that should "get them bounced." All because they had eagles on their shoulders.
 
Y="bflynn, post: 3244609, member: 11472"]So a decade being a Marine makes you an expert on search and rescue, emergency management support, airborne photography, and public interaction missions? Maybe you could have stowed the attitude and tried to learn something?

To the contrary, you have obviously looked back. And you have an irrational anger about the past. When you were a child, were you jealous of your father's affection for your mother?[/QUOTE]

Lighten up, Francis.

Prior/career military can spot jack offs a mile away. And the CAP seems to be the warm moist breeding ground for most of the usless mold that run the units. Yes. Most CAP units are that bad.

When a good program is ruined by wannabes or worse, has beens, the only real losers are the kids that get soured by the experience.

Most CAP units are dumpster fires run by people that have zero ability to do anything but start dumpster fires.
 
IK04 said:
Do you have anything else to do than **** on posts that refer to people with military experience? The purpose of my post was to demonstrate that these guys were gaming the system and were in fact getting away with doing things that should "get them bounced." All because they had eagles on their shoulders.
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sure, I can **** on posts that people make disparaging organization they have no real experience with.

Respectfully, in a few months you didn’t understand the system, let alone know if or how they were gaming it. If you knew these things were going on and you knew the system, then you would have known how to make a report to the wing legal officer or the wing commander. If that didn’t work, you’d repeat it up the CoC and I assure that if you had a valid complaint then long before you reached the National Commander, you would have gotten results.

Consider - a new PFC joins your unit. After a few months, he is talking about how crappy you are and how you don’t know which way is up. Is he the problem or are you? Because in CAP, weren’t you him?
 
pfarber said:
Lighten up, Francis.

Prior/career military can spot jack offs a mile away. And the CAP seems to be the warm moist breeding ground for most of the usless mold that run the units. Yes. Most CAP units are that bad.

When a good program is ruined by wannabes or worse, has beens, the only real losers are the kids that get soured by the experience.

Most CAP units are dumpster fires run by people that have zero ability to do anything but start dumpster fires.
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Your characterization is ignorant bigotry, so I will not lighten up. You don’t know even “some” CAP units, let alone most.

Are there goobers in CAP? Of course. But we had goobers in the navy too, so what? I run across them at work, in the grocery store, and on the roads. You’re just saying that CAP is a lot like the rest of the world.
 
bflynn said:
So a decade being a Marine makes you an expert on search and rescue, emergency management support, airborne photography, and public interaction missions? Maybe you could have stowed the attitude and tried to learn something?

To the contrary, you have obviously looked back. And you have an irrational anger about the past. When you were a child, were you jealous of your father's affection for your mother?
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Ummmm... didn't get that from the post. What I did take away was that he didn't feel that it was necessary to jump through hoops for people that hadn't stomped the same ground. I went to a CAP orientation event and was screamed at by a man my age that looked like he was wearing a maternity uniform simply because I didn't call him sir. I had no clue who this guy was and I am a freshly retired senior NCO with more combat time than this dude had in CAP. After an unscientific poll of CAP members I discovered that most actual service members chose to not wear uniforms if allowed while those that never served were little Napoleons.

Where do you fit in?
 
Unsure what you mean by where I fit in. Where in CAP? I’m just interested in flying, but work keeps me too busy to be very active. Annoyingly, it keeps me from flying more too.

where in the scheme of personalities? I’m usually pretty relaxed, but I am Irish and have a low tolerance for bs. In CAP, I don’t see the people described here except as a rare blip, but that could be regional differences.
 
bflynn said:
sure, I can **** on posts that people make disparaging organization they have no real experience with.

Respectfully, in a few months you didn’t understand the system, let alone know if or how they were gaming it. If you knew these things were going on and you knew the system, then you would have known how to make a report to the wing legal officer or the wing commander. If that didn’t work, you’d repeat it up the CoC and I assure that if you had a valid complaint then long before you reached the National Commander, you would have gotten results.

Consider - a new PFC joins your unit. After a few months, he is talking about how crappy you are and how you don’t know which way is up. Is he the problem or are you? Because in CAP, weren’t you him?
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A 10 year Marine in NOT a PFC. I'm curious about what your rank and rate was while serving on a sub. I'm also curious about how that time translates to how a 10 year Marine feels about being treated like a new cadet. I don't know anything about the Marine in this discussion but as an Army dude, I can say that we learned a lot about search and rescue, and public relations. I have conducted far too many search and recovery missions in combat zones and can be found in the gov video archives giving interviews. Oh, I've also worked on the ops and intel sections during actual combat operations and this Marine may very well have but you attack him because he doesn't like how CAP handles their business. This may be the exact problem with the current version of CAP.
 
bflynn said:
Unsure what you mean by where I fit in.
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I mean between the prior service members that just want to be a part of the program and not pretend to have a rank or the little Napoleons. My wife is Irish and I am Icelandic. The last time we visited her ancestorial home I pointed out that my ancestor ruled that area and built the castle we were touring. Didn't make me that popular..
 
bflynn said:
sure, I can **** on posts that people make disparaging organization they have no real experience with.

Respectfully, in a few months you didn’t understand the system, let alone know if or how they were gaming it. If you knew these things were going on and you knew the system, then you would have known how to make a report to the wing legal officer or the wing commander. If that didn’t work, you’d repeat it up the CoC and I assure that if you had a valid complaint then long before you reached the National Commander, you would have gotten results.
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You must have me confused with the former Marine who made the previous remarks.

One of those dudes in the jet WAS the Wing Commander, BTW.
 
red4golf said:
A 10 year Marine in NOT a PFC.
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lol….so? That wasn’t the question. If someone new joins an organization and starts crapping on it, isn’t the problem them? A 10 year marine who just joined is still a new CAP member.

yeah, I probably mixed people up
 
bflynn said:
CAP has a jet?
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wouldn't surprise me. In AK the wing had
bflynn said:
lol….so? That wasn’t the question. If someone new joins an organization and starts crapping on it, isn’t the problem them? A 10 year marine who just joined is still a new CAP member.

yeah, I probably mixed people up
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I now know where you fit on the continuum...

I have had experience with many prior service members moving to the Army. Some were Marines, my last gunner was a surface ship sailor, and some were even coasties but we treated them with the respect they deserved. I believe that is the biggest issue for prior service folks.
 
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