Twin Comanche partnership or sale.

Aztec Driver

Aztec Driver

Line Up and Wait
Joined
Mar 7, 2005
Messages
982
Location
Elizabethtown, PA
Display Name
Display name:
Bryon
So I believe it is time to think about parting with my baby. It is just more expense on a single owner than I am willing to keep up with. Since My partner lost his job and I bought him out, it has been more expense and not enough flying to justify the enormous outlay of hangar, insurance, etc. My part time pilot job was just barely paying the upkeep of it, but then there were a few expensive repairs and a slow down of charters, and I just don't wish to continue to dig a deep hole.

A partnership would be better, but would require a lot of organization on my part, but it would allow me to keep the plane, at least partially.

1966 Piper Twin Comanche
~1400 SMOH
Lprop ~1400
Rprop ~10

Extensive annual being completed as we speak.
Aspen PFD1000
Garmin 430W
KX155 w/o GS
STEC 30 w/ALT HOLD
P&I 7

Hangared at Lancaster, Pa, KLNS
 

Attachments

  • 150558.jpg
    150558.jpg
    99.6 KB · Views: 100
  • DSC03239.jpg
    DSC03239.jpg
    1.4 MB · Views: 112
  • phone pics 163.jpg
    phone pics 163.jpg
    123.3 KB · Views: 116
  • phone pics 164.jpg
    phone pics 164.jpg
    133.3 KB · Views: 109
Last edited:
So my wife and I had a conversation last night that. Unfortunately we both came to the same disappointing conclusion, without the extra income of the charter gig, a slow down of our business, and the fact that I just don't get a chance to fly it that much, it makes more sense to rent an aircraft rather than pay for the upkeep and housing of owning my own aircraft.

So I guess it is Good-Bye to a good friend.

What kind of price do you all think it is worth?
 
I will trade you my PA24 straight up. :eek:
 
Aztec Driver said:
So my wife and I had a conversation last night that. Unfortunately we both came to the same disappointing conclusion, without the extra income of the charter gig, a slow down of our business, and the fact that I just don't get a chance to fly it that much, it makes more sense to rent an aircraft rather than pay for the upkeep and housing of owning my own aircraft.

So I guess it is Good-Bye to a good friend.

What kind of price do you all think it is worth?
Click to expand...

:popcorn:
 
If I had to guess, $50k or so. The engines being about 3/4 time hurts, I'm guessing the high time prop is yeared out, but the panel is nice.

Our green friend could probably sell his plane and buy the Twinkie for an even swap price wise.
 
I would guess the plane might be in the low fifties range,nice panel.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
If I had to guess, $50k or so. The engines being about 3/4 time hurts, I'm guessing the high time prop is yeared out, but the panel is nice.

Our green friend could probably sell his plane and buy the Twinkie for an even swap price wise.
Click to expand...

His plane needs more green but I can do that :)

Who wants a 235?
 
Kind of off topic, but just strange because you're so local...I have another twinkie based at CXY with the tail number of 8430Y. Best of luck to you regardless!
 
Aztec Driver said:
So my wife and I had a conversation last night that. Unfortunately we both came to the same disappointing conclusion, without the extra income of the charter gig, a slow down of our business, and the fact that I just don't get a chance to fly it that much, it makes more sense to rent an aircraft rather than pay for the upkeep and housing of owning my own aircraft.

So I guess it is Good-Bye to a good friend.

What kind of price do you all think it is worth?
Click to expand...

Is it currently on a 135 certificate? What is the useful load?
 
55k ????? Where are you guys coming up with that number ? Looking at the current market for these and considering his avionics I'd start out around 78 and not take less than 70.
 
Art VanDelay said:
55k ????? Where are you guys coming up with that number ? Looking at the current market for these and considering his avionics I'd start out around 78 and not take less than 70.
Click to expand...
You could start asking for that, but you won't get it with those engine times. I'd start asking for $60k and see what bites.

In the current market you can get a Baron with those avionics and low time engines for a little over $100k.
 
Double overhaul on the three to four year horizon puts a damper on the price. That's a 40k-ish outlay.

I figured about 60k. Or I'll give him my Comanche and 10k cash.
 
Art VanDelay said:
What makes you think he absolutely HAS TO do an overhaul at those times ?
Click to expand...

He doesn't.....but a prospective buyer is sure going to take that into account.

It's one thing if I put 1400 hrs on the engines and choose to delay overhaul. It's another thing if someone I don't know put the time on them and I have no real clue how they were handled in those 1400 hrs.

I wouldn't automatically O/H them right away, but I sure would want to be financially prepared to if it became necessary.
 
Art VanDelay said:
55k ????? Where are you guys coming up with that number ? Looking at the current market for these and considering his avionics I'd start out around 78 and not take less than 70.
Click to expand...

This should be easy for you, then.

Offer Bryon $65k, then turn around and sell the plane for $70-78k. Let us know your results.
 
Have you done LOP numbers?
 
You can get the 320s to run sub-8GPH without much loss in performance, particularly with CS props up front. I consistently got 8GPH on my warrior and that was a carb setup. Running a pair of injected 320s circa 65% LOP, boy you should be able to run on vapors and get decent speed out of the comanche wings.
 
hindsight2020 said:
You can get the 320s to run sub-8GPH without much loss in performance, particularly with CS props up front. I consistently got 8GPH on my warrior and that was a carb setup. Running a pair of injected 320s circa 65% LOP, boy you should be able to run on vapors and get decent speed out of the comanche wings.
Click to expand...

About 6.6gph is about as low as you can run a 320 before the power falls off a cliff.
 
Aztec Driver said:
I do not have good enough engine instruments for that kind of running. Without it, I fear I would harm the engine more than just using a little more fuel.

Besides, I bought it to go fast!:D
Click to expand...

So the next owner can put a JPI in for $3k. But on 320s, there's really nothing to worry about for hurting them. I'd guess 14 gph on 160-165 kts.
 
Art VanDelay said:
55k ????? Where are you guys coming up with that number ? Looking at the current market for these and considering his avionics I'd start out around 78 and not take less than 70.
Click to expand...
Those were my thoughts as well. I don't think 50's is a fair number at all.
 
Aztec Driver said:
Those were my thoughts as well. I don't think 50's is a fair number at all.
Click to expand...

Not even close, but people don't believe in fair anymore, people believe that you should eat every upgrade you've done and you should give away your plane to them to get out from underneath it. That's why I'm not particularly marketing mine, people are retarded. Mine has 100 hr no AD props, 150SFRM, 350SMOH and a 12 year, $200,000 airframe restoration to go with the G-500, 430w, JPI 760 and new alternators plus a clean out of all the old avionics crap, yet they think I should sell it at the same price as a rotted out, run out, ancient avionics one they saw advertised. Let them buy a new glass panel twin and pay $1.2MM, or buy that $30k rotten run out and bring it into condition and spend $200k and 3 years of down time getting it done; or fly around in an old rag and spend $10k a year on maintenance keeping the rag running then complain about the high cost of operating the type.
 
Aztec Driver said:
Those were my thoughts as well. I don't think 50's is a fair number at all.
Click to expand...

We'll, you asked what we thought. Since you're planning on selling it, I would certainly be happy to find out I'm wrong.
 
In a Twin Comanche the way to get the fuel burn down and maintain airspeed is to go high. At 12K you can get 155-165 kts on 12 gph total. The speed depends on how many and what speed mods the aircraft has.
 
Kristin said:
In a Twin Comanche the way to get the fuel burn down and maintain airspeed is to go high. At 12K you can get 155-165 kts on 12 gph total. The speed depends on how many and what speed mods the aircraft has.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I am usually headed west, and generally have an increasing headwind the higher I go.
 
Henning said:
About 6.6gph is about as low as you can run a 320 before the power falls off a cliff.
Click to expand...

I am usually burning less on longer trips, though I am usually over 12K. The Comanche wing likes altitude.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
We'll, you asked what we thought. Since you're planning on selling it, I would certainly be happy to find out I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
Agree.

To put it in perspective, Courtesy at RFD has one listed with similar engine times (although one engine is much lower). It is listed at 79k. It has been for sale for over a year.
 
Last edited:
Fearless Tower said:
Agree.

To put it in perspective, Courtesy at RFD has one listed with similar engine times (although one engine is much lower). It is listed at 79k. It has been for sale for over a year.
Click to expand...

What does it have in the panel? There is a point in the pricing where it is more cost effective to part the plane out and remove it from the fly able market. Eventually the lowball mindset will have cut its own throat and all that will be on the market is newer planes at several hundred thousand dollars, or rags that people are willing to take bottom dollar for. Luckily there will be a sufficient supply of good parts from good planes so people can spend twice as much putting the rags back together for than they could have bought the good plane for to begin with. The lack of critical thinking ability does not just show itself in the political arena.
 
When it comes down to it, it's only worth what it gets bought for. Yeah someone may have a crap ton of money they put into the plane, but if no one wants to spend it, it's not worth that much regardless of what all the non buyers think. Free market at work. No demand, price goes down.

And I know the position you're in. I had a tire kicker from here tell me that my plane was only worth about $8,000-13,000. Maybe he's right because it hasn't sold in 18 months even though I have it listed at a 35% loss as it is.
 
EdFred said:
When it comes down to it, it's only worth what it gets bought for. Yeah someone may have a crap ton of money they put into the plane, but if no one wants to spend it, it's not worth that much regardless of what all the non buyers think. Free market at work. No demand, price goes down.

And I know the position you're in. I had a tire kicker from here tell me that my plane was only worth about $8,000-13,000. Maybe he's right because it hasn't sold in 18 months even though I have it listed at a 35% loss as it is.
Click to expand...

Consider parting it out... Depending on the engine and prop type and condition, you may get that just for them.
 
When it comes down to it, it's only worth what it gets bought for. Yeah someone may have a crap ton of money they put into the plane, but if no one wants to spend it, it's not worth that much regardless of what all the non buyers think. Free market at work. No demand, price goes down.

And I know the position you're in. I had a tire kicker from here tell me that my plane was only worth about $8,000-13,000. Maybe he's right because it hasn't sold in 18 months even though I'm have it listed at a 35% loss as it is.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top