Toyota Recall

Geico266

Geico266

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Geico
Geico266 said:
If we (as pilots) had a throttle cable fail full throttle what we we do in the air? Crash land at full speed? Then why can't drivers figure out to turn the ignition off if the engine goes WOT?

http://autos.aol.com/article/toyota-tragedy-saylor-family?icid=main|htmlws-sb-n|dl4|link3|http%3A%2F%2Fautos.aol.com%2Farticle%2Ftoyota-tragedy-saylor-family

While this is tragic seems to me Darwin's Therory is working well. :yesnod:
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Or just step hard on the brakes. Until they fade (which is extremely unlikely on the first hard use) the brakes will override the engine on almost any passenger vehicle. You won't stop as quickly but you will stop. Doing both (ign off and brake on) would be the most effective though.
 
Geico266 said:
If we (as pilots) had a throttle cable fail full throttle what we we do in the air? Crash land at full speed? Then why can't drivers figure out to turn the ignition off if the engine goes WOT?

http://autos.aol.com/article/toyota....aol.com/article/toyota-tragedy-saylor-family

While this is tragic seems to me Darwin's Therory is working well. :yesnod:
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I can understand the guy not understanding that you have to hold the start/stop pushbutton for 3 seconds to turn off the engine, but geez, why didn't he just put it in neutral and then stop?


Trapper John
 
dmccormack said:
Anyone who's run cruise control on the highway can understand the momentary "Oh no!" delay when you let up on the gas and nothing happens.
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I think the keyword is, "momentary." This guy was zipping along, baffled and/or clueless long enough to make a 911 call from his cell. That's a whole lot more than, "momentary."


Trapper John
 
probably because there is not as much mental aptitude or systems knowledge required to drive a car as there is to fly an airplane?
 
dmccormack said:
You need to meet some more pilots... :rolleyes:
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i instructed at an FBO for 4 or 5 years. ive met my share of idiot pilots. even the dumbest pilot ive met doesnt hold a candle to the dumb stuff ive seen on the road.
 
Trapper John said:
I think the keyword is, "momentary." This guy was zipping along, baffled and/or clueless long enough to make a 911 call from his cell. That's a whole lot more than, "momentary."
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You would think so.:dunno:

FWIW:
"A fresh round of media interest in Toyota's sudden acceleration issue has been stirred by Consumer Reports. The widely read magazine released the results of a study that indicates Toyota and its sister brand, Lexus, are responsible for more than 40 percent of the unexplained acceleration complaints filed with government regulators. "

They currently have about 16% of the market in the US.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
You would think so.:dunno:

FWIW:
"A fresh round of media interest in Toyota's sudden acceleration issue has been stirred by Consumer Reports. The widely read magazine released the results of a study that indicates Toyota and its sister brand, Lexus, are responsible for more than 40 percent of the unexplained acceleration complaints filed with government regulators. "

They currently have about 16% of the market in the US.
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Aren't these the same folk who fanned a smoldering dung heap into Audi's near bankruptcy many years ago on a similar issue even though it was clear from the evidence that the real problem was the drivers pushing on the gas instead of the brake. That one precipitated the brake/transmission interlock which did eliminate a fair amount of darwinistic behavior.

Really though, I suggest that anyone concerned about this (including the CR guys) just pick a safe open road and see what happens when you push both the gas and the brake to the floor at 60 mph.
 
gismo said:
Aren't these the same folk who fanned a smoldering dung heap into Audi's near bankruptcy many years ago on a similar issue even though it was clear from the evidence that the real problem was the drivers pushing on the gas instead of the brake. That one precipitated the brake/transmission interlock which did eliminate a fair amount of darwinistic behavior.
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I think it was 60 Minutes that started all the Audi malarkey, but this sure smells like the same kind of thing.

What's next? Special sensors so you can't slam your fingers in the door? :mad2:


Trapper John
 
Trapper John said:
I think it was 60 Minutes that started all the Audi malarkey, but this sure smells like the same kind of thing.
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Yeah, you're right, it was 60 minutes not CR. I guess now I've gone on record smearing an innocent organization, at least I got a chance to retract the erroneous statement.:D


What's next? Special sensors so you can't slam your fingers in the door?
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The trouble with attempting to idiot proof anything is that they always seem to come up with more creative idiots.
 
We had our Toyota truck serviced the other day at the dealer. Dealer policy is to now remove all non-standard (non-included, whatever) floormats from the driver's side and put them in the back, trunk, wherever, before releasing the vehicle back to you. They say if you want to put them back under the accelerator pedal that's up to you :nono: :rofl:
 
I had the throttle return spring break in our 1963 Rambler back when I was in high school. Needless to say, it didn't slow down when I released the pedal. My immediate reaction? Shut off the ignition. Wasn't all that hard to figure out. Sometimes you just have to wonder...
 
Ghery said:
I had the throttle return spring break in our 1963 Rambler back when I was in high school. Needless to say, it didn't slow down when I released the pedal. My immediate reaction? Shut off the ignition. Wasn't all that hard to figure out. Sometimes you just have to wonder...
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A Rambler?? Which meant top speed of oh... 20? :rofl:

(My first car ride memories were my grandparent's Rambler...bubble vinyl seat protectors and all...)
 
Ghery said:
I had the throttle return spring break in our 1963 Rambler back when I was in high school. Needless to say, it didn't slow down when I released the pedal. My immediate reaction? Shut off the ignition. Wasn't all that hard to figure out. Sometimes you just have to wonder...
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I was on a bus in jr. high school when the throttle spring broke cause the engine to go WOT. The driver was smart enough to put it in neutral (stick shift) and bring the bus to a stop. He did't even think about shutting it off so the engine was now in neutra hitting about 8,000 RPM. I ran up from the back of the bus and shut the ignition off. The driver was out side with the hood up trying to figure out how to reconnect the spring on an engine running WOT! The exhaust manifold were cherry red by the time I shut it off. Another bus came and we continued on our way.

:sleep:
 
tonycondon said:
i instructed at an FBO for 4 or 5 years. ive met my share of idiot pilots. even the dumbest pilot ive met doesnt hold a candle to the dumb stuff ive seen on the road.
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Hmmm.. You've flown with me AND you've in a car with me, so I'm not sure where I fit on your scale here.... ;)
 
They put my truck on that recall and I have recevied a letter. (2007 Tundra 5.7L SR5) I have standard "carpet" mats that are not under the pedal. Concern to those in wetter climates with think rubber mats with a raised edge.

The solution so far is to trim the bottom of the gas pedal by 3/4", and in April 2010 they'll have new "shorter" pedals to replace the one they cut.

I've got a 5000mile (35K) oil change coming up next week. STAY AWAY FROM THAT GAS PEDAL.

We'll see what they have to say.
 
The guy was a highway patrolman. I mean, c'mon. He didn't think to put in in neutral?
 
RJM62 said:
The guy was a highway patrolman. I mean, c'mon. He didn't think to put in in neutral?
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That is what I'm talking about ....right there. If you are not smart enough to think about shutting off the car or at least putting it in neutral then I'm very sorry, we don't need your genes for our continued success as a species.
 
Unexplained acceleration??

I have the explanation. Stupidity. What's to explain?????

When I was 17, I floored (for what it was worth) my VW Super Beetle. Pedal stuck to the floor, zoooooom. I was in a crowd of people leaving a movie. Turned off the ignition switch. Problem solved. Not rocket science if a punk 17yr old can figure it out in 2-3 seconds.
 
Interesting article in this weeks Automotive News with a Toyo exec stating they are losing more money on the increase yen value then they will on the recall.
 
gismo said:
Aren't these the same folk who fanned a smoldering dung heap into Audi's near bankruptcy many years ago on a similar issue even though it was clear from the evidence that the real problem was the drivers pushing on the gas instead of the brake. That one precipitated the brake/transmission interlock which did eliminate a fair amount of darwinistic behavior.

Really though, I suggest that anyone concerned about this (including the CR guys) just pick a safe open road and see what happens when you push both the gas and the brake to the floor at 60 mph.
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FWIW:

http://freep.com/article/20091221/BUSINESS01/91220036/1332/business01/Toyotas-reputation-needs-some-TLC page 4

The power brake system requires 150 pounds of pressure on the pedal, instead of the normal 30 pounds, to stop the car at high speed with the throttle open.
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:dunno:
 
tonycondon said:
probably because there is not as much mental aptitude or systems knowledge required to drive a car as there is to fly an airplane?
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Flying an airplane is easy, t.o's and landings a little tougher.
All the rest of the communications, navigating, weather is the tough stuff.
Just think what fun the roads would be if you needed all that knowledge to drive a car. Of course I've seen some people that can't back out of their garage without a mishap:rolleyes:
The roads would be safer if cars used the "sterile cockpit concept" and people shut off their cell phones:nono:
 
It is intersting to watch the automotive market react to the Toyota recall. This is turning into a much bigger recall / deal that I was aware of.

I wonder how Toyota will respond to get buyers back into the show rooms. Maybe a good time to buy in a few weeks!

Hmmmmm.

What say you?
 
Shut off the ignition.
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I agree, seems pretty easy to fix the immediate problem - change to neutral/brakes/key off....but that last one...
I wonder why we haven't heard of someone turning the key all the way off and locking the steering wheel?
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
I wonder why we haven't heard of someone turning the key all the way off and locking the steering wheel?
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Most, if not all, recent cars with automatics won't let you turn the key all the way off unless the gear selector is in park.


Trapper John
 
well dang you are right, (I had to run out and test my Toy pu) - I remembered doing that on vehicles I'd had in the past!
 
I heard the 911 call from one of the accidents, the one where the car went through a T intersection and off into a field and burned. I couldn't help but wonder why it never dawned on the driver to turn the key off or throw the tranny into reverse. Why would you just sit there and let it happen?
 
EppyGA said:
I heard the 911 call from one of the accidents, the one where the car went through a T intersection and off into a field and burned. I couldn't help but wonder why it never dawned on the driver to turn the key off or throw the tranny into reverse. Why would you just sit there and let it happen?
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Unlike pilots, drivers aren't trained to handle emergency situations and panic is a difficult emotion to override.
 
EppyGA said:
I heard the 911 call from one of the accidents, the one where the car went through a T intersection and off into a field and burned. I couldn't help but wonder why it never dawned on the driver to turn the key off or throw the tranny into reverse. Why would you just sit there and let it happen?
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kevin47881 said:
Unlike pilots, drivers aren't trained to handle emergency situations and panic is a difficult emotion to override.
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Unfortunately, the driver of the car in question was a state trooper, qualified for high speed driving.

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/159766/article.html
 
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EppyGA said:
I heard the 911 call from one of the accidents, the one where the car went through a T intersection and off into a field and burned. I couldn't help but wonder why it never dawned on the driver to turn the key off or throw the tranny into reverse. Why would you just sit there and let it happen?
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It has been discussed many times. Who knows. It wasnt' a standard key based ignition. It was one of those push button start systems. You had to hold the button for 3 seconds to make it turn off. Perhaps with all the pressure of flying down teh road through traffic he never held it for the full 3 seconds.

As far as putting it into neutral? I don't know the vehicle or the systems so I'm not going to judge.
 
Geico266 said:
Unfortunately, the driver of the car in question was a state trooper, qualified for high speed driving.

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/159766/article.html
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That is a serious flaw in the way we teach people to drive here. I thought I was a pretty good driver until I went for my EMS driver training back in the 1980's. Then I took CDL training and really learned a few things. Physics mainly, but it's surprising how much understanding things like momentum and inertia helps make you a better driver.

-Rich
 
With all increasing amount of nanny systems on cars, drivers are getting stupider, not safer. A woman my wife works with didn't know cars had headlight switches. She thought they were all automatic like hers.
 
How long before the government mandates a rev limiter if you get over 85 MPH?
 
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