Thinking about a dual sport/adventure Motorcycle

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by Ted, Jun 7, 2021.

  1. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    What a cute little timing belt. Easy to change, too. Timing marks lined up perfectly, so no concerns there. The old belt was definitely ready to be replaced.

    54DFDA57-70F5-4F08-9D5C-8ADCB90A67D7.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2022
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  2. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Obviously not designed by Germans...
     
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  3. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    No, this engine is absolutely not a German design. If you compare it o the R1150GS sitting not far from it, they are very different. However, it's a very purposeful engine design and I really like it. It's clear that a lot of thought went into the design decisions. The timing belt reduces weight and size vs. a chain, and the camshaft is purposely sat up high so the pushrods can be very short to help with high RPM (8500 redline as I recall). Solid lifters (of course).

    Maybe the most interesting setup is the cylinders. They're intentionally offset so the rear cylinder actually gets cooling, a common problem with V-twins. And a 6-speed transmission.
     
  4. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Maybe the most interesting setup is the cylinders. They're intentionally offset so the rear cylinder actually gets cooling, a common problem with V-twins. And a 6-speed transmission.[/QUOTE]

    Then I would assume the rods don't share a common crank pin then? Is it a 60* or 90* twin?
     
  5. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    I've been thinking more about the brakes for this thing. I'm wondering if, since it's missing... basically everything... if I wouldn't be smarter to just get a parts bike (not a Morini, generic Japanese/whatever) thing and adapt brakes from it, at least as far as calipers/rotors and use the brake master cylinder and controls. Need to think about it more.
     
  6. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    It's a 72 degree V-twin. They share a common crank journal, but the rods are intentionally next to eachother with the rod shaft being moved as far outward as possible. This article has a picture and other details on the engine history:

    https://www.cycleworld.com/story/bikes/moto-morini/
     
  7. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Interesting engine and nice bike, should be a lot of fun once you get it going!
     
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  8. charheep

    charheep Cleared for Takeoff PoA Supporter

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    Getting it going sounds like the easy part, getting it stopped on the other hand..
     
  9. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Challenges with brakes? That's never stopped me before.
     
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  10. wrbix

    wrbix Pattern Altitude

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    Last edited: Jan 7, 2022
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  11. wrbix

    wrbix Pattern Altitude

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    T-Dubs rock! I do not consider it a limitation- just good sense

    (BTW - tell me about that tank bag -seems a perfect fit)
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2022
  12. Albany Tom

    Albany Tom Pattern Altitude

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    So once you get the RV and the bike all sorted out, I'm going to suggest "submarine" as your next project. Maybe from scratch this time.
     
  13. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Nah, but we do want a boat someday. So you’re not far off. :)
     
  14. FormerHangie

    FormerHangie En-Route

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    Back in the late 60's I had a Briggs powered minibike that had mechanical brakes that didn't work all that well. At one point they stopped working altogether, and I started stopping Fred Flintstone style. The problem with that was I didn't much mileage out of a pair of shoes. Not brake shoes, PF Flyers. I got two pair at the beginning of the school year and wore the first pair out in a week. After that, my dad got rid of the minibike.

    I'm a little jealous of all of you who got something like a Honda Trail 70, but then there were lots of kids who had no minibike at all.
     
  15. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Growing up in the concrete jungle of New York City, I was in the "kids who had no minibike at all" category. Not that my mom would've allowed it even if we'd not lived where we did.

    I'm just making up for those first 18 years or so.
     
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  16. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    After doing some more thinking and looking, I've decided that what's probably the most logical thing to do is adapt brakes from something more readily available. After doing a little cursory looking, I found that the a Kawasaki Ninja 250R has similar weight, about the same rotor size (same rotor size for the 88-07 models, in 2008-12 they went to 30mm larger fronts and 10mm smaller rears - go figure). Oh, and a lot of people wreck the things apparently so parts are available cheap on eBay from everywhere, including lots of assemblies where the master cylinder, caliper, and hose are all there (I expect I'll need to have new hoses made for the correct length). The 250R also has the same 7/8" standard bar size (like virtually every other non-Harley out there), so that should bolt up easily there. Really what I'll need to fabricate will be caliper mounting brackets to get them fitting right, and that shouldn't be too difficult to do.

    Like I said, brakes have never stopped me before. :D

    I'm also looking at the electrical system on this thing. Like much of the rest of the bike, it's a unique design that I think was based largely on limitations of what existed in those days, and trying to minimize weight. The alternator is a 6V/12V setup. 12V goes to the ignition system, and the alternator is the sole source of power to the ignition. The rest of the bike gets 6V (battery is 6V). The systems are separate once they leave the alternator.

    Some people complain about this setup, but looking at it it would be fairly easy to convert to a dedicated 12V system if I so chose, which might make starting easier as well (having not started this at all, I have no idea how easy or hard it is to start). But seeing how this is all put together, I think I could make that work fairly easily if needed and basically just change out bulbs since that the electrical system outside of the ignition is nothing but bulbs and indicator lights. Even the tach and speedo are mechanical.

    The oil filter on it is really a screen that you clean out, but the gasket is something that may need to get replaced (although it is reusable). So I'll probably drain the oil, pull the filter, and see how that all looks. Do the valve lash, find a new air filter (just find something universal which should be easy enough to do), test the ignition system to make sure it seems to be working, see if I can get a burble on starter fluid, and then work on the carbs and put it all together. Oh, and clean/seal the tank.

    The ignition boxes (as well as the alternator) say Ducati on them. But the ground wires for those boxes are both corroded and the insulation is falling off. They also are not replaceable, the boxes are sealed. So we'll see about those, if there are ignition issues, I'll bet that's where they come from.
     
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  17. Cruzinchris

    Cruzinchris Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I've owned dozens of bikes. The Honda ST-1300 is best!
     
  18. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    It made noise! Little starter fluid and checking ignition and it coughed quite well. Tach works for sure. All engine checks so far have been perfect. So waiting on the carb kits, cleaning the tank, and the brake parts. I’ll get it running and do some more tests once I have the carb and fuel tank bits in, and can then put the brakes on when they show up.
     
  19. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    It was a nice day yesterday, and I haven't ridden in over a month (I think), so I took the R1150GS out for some riding on the back/gravel roads over lunch. It was nice to get back out on the bike, and where I live there really are a lot of fun back roads to explore.

    I'm debating whether I want to try to put some different tires on it. Right now it has Metzler tires on it which are 80/20s (80% on road, 20% off road). While that's a lot better on gravel than, say, the dedicated street tires on our Harleys or the Triumph, I feel like on gravel they aren't doing what they could. And really, that's the point of the bike as I'm riding it. Plus, these tires have 2013 date codes, so they are older and less than ideal.

    I've found a good price on some 20/80s (20% on road, 80% off road) knobby tires that are rated well, and am thinking I may throw those on to see the difference if nothing else. But, once I get the Morini going and I start riding it, there's the question of whether or not I'd want to actually ride the BMW anymore, or if I'll return it to my friend. It's hard to predict at this point.
     
  20. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    @Rgbeard talked me into buying tires for the BMW, pointing out that it actually works and the Morini is likely to... need more maintenance. Thanks for the reality check, Rusty. So, tires on the way.

    Meanwhile, I looked at the Dellorto carbs for the Morini. They're very simple, but they definitely needed to get cleaned and gone through. The seals were all brittle and falling apart. One carb was definitely worse than the other one. None of that's surprising, and really it was better than I figured it would be.

    The POR 15 tank coating I'm putting on says that it needs 96 hours to dry. Hopefully tomorrow I can get it set up and ready to start drying. I think I'm going to look for new petcocks for it since I have to wait a few days anyway and don't have brakes yet. But the new tires should show up tomorrow (one tube showed up today, second one tomorrow) so I can get those put on. Which I suppose if I was smarter I would've waited on, but I'm convinced enough that the thing will run and ride (or that I'm stubborn enough that I'll make it so) and these parts are cheap enough that I don't mind getting them in.
     
  21. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Morini tires arrived today, with an on-road rating of F-

    upload_2022-1-12_13-29-15.png
     
  22. TCABM

    TCABM En-Route

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    Send ‘em back, look for something like a Dunlop K180.
     
  23. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Dunlop 606 is a good tire as well.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2022
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  24. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Also could do Continental TKC 70 Rocks, a nice 70/30 tire:

    [​IMG]
    Or the TKC80 80/20:

    [​IMG]
     
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  25. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    I actually purposely picked out these tires for the Morini. I wanted something very aggressive and polarized to see what I think of it. I don't anticipate riding this bike on pavement much, other than to get to other dirt roads. And if I don't like them, I've learned something.
     
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  26. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    What tires are those?

    The Dunlop D606 are a VERY well respected 90% dirt 10% road tire that are durable enough to get you to the dirt roads yet provide outstanding offroad traction.
     
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  27. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Those in the picture Michelin StarCross 5 tires. I ordered Mitas E09 Dakar tires for the BMW. In both cases, very high rated tires for off road with those vehicles (the Mitas tires being 20/80s - 20% on road 80% dirt - and about as much biased as you can get in an adventure bike).

    The Morini has more limitations in terms of what you can get, and that D606 isn't available in the sizes for it, at least if I'm sticking with stock sizes.
     
  28. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Be careful if you ride the Mitas Dakar versions in the rain (on pavement), the reports are they're pretty slick compared to the non-Dakar versions.
     
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  29. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    That's good to know, thanks. These days I really don't ride in the rain intentionally.
     
  30. Oldmanb777

    Oldmanb777 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I hate spooning on the D-606's they are so stiff. But i use them on my DRZ400 and they are a rugged tire. I don't get the mileage out of them i got with the MT-21, but they work well. I hated the TKC-70's on the WeeStrom. TKC-80 were great, just didn't last long. I ran a set of Mitas on the Africa Twin and liked them. Currently running Mefo explorers on the Africa twin. I really like them and it needs new shoes, so I will put another set on this spring. I wore out several sets of Shinko's on the WeeStrom and was surprised how well they did. and they are very cheap to buy.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2022
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  31. topgun260

    topgun260 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Have you looked at the Yamaha Ténéré 700? At the very least you need to watch these videos to see how Pol Tarres (hardcore trials and enduro competitor) rides this thing. This guy rides the Ténéré 700 in places I would have to be careful walking.


    But your Italian bike looks like fun too!
     
  32. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Good info. I'll be curious to see how these tires I've ordered for both the bikes work out. Of course with the Morini I have no baseline, but with the BMW I know how it performs with the Metzler 80/20s.

    It seems I've not read anything bad about the TKC-80s other than mileage, sort of a gold standard compromise tire. I'd considered those, but figured I'd go with the all out dirt tires given my intended use of the bike, and they were cheaper.

    The T700 came up in recommendations from some, and I know that it (deservedly) has a good reputation. It's not something that (at this point) I've particularly considered. I'll see what I think after this latest round of work.
     
  33. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Got the front tire on, but pinched the rear tube so I’ll need another one of those. Grr. Happy with how these look though:

    AF905311-4E0A-49AD-AC60-D867D1A4D756.jpeg

    The rear tire has a rubber coupler between the wheel and the rear sprocket, which seems silly.

    854295B2-6055-4347-BF1A-0EBFADD86634.jpeg
     
  34. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Not silly. Cush drive, keeps you from fragging the transmission on pavement.
     
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  35. MonkeyClaw

    MonkeyClaw Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Yeah, the cush drive helps keep down the chatter on pavement.
     
  36. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    It probably does help, just not something I’d seen before.
     
  37. Oldmanb777

    Oldmanb777 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    The cush drive keeps you from destroying spokes on bigger thumpers. My DRZ400 doesn;t have cush drive. It destroys spokes.
     
  38. Ted

    Ted The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted

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    Ahh, that makes sense.
     
  39. Bill

    Bill Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    And it's not just used on dirt bikes, every Honda sportbike I owned (even the multis) had cush drive. It just helps absorb driveline shocks.
     
  40. mondtster

    mondtster En-Route

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    They are far more common on street bikes than dirt bikes for that reason.

    The DRZ doesn’t have one because it started off as a dirt bike.