Summer Trip

jangell said:
The Dutchess I flew I cut the power over the threshold like anything else I've ever flown and then flared and held the nose off.
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Well if you fly a Baron like you describe, you're in for a rude surprise. Barons unload REALLY quickly without hardly a shudder. As wing loading increases in design, the frequency of "do not stall this aircraft" placards increase.

So you fly them on. Literally. Everyone who has transitioned in the Seneca has initially flared, too high; I have to add power and go around. The one time I didn't I had to have the plane inspected because of the severity of the "thump".

Every design is different... :-0
 
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Great explaination Bruce.

Yes, Jesse, I initially tried to round out the P-Baron like the A-36 I have so much time in. It can be done if you come in fast, but it's not the same. The B-55 Baron was more like the A-36. The P-Baron is heavier and has higher wing loading as Bruce stated. I can pull the yoke all the way back at round out before touching and that front wheel still doesn't hit much after the mains. It can be done if you really need to come in on a short field, but it's not the norm. Coming is with a little power and cutting it back as you round out is more the norm. If you raise the nose, chop the power and expect to float, you may have a rude, expensive awakening coming! I'm at 90 to 100 knots over the fence and about 80 at round out. It unloads real quickly, as Bruce said. You want to be VERY close to the ground when the stall warning comes on if you're going to stall it on. Normally, I do just that. Hold it just off the runway 'til I get a stall warning and let it run on. But with passengers and a long runway, sometime I'll just put it on with a little power. Seems that's all the passengers go by, how smoothly one lands. Not like the A-36 where the mains would touch and I could keep the nose off for a couple seconds.

Best,

Dave
 
jangell said:
Here are a few videos I have of me landing
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Nice landing Jesse. I wish my taildragger landings in my videos looked that good. :)
 
jangell said:
I don't know much about twins. Have very little experiance with them.. But.

It looked to me like there was basically no flare and the nose and the mains touched down at almost the same time.

The Dutchess I flew I cut the power over the threshold like anything else I've ever flown and then flared and held the nose off.

Not saying that was a bad landing, like I said I have *very* little experiance with twins.
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Twins do tend to land in a flatter attitude for a couple reasons.

One is that when you pull the throttles to idle you kill a lot of lift due to the disturbed airflow over the wings. This means touching down at a lower AOA than a single unless you leave some power in. And leaving power in until touchdown in a twin can eat a lot of runway because there's a lot of residual thrust at landing speeds with just a little bit of power. This is why the standard method for landing a twin is to establish the proper attitude (slightly nose high) and "wipe out" the power when your main wheels are within 5-10 inches of the runway.

Another somewhat related reason is that twins usually have fairly high wing loading and that means that you can get into a relatively high sink rate at a high AOA. This can lead to rather "firm" touchdowns if it happens more than a few inches above the runway so full stall landings are generally avoided. Additionally, a twin is very vulnerable to loss of directional control if an engine quits near touchdown speeds before the nosewheel is on the ground so getting all three planted quickly decreases the window of vulnerability.

That's not to say that a twin should be landed completely flat (all three touch at once). The correct technique is to land on the mains in a slightly nose high attitude and then lower the nose to dump lift and improve directional control.
 
Diana said:
Nice landing Jesse. I wish my taildragger landings in my videos looked that good. :)
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Thanks
 
jangell said:
Here are a few videos I have of me landing:

http://korrupt.com/video/landingtailwheel.wmv
This is me landing a PA-12 Super Cruiser
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Hey Jesse, I didn't realize you were so close until I read the title in this video which said you were landing at Stanton International. That's where I learned to fly and two gliders. It's probably also the first place I ever tried to land a taildragger, but I don't think my first few attempts were as nice as yours.

We should get together some day, I'm based out of Flying Cloud on the SW corner of Minneapolis.
 
lancefisher said:
Hey Jesse, I didn't realize you were so close until I read the title in this video which said you were landing at Stanton International. That's where I learned to fly and two gliders. It's probably also the first place I ever tried to land a taildragger, but I don't think my first few attempts were as nice as yours.

We should get together some day, I'm based out of Flying Cloud on the SW corner of Minneapolis.
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I sent you a PM.
 
Nice landing, Dave. I love watching videos of landings.
 
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