iflyvfr
Pattern Altitude
Good point, but I have to think having both warm oil and the other would be the best of both worlds. That and maybe a way to keep the battery warmed up.
Suggestions for a Poor Man's Engine Pre-Heater
- Thread starter JoseCuervo
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Figured that's why there's three bars on every corner.There's a reason Wisconsin is the #1 consumer of brandy, per capita.
Any comments on using a dipstick heater?
It would only be plugged in the night before a flight, and would not be left on indefinitely.
Last I checked, there were warnings about using the heaters in plastic dipstick tubes. Before anyone considers using one of these on a Lycoming, remember that many of the tubes are plastic.
As far as the Continental O-470 in a 182 goes, if memory serves me correctly there is a rubber connector on the dipstick tube. I'm not sure that I'd want to use one of these on a dipstick tube with the connector in it. Yours may be different, check it and see what it looks like.
For your situation, the easiest and simplest option is probably the trouble light and blanket option. Longer term I'd probably suggest an oil pan heater at minimum so you don't get yourself in a situation like this again though.
James331
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If you're living somewhere warm enough to get away with running single weight you don't need to be preheating anyways.
cessna182b
Line Up and Wait
Get a Cube heater (ceramic), a flexible dryer duct and a duct periscope adapter. Obtain the flange from the latter by suitable means (tinsnips?), and duct tape to heater exhaust. Run the flex duct between the adapter flange and open cowling vent (I fabricated a hook from safety wire to keep it in place). Half an hour of heat makes starting much easier - more would be better. Doesn't work very well outside in the wind (too much heat loss), but is fine in a hangar.
Dave
JoseCuervo
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tawood
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Sorry in advance for taking the post on a tangent, but how about an outdoor/no electricity heater?
I sometimes, in the winter, fly to my parents, who live in northern Michigan. There are several sparse airports near them, all of which plow snow, but none of which provide exterior electricity....I've tried to think of ways to preheat but never have come up with a decent system.
I sometimes, in the winter, fly to my parents, who live in northern Michigan. There are several sparse airports near them, all of which plow snow, but none of which provide exterior electricity....I've tried to think of ways to preheat but never have come up with a decent system.
RV10flyer
Pattern Altitude
If you have extra load carrying ability...
1. Take a big battery and a 12 volt heater.
2. Hook your 12 volt heater up to the fbo car battery.
Not cheap but can hook some SCAT tubing up and it puts out 5X your normal 120 v cube heater...
http://m.summitracing.com/parts/mar-mm-a1090002?seid=srese1&gclid=COLcuuSMhMoCFQsjHwod7bYL8g
weirdjim
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weirdjim
That is a problem solvable with 2" of jumper wire and two solder joints. THen take a permanent sharpie and write "Not for use on humans" on the pad.
Jim
There are a few videos on Youtube describing home-made pre-heaters using a simple camp stove and a piece of dryer vent tube or scat tube. See one here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWG4VlHiF5g
All of them seem to use a fairly expensive camp stove. I bet you could do just as well with a much less expensive one like this:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...24761&ref_=sr_1_5&s=outdoor-recreation&sr=1-5
Will require some trial and error to determine proper flame size. You could do that safely away from the plane by feeling the temperature of the air leaving the duct. Remember to do it when the outside temperature is similarly low as it would be at the airplane. Also, still need some insulation around the cowl (blanket).
A "blow hot air" (or worse combustion products) heater is problematic mostly in that it usually isn't run long enough to really do any good. For a low BTU (there's no bacon in it) heater, it takes several hours. A high BTU heater generates some dangerous hot spots trying to make effective warmth.
The one I saw was run on moderate flame intensity (low enough that a hand could comfortably be placed in the hot air stream at its exit, so no dangerous hot spots) for 30 minutes through the cowl flap below an O-360 and exiting out the cowl inlets. Other cowl flap was plugged. Cowl wrapped with a blanket.
It warmed the CHT's from 25F to 43-48F depending upon the cylinder. Oil temperature was also in the mid 40's, but that really only represents the sensor position and not necessarily the oil in the sump. But since the oil sump is in the most direct line of the warm air, I would guess that it was no worse than the cylinder heads. Interesting thing was that at the end of the 30 minutes there was no condensation under the cowl. Probably was some there initially, though.
So 30 minutes for a 20F temperature rise without hot spots. Would an hour give a 30F rise? Don't know. Wouldn't seem useful at -10F. But seems capable of casual preheating of airplanes without access to electricity in temperatures down to about 20 or maybe even 15F.
Nice thing about the heat blowers, you can preheat the cockpit so its not so cold when you first sit down. Is there some law against having a heater fan in a small airplane? There must be, because almost none of them have one. Maybe it takes a special permit or something. Aircraft heaters have plenty of heat, the problem is getting it to the cockpit.
timwinters
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Good, bad or indifferent, I've used this set up for many years on my 182 and now use it on the diamond I'm flying. 30 minutes while I'm preflighing does wonders.
kyleb
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Drake the Outlaw
When I don't have time for an overnight preheat with the Reiff, I get respectable results from a Reiff hotstrip + two blowdriers stuck in foam plugs and inserted into the air inlets. 20-30 minutes of that treatment all of the engine temps come up substantially. Aluminum is a heck of a heat conductor.
DutchessFlier
Line Up and Wait
In addition to an oil pan heater (which I have installed and it works really well) what do you do to warm up the avionics in the cabin before starting them up? The cold soaking is hell on gyros. I put a small ceramic cube heater in the cabin, on the floor facing toward the panel, that goes on an hour or so before startup. You might also consider that. My plane is outside on a tiedown all winter.
if you do not want to continuously heat the engine while you are away, and want to warm it an hour or so before take off, buy an inexpensive blower hair dryer. cover the cowling and intakes and let the dryer run for around 45 minutes at the air intakes. You will be surprised how it will warm things up to around 50-55 degrees. The downside to the oil pan heaters is that they heat only the oil at a local spot and do not heat the engine. I have seen another adaptation where a dryer exhaust metal flex tubing was used and the owner used a heat gun blowing the air up under the cowling.
murphey
Touchdown! Greaser!
I have a small ceramic heater that's on the floor on the left side. When I arrive at the airport, I turn it on while I'm preflighting, etc. That 20-30 min is all it takes to warm the instruments and cabin. Unplug it, put in the baggage comparment, and go.
Other than the oil pan engine heater, I never leave anything powered on when I'm not there (other than the dorm refrigerator in the summer to keep food & drinks cold).
steingar
Taxi to Parking
I chuck an electric space heater into the cockpit while I preflight. Warms things up nice and toasty.
painless
Line Up and Wait
This what I do, but with a twist. I connect the heater to a thermostat that is used for water pipe heaters and stick that through the air intake, setting it on top of the engine. Keeps the entire firewall forward at 40+ degrees all winter. Runs the heater for about 1-2 min 2 or 3x per hour outside temp dependent.
cessna182b
Line Up and Wait
Hello: I attempted to send photos of my ceramic cube heater - but can't seem to do so. Dunno why - the "Manage Attachments" function just isn't there.
I have done that in the past, but have no idea why I can't do it now.
Give me a private email address and I will send them directly.
Dave
I have done that in the past, but have no idea why I can't do it now.
Give me a private email address and I will send them directly.
Dave
JoseCuervo
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Bought a "milk barn heater" from Lowes for $20.
A couple of floor register ducts and some 4" x 8' flexible metal ducts.
Sheet metal screwed the register ducts to the sheet metal on the heater.
Then 3m metal foil taped the joints and gaps.
Did this on both sides of the heater for intake and output.
Put both flex ducts into the front of the cowl.
Plugged in and heat started flowing. Now need to run for an hour and see how it works.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
A couple of floor register ducts and some 4" x 8' flexible metal ducts.
Sheet metal screwed the register ducts to the sheet metal on the heater.
Then 3m metal foil taped the joints and gaps.
Did this on both sides of the heater for intake and output.
Put both flex ducts into the front of the cowl.
Plugged in and heat started flowing. Now need to run for an hour and see how it works.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
steingar
Taxi to Parking
We used to use two of those on the Free Bird, just stuck them underneath the engine cowling and ran them to warm up the engine. Worked so well we wound up putting a Tanis system on the aircraft.
rwellner98
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rw2
The risk seems more acute when you've witnessed your dad burning his car to the ground with this technique. I wouldn't recommend it.
Checkout_my_Six
Touchdown! Greaser!
Good, bad or indifferent, I've used this set up for many years on my 182 and now use it on the diamond I'm flying. 30 minutes while I'm preflighing does wonders.
Yup mine looks kinda like that. Used that for years till I got the bonanza. It has a pad heater that heats the whole engine when plugged in over night
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timwinters
Ejection Handle Pulled
I think I'm going to stick a pad to the bottom of the oil pan when the new engine goes in later this month.
I'm currently in a heated hangar but one never knows what the future will bring.
Checkout_my_Six
Touchdown! Greaser!
I cover the cowling with a couple of moving quilts. By morning it's warm and toasty inside....even with freezing temps outside. I thought of adding an additional pad heater for the battery....but, so far I don't seem to need that.
cessna182b
Line Up and Wait
Hello Again:
I finally got my attachment problem resolved. Don't know for sure what caused it, but it's over!
I should probably put this stuff up for sale - since I am no longer using it. Primary reason - it doesn't freeze where I am now. Nor is there any electricity in the hangar I am using.
I chose to use the "dryer vent periscope" because it provides you with an attachment flange, and is the right size and shape to fit a cube heater. When you disassemble it you wind up with two such flanges - and I did have two heaters (the second one has been returned to domestic duties, so is not shown). My way of doing it was to put the vent hoses into the open cowl flaps. Didn't use any blankets or other stuff.
It worked very well for me.
Dave
I finally got my attachment problem resolved. Don't know for sure what caused it, but it's over!
I should probably put this stuff up for sale - since I am no longer using it. Primary reason - it doesn't freeze where I am now. Nor is there any electricity in the hangar I am using.
I chose to use the "dryer vent periscope" because it provides you with an attachment flange, and is the right size and shape to fit a cube heater. When you disassemble it you wind up with two such flanges - and I did have two heaters (the second one has been returned to domestic duties, so is not shown). My way of doing it was to put the vent hoses into the open cowl flaps. Didn't use any blankets or other stuff.
It worked very well for me.
Dave
Attachments
Ouch. What's the rest of the breather tube story? I had my Tannis plugged in today (full system - top and bottom) and didn't end up flying due to lake effect snow moving in. There was a bit of a water puddle under the engine breather/vent tube (Cont. 0-300D). I had some concern as there was a bit of ice forming inside the tube due to OAT around 16* F. I found this post looking at old heater conversations.....I wouldn't worry about it unless it's under 20f.
If you do need to preheat do what the others said, also be sure to keep that battery and gyros warm (little safety space heater will work wonders).
Cheap engine preheater setup
Watch out for frost.
Make sure your crank case breather tube has a few holes / slits in it to prevent this.
James331
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Breather tube should have what I believe is called a whistle hole up above the exit, that way if the tube freezes up it still got a non destructive way to vent the pressure.
Ofcourse always check your breathers as part of your winter preflight, and breaks also can freeze up if you drag them a lot in snowy conditions.
Id also look into a winterazation kit, or diagonal aluminum tape for the oil cooler if it's really cold out.
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James331
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No worries, cold weather flying is its own thing lol
Is also read around here about cold starts, not letting your oil pressure get over 100psi, don't go over 1000rpm till you get 200cht, split weight oil, pre heat under 20f, cowl tents, etc
Some prep work, but the thick air and more limited traffic are a great reward.
Where are you flying?
I'm in SW lower Michigan near AZO. We're in a known snow belt here where the weather changes on a moments notice. We will be leaving teens last week to 40's by Tuesday. 20-30 miles east, they often have blue sky while we're having a blizzard or tornado. The cool thing is it does the changey thing all year.
A lot of the winter info was included in my initial training, but there are of course a lot of detail items to learn yet. I'm currently reading "Fly the Engine" by Kas Thomas and looking for other good reads.
I do love the winter performance difference.
A lot of the winter info was included in my initial training, but there are of course a lot of detail items to learn yet. I'm currently reading "Fly the Engine" by Kas Thomas and looking for other good reads.
I do love the winter performance difference.
German guy
Cleared for Takeoff
+1 Cheap, easy to install and makes the engine toasty.
Let'sgoflying!
Touchdown! Greaser!
Cheap? That's like three digits! I thought he said, PoorMan's?
Kidding, they look cool.
PS here is an updated link, that one 404'd on me.
http://e-zheat.com/order-yours/
Checkout_my_Six
Touchdown! Greaser!
mine has the 300W oil sump heater.....and it's wonderful.
Attachments
Let'sgoflying!
Touchdown! Greaser!
We had 18°F on a flying day for me this week, I put my 10" box fan/heater under the cowl blowing onto the oil sump, and thick blankets on top of the cowl. ~90mins later the JPI said all temps 80-90°F!
Other tricks include an electric battery blanket, running the battery maintainer a few hours before dep time.
I do not miss keeping the battery and drained oil by the furnace at home before flights, the &@# frosted plugs, the homemade propane ignition-wire-melting undercowl heater, the tires buried in 3" of ice, the snow-encrusted top surfaces, the foam seats as hard & cold as ice blocks, the agonizing scream of gyros starting up, having to breathe into your jacket to keep the windows from frosting over; yay, Texas!
Other tricks include an electric battery blanket, running the battery maintainer a few hours before dep time.
I do not miss keeping the battery and drained oil by the furnace at home before flights, the &@# frosted plugs, the homemade propane ignition-wire-melting undercowl heater, the tires buried in 3" of ice, the snow-encrusted top surfaces, the foam seats as hard & cold as ice blocks, the agonizing scream of gyros starting up, having to breathe into your jacket to keep the windows from frosting over; yay, Texas!
nrpetersen
Line Up and Wait
Or come to Shell Lake in NW Wisconsin (KSSQ). We have a 50 ft cord etc on its own 15A 115 VAC circuit available on our ramp. Why don't more airports do this?